Hello, with socioeconomic commentary

[aenlighten]

Economies are dynamic systems

and will call forth the response needed. The dependency ratio has risen for a long time and I expect it to continue to do so. If there is need for people to work longer, there will be greater demand for their services and they will find it attractive to delay their retirements; if not, they won't. Any problem we face is small compared to Japan, Europe, and even China. Fortunately investment returns are set on the margin, so as long as there are emerging and developing markets and productivity innovation, returns will be higher than those of a static or declining economy.

 

[travelover]

............. Any problem we face is small compared to Japan, Europe, and even China. .............

Good point. In the future China won't just be a nation of old people, it will be a nation of old MEN.

 

[haha]

In the future China won't just be a nation of old people, it will be a nation of old MEN.

Oh please God, spare us that. I are one, so I should know.

Ha

 

[laurence]

I see Mr. John Galt never changed his tune. Why would you post the fact that you aren't interested in a subject/thread...10,000 times? We would know that by...you...not...posting!

I agree with aenlighten. Demand will exceed supply, and prices will rise. Maybe in a few years I'll be able to work part time from home, be totally flex on my schedule, maybe they'll raise my 401k matching contribution? Thanks for retiring, boomers!

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Why would you post the fact that you aren't interested in a subject/thread...10,000 times?

A vacuum is sometimes better than some of the things nature decides to fill it with...

 

[haha]

I see Mr. John Galt never changed his tune. Why would you post the fact that you aren't interested in a subject/thread...10,000 times? We would know that by...you...not...posting!

I forgot to mention that. I thought the posts in this thread were interesting, save for that idiot Galt's. BTW, I also think many threads today are very useful. I really should have made that clear. TVs and stuff are day to day things we deal with and I for one am an idiot on consumer data. I will likely remain so as I only get interested if I want to buy something and even then it is hard for me to motivate myself to spend time researching. Also I hate shopping. Yet I do like consumer goods, so when I go to buy something it is very helpful to me to check here to see what people on the board have said about the product that I am focused on.

Even so it might be nice if someone came along and started a thread with intellectual interest. I might not even participate, but I would enjoy it. Of course I guess that is what blogs are for.

I am kind of a creature of habit. I come here and if I don’t find something I want to read I will probably go out, or read some 10ks.

Ha

 

[unclemick]

Even so it might be nice if someone came along and started a thread with intellectual interest. I might not even participate, but I would enjoy it. Of course I guess that is what blogs are for.


Ha

Now who would want to do a silly thing like that! I hung in long enough to get a Curmudgeon certificate, tell people about my ding dong sister who STILL insists the Pats are a good football team(even after last night). I mean winning isn't everything( I don't want to hear - good teams win ugly).

And in spite of my sage advice - I bet somebody somewhere will continue to read books!

heh heh heh - and no I haven't checked tonight's temp in Missoula or priced generic dryer sheets lately.

Pssst - Wellesley! Still love that one!

 

[haha]

Pssst - Wellesley! Still love that one!

Uncle Mick, you are a constant lover. Ms. Wellesley is a lucky girl.

Ha

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Shhh...dont tell UM that I've been spending a little time with Ms. Wellesley myself lately...

She's unexciting but reliable.

 

[Martha]

Beats making time with de Gaulle.

 

[Nords]

Even so it might be nice if someone came along and started a thread with intellectual interest. I might not even participate, but I would enjoy it. Of course I guess that is what blogs are for.

Oh, great, only 4900 members on this board and now you want one that posts with intellectual interest?

Like Groucho, I'm not sure they'd be interested in joining a club where they'd be the only intellectual...

JG claimed to be a MENSA member-- did that count?

 

[lswswein]

tell people about my ding dong sister who STILL insists the Pats are a good football team(even after last night). I mean winning isn't everything( I don't want to hear - good teams win ugly).

I was at that game UncleMick. It was worth the 20degree windchill up in the top section. Great game and the pats defence was just awful till the 2nd interception. But they got the job done - pats & wellesly what else do you need anyway!

-h

 

[unclemick]

Beats making time with de Gaulle.

Yep - love to mis spell and mis quote that guy also.

Plus don't forget those those other great intellects of high finance - Yogi and Bear Bryant.

