Aiming for early 30s

Dauglos

Confused about dryer sheets
Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
7
Location
Lexington
Hi, all. I’ve lurked on this site for a while – and been planning for early retirement much longer – and feel it’s finally time to come out and chat. My situation boils down to this: I’m 29, can live comfortably on very little, and hope to retire by 34 at the absolute latest.

My current asset vs. debt situation isn’t all that impressive . . . . I have $135k in my private investment account, $80k in home equity, $20k in my IRA, and $3k in my 401(k) vs. $107k left on my mortgage. But I remain optimistic about retirement because my savings/investments tend to grow by about $4k per month, and, setting aside my mortgage payments, my expenses tend not to exceed $10k per year.

Before I retire, I intend to build (and fully pay for) a smaller house on some land I already own, essentially trading one home for the next. Then, I’m allowing $20k per year for expenses, and assuming that in 20 years, I’ll get $100k for timber on the land (a forester actually gave me an estimate closer to $150k).

All this leads me to believe that, with an annual rate of return of 6.777 percent (10 percent worse than the Nasdaq Composite), I would need only $260k if I were to retire now and die at 82. (Men in my family tend not to last so long, either.)

So what am I missing, good or bad? I know I haven’t yet accounted for inflation, but I’m also ignoring Social Security, Medicare, the possibility of a reverse mortgage, and one or two other potential helpers. I’m especially interested in how a negligible income level will work with Obamacare and perhaps even federal aid guidelines.

Your input would be appreciated. I’m single and may eventually marry, but will definitely remain child-free. Also, my land’s in a small Washington community called Humptulips with a low cost of living. So here's an even more specific "hi" to any other Washington folks. :greetings10:
 
Welcome to the Early Retirement Forum.

Since you have a few years before you retire, and since 2013 is nearly over, you are in a great position to start recording everything you spend, thoroughly, starting with 1/1/2014. Some choose to record every dollar, and personally I record every cent because it is more satisfying to me than dealing with rounded numbers. Recording everything we spend can be a real eye opener for some, and at any rate gives us a much better idea of where the money goes. So, it would be very consistent with your desire to keep expenses down.

Good luck to you in your preparations for early retirement!
 
REWahoo: Thanks, but I’m good. In terms of entertainment, I’m mostly set with a library card, the Internet, and a dog. About the only thing I want but don’t have is the ability to not work every day.

W2R: Thanks, and good tip. I've already got Quicken giving me a breakdown of sorts, but could do better in that respect.
 
Spending only $10K a year, I'd say you were missing out on much of what someone should enjoy in their youth. Loosen up and live a little...

+1
With all due respect, at your age I would consider your plan closer to "dropping out" than "retiring early".
 
No worries, I’m not the type to ask for advice then explode when a couple people volunteer their opinions. But I like my lifestyle, even though it’s not for everyone.
 
Welcome.

The biggest flaw I see in your plan is that it is conditioned upon an extraordinary, almost unreal, level of frugality. My guess is you're missing some pieces.

Even if it's accurate today, life has a way of tossing in the occasional gotcha that needs to be accounted for.
 
Fair point. Part of me thinks I’ll be able to spend even less in retirement, given that I’ll have a smaller house, live in a milder climate, and have all the time in the world to clip coupons. :D But I know a furnace can go out (had that happen this year), a car can start to break down (two years ago), and on and on.
 
You know yourself better than we do, so if it feels right, I say go for it. Plenty of people have lived happy lives on $10k/yr, though you will definitely need to be frugal.

One problem I see is ...

I’m single and may eventually marry, but will definitely remain child-free.

I see in you profile you are male. Unfortunately, if you marry, the child thing is not your decision. :angel:
 
Not working ever again seems like a stretch at your age and savings, but certainly if your expenses are low you could look for some low paid but enjoyable work with a flexible schedule or a hobby business that could bring in extra money. The timber plan sound like a good idea but a fire could wipe out your trees or timber prices in the future might not be what you had hoped, so that isn't like money in the bank.
 
