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Old 01-09-2013, 09:39 PM   #41
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If I was able to retire in my 30's I would rather take the chance that I might have to go back to work than the chance that I worked more years that I didn't need to.
I know a lot of young people. And this is the advice I give out to those like our OP. I am beginning to think I should take my own counsel.
There are worse things than having to find another job after you've had some good time off.
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:08 PM   #42
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I'm sorry. I am looking forward to FIRE as much as the next person; but I cannot tolerate those that don't feel they need to work hard to get their compensation. Twelve on twelve is a tough work schedule; 40 hours a week is not even a quarter of a week. I believe in work hard play hard. I take my two three week vacations a year but give far more than 40 hours a week when I am working.

Years back, a number of us were comiserating about a long source selection. We thought how nice it would be to be a ditch digger wherein we drop our shovel at the end of the day and pick it up in the same location the next day. But we realized then, and I definitely realize now, that our compensation is partly based on these additional hours, worries, and stress of our jobs; ditch digging does not pay well.

I worked in France for a while where the work week is a lot shorter; that is fine for them. But, the productivity was not there. You can't get anywhere without working for it.

I hope to have $4M to $5M when I retire in a few years. I will have worked hard for that money. And, I will enjoy spending it immensely (just as I enjoy those two three week vacations each year as I am working).

marc
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:59 PM   #43
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Planning for retirement while you are young is great but you are going to have to w*rk for a long time to achieve it. I think you need to find a job that motivates you to come to w*rk. Just liking your job is not doing it for you. Find something that is meaningful to you; or with people you like; or the flexibility you need; or hours that are better for you. Do you have hobbies or interests that can turn into paying w*rk or will give you a clue as to something else you would like to do?

Perhaps a shorter commute to/from the office may also help. See OP another thread at: Too cheap to buy a new house?.
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Old 01-09-2013, 11:04 PM   #44
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I'm sorry. I am looking forward to FIRE as much as the next person; but I cannot tolerate those that don't feel they need to work hard to get their compensation. Twelve on twelve is a tough work schedule; 40 hours a week is not even a quarter of a week. I believe in work hard play hard. I take my two three week vacations a year but give far more than 40 hours a week when I am working.

Years back, a number of us were comiserating about a long source selection. We thought how nice it would be to be a ditch digger wherein we drop our shovel at the end of the day and pick it up in the same location the next day. But we realized then, and I definitely realize now, that our compensation is partly based on these additional hours, worries, and stress of our jobs; ditch digging does not pay well.

I worked in France for a while where the work week is a lot shorter; that is fine for them. But, the productivity was not there. You can't get anywhere without working for it.

I hope to have $4M to $5M when I retire in a few years. I will have worked hard for that money. And, I will enjoy spending it immensely (just as I enjoy those two three week vacations each year as I am working).

marc

I dont understand your rant, as you seem to have confused needs and wants. The OP isnt saying he doesnt feel the need to work hard, in fact FI is a huge goal of his through WORK. He is just saying that 40 hours a week sucks, and he wants out. And the OP doesnt need 4-5mm to retire. None of us really "need" that much if you think about it.
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Old 01-09-2013, 11:09 PM   #45
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I'm sorry. I am looking forward to FIRE as much as the next person; but I cannot tolerate those that don't feel they need to work hard to get their compensation. Twelve on twelve is a tough work schedule; 40 hours a week is not even a quarter of a week. I believe in work hard play hard. I take my two three week vacations a year but give far more than 40 hours a week when I am working.

Years back, a number of us were comiserating about a long source selection. We thought how nice it would be to be a ditch digger wherein we drop our shovel at the end of the day and pick it up in the same location the next day. But we realized then, and I definitely realize now, that our compensation is partly based on these additional hours, worries, and stress of our jobs; ditch digging does not pay well.

I worked in France for a while where the work week is a lot shorter; that is fine for them. But, the productivity was not there. You can't get anywhere without working for it.

I hope to have $4M to $5M when I retire in a few years. I will have worked hard for that money. And, I will enjoy spending it immensely (just as I enjoy those two three week vacations each year as I am working).

marc
I sincerely hope you live long enough to enjoy it. For others, 'digging ditches' affords a less stressful lifestyle they can enjoy now. A simpler less stressful lifestyle doesn't require $4-5M. Horses for courses.
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40 hours a week?
Old 01-09-2013, 11:43 PM   #46
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40 hours a week?

I had to smile at your comment about spending too much time at work.
When I was working full time at my teaching job and pursuing my masters degree at the same time, I was working downstairs on my computer and my son who was in first year university was working on his.
He turned to me and said he was thinking of not going to university anymore.
Knowing that university is not cut out for all people, I asked him what he found difficult about university and he said he hated working 40 hours a week.
I laughed at him and said "Son, you are over 18. You can work 40 hour weeks at a job, university or perhaps a tech school. Whatever you choose, you will work 40 hour weeks at least. You are an adult and welcome to the adult world." I was putting in 70-80 hour weeks by then and basically told him the truth as I knew it.
I know the people I work with put in many more hours than 40 IF they want to work more than entry level. I live in Alberta and I think that is the norm here. Not sure about other provinces. I hear Vancouver has a different mindset about work
PS. I have gone part time (.57) at work and my work week hours number around 40. However, I am well paid, have a pension and a benefit package. I accept the tradeoff.
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Old 01-10-2013, 12:44 AM   #47
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I'm sorry. I am looking forward to FIRE as much as the next person; but I cannot tolerate those that don't feel they need to work hard to get their compensation. Twelve on twelve is a tough work schedule; 40 hours a week is not even a quarter of a week. I believe in work hard play hard. I take my two three week vacations a year but give far more than 40 hours a week when I am working.

Years back, a number of us were comiserating about a long source selection. We thought how nice it would be to be a ditch digger wherein we drop our shovel at the end of the day and pick it up in the same location the next day. But we realized then, and I definitely realize now, that our compensation is partly based on these additional hours, worries, and stress of our jobs; ditch digging does not pay well.

I worked in France for a while where the work week is a lot shorter; that is fine for them. But, the productivity was not there. You can't get anywhere without working for it.

I hope to have $4M to $5M when I retire in a few years. I will have worked hard for that money. And, I will enjoy spending it immensely (just as I enjoy those two three week vacations each year as I am working).

marc
I would say I work hard, maybe not hours wise with 40 a week. I did put a lot of extra hours in up until last year. It took an incredible amount of work, sacrifice and saving to get where we are today.

I don't know why I would save up such a large amount of money as some suggest when I don't need so much. Why save 4M when you only need 1? What's the point?

I would prefer not to give money to charity, but rather donate time when there is more in the future. Then I know my work is being put to good use. With money, you don't know if its being used effectively or just wasted.
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Old 01-10-2013, 08:01 AM   #48
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You probably need more than 1 Million. If you start withdrawing as early as 38 the 4% withdrawal may be high. Better plan for 3 to 3.5%. If you can live off 30 to 35 K then a Million is enough. I would need a bit more. Maybe a million and a half or so to be comfortable at that age. No way I could have had that much at 38 with the path I chose.

As you can see there are people much older than you on the board that think they need more than that. And they do if there spend rate is higher or they need more to be comfortable.

I quit at 55 and have people tell me I am too young to retire. Just think of the reactions you will get if you do it at 38!
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Old 01-10-2013, 08:12 AM   #49
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I quit at 55 and have people tell me I am too young to retire. Just think of the reactions you will get if you do it at 38!
People really say that to you? That's so rude. I would LOVE to be able to retire at age 55...will probably be 60 before I can. I wonder why some believe you're too young to retire; is it simply because they think you have much left to offer the working world, or do they feel bad that they can't? I have no idea.

I know a guy who retired at age 51 from a high executive position, and he's now in his 70s and he runs marathons all over the world with his wife as a companion. Sounds great to me.

As my plan is to retire at age 60, if at age 55 we suddenly came into a half million dollars through inheritance or something, I would retire right then. Life is too short to be working forever.
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Old 01-10-2013, 08:26 AM   #50
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People really say that to you? That's so rude. I would LOVE to be able to retire at age 55...will probably be 60 before I can. I wonder why some believe you're too young to retire; is it simply because they think you have much left to offer the working world, or do they feel bad that they can't? I have no idea.

I know a guy who retired at age 51 from a high executive position, and he's now in his 70s and he runs marathons all over the world with his wife as a companion. Sounds great to me.

As my plan is to retire at age 60, if at age 55 we suddenly came into a half million dollars through inheritance or something, I would retire right then. Life is too short to be working forever.
Yep, I have heard it several times already and got a few looks from people without comments.
Lots of people are working after 55. When someone shows up that has retired what are they to think? They have to admit they can't do it.