What about healthcare costs? I would want ACA to be fire tested for a few years before relying on any numbers you may find there.

You are also assuming you will always want to be frugal (and maintain the same ultra frugalness). Life does have a way of messing up such straight forward plans.
 
Does the 10-20k/year include taxes? How about healthcare insurance?
My budget is a lot lower when I ignore those two pieces.
 
+1
With all due respect, at your age I would consider your plan closer to "dropping out" than "retiring early".
At 29 I might have thought I knew how my life would play out, but I didn't have a clue I retrospect. I suspect most people can't know that early in life, and it's unlikely IME but you may be the exception. Unlike most of us, you will still be young enough that you can start over again if you decide retirement isn't all you'd hope a few years in. Best of luck, work toward FI by all means, but keep an open mind and keep your options open for now...
 
What if you won't get 6.777% annual rate of return that you seem to be planning for?
 
WOW I think you are doing great....

I am 28 and me and my wife have the same net worth but with most of our money on the house. How are you living on 10K? Me and my wife spend around 20-24K but we are shooting for 28-30K for retirement. Hoping for 700K to retire when I am 35-36.

GL
 
Don't forget you will have to pay taxes on the sale of the lumber. You'll also want homeowners insurance, possibly with an added umbrella policy to protect your home and land from lawsuits. Assume your property taxes and insurance (all kinds) will increase faster than the rate of inflation. Health insurance under Obamacare has pretty stiff deductibles and copays, so you'll need to have funds for that annually, which could be quite an expense if you develop a chronic illness or injury. IMO you have a ways to go before you'll be ready, but what do I know?
 
Dauglos, I like it. You sound like a smart guy, I'd definitely do it.

I'd be curious, how many on this board have retired and have their net worth grow. I'd bet it'd be over 1/2.

Another thing, once you retire, it doesn't mean you won't work to make money. My wife and I can put in a few hours a week and make an extra $1K.

Have you ever heard of Early Retirement Extreme? I don't think it's liked on this forum, but take a look at Jacob's posts, I think you'll like it.
 
Dauglos, I like it. You sound like a smart guy, I'd definitely do it.

I'd be curious, how many on this board have retired and have their net worth grow. I'd bet it'd be over 1/2.

Another thing, once you retire, it doesn't mean you won't work to make money. My wife and I can put in a few hours a week and make an extra $1K.

Have you ever heard of Early Retirement Extreme? I don't think it's liked on this forum, but take a look at Jacob's posts, I think you'll like it.

Lots of good stuff on ER Extreme. I'll point out that Jacob went back to work...
 
Hello from a fellow Washingtonian!

A few things come to mind.

1. Yup. If you can live on very little, you don't need very much. Most people would not be happy at that level of spending, but you know yourself better than we do.
2. Life is long and things can change. Priorities can change. I say this as someone who is only 35. If you retire super early and don't maintain your earning power, you may hurt your opportunities to do other things. (Marry, Move, Travel, etc.)
3. An extremely short career may hurt your future social security payouts.
4. If you are positive on the childfree thing, consider the snip. Love happens and so do accidental humans. As a guy you need to protect yourself. (I am childfree BTW - got the lady-snip at 27). Know that being CF limits your pool of potential spouses. Most people do want kids.
5. I would be hesitant to count on future timber income. Nice if it happens, but again things change.

Is what you pose possible? Probably. Does it come with risks and downsides. Yes.

For what it's worth, that is what I think. Welcome to the forum. :)
 
Hi, all. I’ve lurked on this site for a while – and been planning for early retirement much longer – and feel it’s finally time to come out and chat. My situation boils down to this: I’m 29, can live comfortably on very little, and hope to retire by 34 at the absolute latest.

My current asset vs. debt situation isn’t all that impressive . . . . I have $135k in my private investment account, $80k in home equity, $20k in my IRA, and $3k in my 401(k) vs. $107k left on my mortgage. But I remain optimistic about retirement because my savings/investments tend to grow by about $4k per month, and, setting aside my mortgage payments, my expenses tend not to exceed $10k per year.