I think they believe that those that did it were just lucky. Or they really don't have enough. Couldn't be any other reason could it?

(There is an element of luck involved.) Didn't get laid off or divorced. Health is ok ext.
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Old 01-10-2013, 09:02 AM   #51
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Does it matter what they think of my early retirement? After all, if I did what people thought, I'd have a much nicer car, and be in debt. I don't intend to stay living in the area in retirement any how.

Also, I would not start drawing on that money at 38, working part time to cover expenses and not touch the savings is the plan. But who knows, I could be in a more comfortable position at 38, or feel like I could work a little longer knowing I could quit any time I'd like. This is 10 years away. It's a plan, not what I have to do.
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Old 01-10-2013, 09:04 AM   #52
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What other people thought never stopped me.
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Old 01-10-2013, 09:28 AM   #53
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I'm sorry. I am looking forward to FIRE as much as the next person; but I cannot tolerate those that don't feel they need to work hard to get their compensation. Twelve on twelve is a tough work schedule; 40 hours a week is not even a quarter of a week. I believe in work hard play hard. I take my two three week vacations a year but give far more than 40 hours a week when I am working.
I once worked 12 hour shifts. And I LOVED it. Perhaps it was because I only had to do it for 24 weeks a year.

To the OP, take a number and get in line. Save your pennies and maybe one day your dreams will come to fruition. I would just caution you to make sure your lifestyle and is sustainable and brings contentment.
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Old 01-10-2013, 09:40 AM   #54
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I'm a physician. When I was a resident I worked 80-100 hours per week. Later, it got better, with some weeks of 80-100 hours and some of 40-50 hours. Lots of sleepless nights. There is nothing more exhausting than feeling cold, shivery and disoriented because you have not slept in over 24 hours. I used to drive home very carefully, crawl into bed all tense, and wish I could die before the phone rang again. That is why they pay doctors the big(ger) bucks and why the incidence of suicide is high among physicians. Not surprisingly, After decades of this carry-on, I developed hypertension. My last job was more like 40 hours a week, but there was a lot of travel. Much better quality of life with 40 hours!

The OP does not know how good he has it. It seems to me that he is frustrated with how he spends those 40 hours. Time for some career counseling. Find a more fulfilling job, because you will need one for a couple of decades yet.
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Old 01-10-2013, 10:15 AM   #55
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....I don't intend to completely quit at 38, but work part time doing something more enjoyable. Who knows, I may love it so much I never quit. ....
Things you love doing often stop being that once you start doing them for money, on a schedule, with a boss or customers. Good luck
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:41 AM   #56
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It seems that some people find it unusual that I enjoy my time outside of work more than my time at work. Is it that strange? After all, don't we all belong to an ER forum where the goal is less work, and more free time? I don't despise work, it's just that I'd rather be doing so many other things with my time. I just thought this was normal. I don't see any people excited to drive in to their jobs.
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:52 AM   #57
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I personally do not see anything wrong with a young person like yourself wanting to "work less and live more", to borrow from title of a popular book around here. That is if the person does not compare his living standard to the common folks who trek to work every day to put in 8 to 10 hrs/day, save like mad, then only call it quit when they get to their 50s.

And so far, I have not seen anything in your attitude to indicate that you have that envy. So, there's nothing wrong with living your life as you see fit.
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:53 AM   #58
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I think it is kinda funny, too, Too Young. I quit a good job in my mid-20s to do some sailing, then went back to work again after we returned. I did it because I felt the same way then that you do now. I don't feel the same as some of our fellow posters, that you have to suffer some specified period of time before you are "allowed" to enjoy your life.
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Old 01-10-2013, 12:36 PM   #59
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You may want to check out another blog called Mr. Money Moustache, Mr. Money Mustache | Early Retirement through Badassity. It is oriented to saving and investing and lifestyle management for those who want to 'retire' or be FI earlier than normal.
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Old 01-10-2013, 01:22 PM   #60
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It seems that some people find it unusual that I enjoy my time outside of work more than my time at work. Is it that strange? After all, don't we all belong to an ER forum where the goal is less work, and more free time? I don't despise work, it's just that I'd rather be doing so many other things with my time. I just thought this was normal. I don't see any people excited to drive in to their jobs.
I don't think people are criticizing your desire to retire early. I think they're saying since you're not yet ready to quit today, try to maintain a better perspective about your job to make it more tolerable for you. Focus on the positive vs the negative, consider how much worse other people have it, etc.
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