Before I retire, I intend to build (and fully pay for) a smaller house on some land I already own, essentially trading one home for the next. Then, I’m allowing $20k per year for expenses, and assuming that in 20 years, I’ll get $100k for timber on the land (a forester actually gave me an estimate closer to $150k).

All this leads me to believe that, with an annual rate of return of 6.777 percent (10 percent worse than the Nasdaq Composite), I would need only $260k if I were to retire now and die at 82. (Men in my family tend not to last so long, either.)

So what am I missing, good or bad? I know I haven’t yet accounted for inflation, but I’m also ignoring Social Security, Medicare, the possibility of a reverse mortgage, and one or two other potential helpers. I’m especially interested in how a negligible income level will work with Obamacare and perhaps even federal aid guidelines.

Your input would be appreciated. I’m single and may eventually marry, but will definitely remain child-free. Also, my land’s in a small Washington community called Humptulips with a low cost of living. So here's an even more specific "hi" to any other Washington folks. :greetings10:

I thought I had low expenses at ~$21k per year. I live in a studio apartment in a co-op with no mortgage and pretty low monthly maintenance payments despite living in a high COL area (Long Island, NY). Your childfree choice (like mine) will surely keep the expenses down although it will greatly lessen but not eliminate the chance of finding a childfree woman or something reasonably close to that.

I do suggest you build in a decent surplus, or cushion into your ER budget so you will have a good peace of mind in case unforeseen expenses arise. And make sure you have health insurance covered.
 
Have you ever heard of Early Retirement Extreme? I don't think it's liked on this forum, but take a look at Jacob's posts, I think you'll like it.
Some folks here thought Jacob's insights were worthwhile (I did as general info), some didn't. He used to post here, and may have shot himself in the foot more than once in the eyes of some ER members...one of those people who seemed to touch a nerve with some ER members.
 
Some folks here thought Jacob's insights were worthwhile (I did as general info), some didn't. He used to post here, and may have shot himself in the foot more than once in the eyes of some ER members...one of those people who seemed to touch a nerve with some ER members.

I wonder how many people who buy his book on Amazon on the joys of extreme early retirement on a below poverty level budget and how free time is more important than money know he works full time as a quant these days, a field known for high salaries -

Wall Street Pays Up For Quants

I do get some good ideas on the Mr. Money Mustache forum, since most of those people are into saving money while still living, for the most part, frugal but normal middle class lifestyles. But even on there some of the people seem to go a bit over the top to save a dime here and there, like their time is worth nothing.
 
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Thanks, everyone, I really appreciate your advice. Lots of great ideas that I’ll follow up on. To try to address some specific points (although I really am looking at everything you've written):

Keim and rodi: KFF.org estimates that I’d pay $1021 per year for my premium, and – before finding that out – I put $3000 in my retirement budget for healthcare costs. So I might whittle that down now, but I am thinking about it. Taxes shouldn’t really hit me if I’m just drawing $20k per year in capital gains.

aaronc879 and ShortInSeattle: Haha, yep, I actually have a consultation scheduled with a urologist next week. Also, yes, I’m not too happy that early retirement will cut into my Social Security payouts.

hsv_Climber: That’s part of why I’m not counting on Social Security and those other helpers I listed. But I don’t want to get too negative (3 percent returns, -5 percent returns, whatever) and doom myself to working forever.

kikechiko: Being a hermit helps. Instead of paying $100 per month for a phone plan, I pay maybe $10 per month for minutes on a prepaid phone. Not many dinners out. No movie theater visits or cable TV . . . I watch only stuff I find on the Internet (and if you look hard enough, you can find anything). Otherwise, my car’s paid for, my clothes are pretty old, and my appliances are energy-efficient. Again, too – the $10k per year isn’t counting my mortgage, and my property taxes and homeowner’s insurance are rolled into that.

Dash man: Good points, all. One nice thing about my land is that it’s in a commercial timber tax program, and property taxes come to roughly $53 per year. :)
 
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