?? did this thread ever have a 'real' subject?



heh heh heh - it's started in my neighborhood - the Christmas yard decorations went up last weekend(except mine). Last year the dog pee'd on my lighted reindeer and he only half lights - I'm too cheap to buy a new one.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

I'm going with a hybrid system where I follow the advice of Yogi Bear.

Grab any picnic baskets you see, watch out for the ranger, and make a little extra effort to be smarter than the average bear...

 

[unclemick]

Ah yes Annette on Mickey Mouse Club or Yogi exiting stage right - life was good back then.



heh heh heh - guess what! no Pssst - Wellesley in 1958! Only Wellington or Dodge and Cox. Before Index - the age of innocence!

 

[bow-tie]

...Even so it might be nice if someone came along and started a thread with intellectual interest. I might not even participate, but I would enjoy it. Of course I guess that is what blogs are for. ...
Ha

Methinks this is why I read way more than I post, and explains my post count of 0.4 per day

 

[bongo2]

I brought up some of the elegant discourse from Ted's last post:

So if you don't like my negative comments about people who want to drop out of the workforce, maximize their social security benefits and reduce their taxes, and then claim that they are doing the rest of the country some sort of favor, screw you. Just don't read them.

One of the things that I really liked about Ted was his willingness to challenge the dogma of the board, and say what no one else around here will: that ER is selfish. A lot of poeple here like to pretend, in the face of all mores and common sense, that ER is morally positive. Every few days there is a new thread where someone expresses surprise that their friends and family are angry or offended that they are retiring early. Some of the reasons (like envy) are not so admirable, but the fact is that it is perfectly natural for people to feel that way, and they have something of a point. I think that Ted's comment above was elegant, and it hit home.

 

[Nords]

One of the things that I really liked about Ted was his willingness to challenge the dogma of the board, and say what no one else around here will: that ER is selfish. A lot of poeple here like to pretend, in the face of all mores and common sense, that ER is morally positive.

Jealousy & envy may be one set of issues, but claiming that ER is selfish (in the pejorative sense of the word) is quite another.

As for challenging the dogma, I find Ted's epithets especially well-articulated. I may not agree with a reverend's preaching, but I don't blow rasberries from the pews either. Ted could've tried to improve the system from within with persistence & respectful reasoning, but instead he chose to kick over the chessboard and stomp off in a huff. Not that he was selfish about it.

I'd also like to point out that ER has allowed us the time (and the comfort level) to master our financial acumen to the point where we donated more to charity this year than we have during our entire lives. Hardly seems selfish to me, and it ain't a sense of guilt either.

How do we explain the motivation of those who continue working far past the point of having sufficient assets to last the rest of their lives? Do they have their paychecks (after FICA deductions!) transferred straight to the charities of their choice?

 

[unclemick]

If it's selfish, immoral or fattening - post a link - I may be interested.

If it's work, noble and unselfish, moral or something silly like that - I MAY be willing to hold your coat - while YOU go do it - or not depending on my mood.

I have a Curmudgeon Certificate downloaded from this very forum.

There are loveable, foolish mis guided souls in this world who actually vote Republican, think the PacNW is a good place to live/work rather than be from, feel the Pats are a good football team and can't seem to grasp: Pssst Wellesley.

Take my sister for instance - - family is family. Ted is another story.

heh heh heh - ok ok so you get to pick one - Republican, PacNW, Pats, Wellesley - it's a trick question.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Wow...ER is selfish?

I hadnt until now realized that working most of your waking life in exchange for a handful of cash every two weeks was the definition of selflessness.

As far as anyone who thinks i'm selfish or feels its appropriate to be angry or offended that I've worked through a lot of hardships to become successful and be able to get off the treadmill? Oh...what was that nice moderator friendly way of saying it again??

Oh yeah....AVOCADO!

 

[unclemick]

Wow...ER is selfish?

Oh yeah....AVOCADO!

I love the smell of AVOCADO in the morning! It smells like like victory!

heh heh heh -

 

[Twinkle Toes]

As someone who has been prematurely, involuntarily retired, I haven't yet developed enthusiasm for it. However, I have some academic background in economics, have followed the "efficient markets" approach to investing that is advocated by this web site, and appreciate the additional insights and tools (FIREcalc) that it provides.

While I respect everyone's right to make the decision to retire early if they can afford it, a sobering note is that society as a whole needs to be moving in the opposite direction -- towards later retirement.

I have a different take on Ted. The first sentence of his first post spoke volumes to me. He was canned, let go, downsized...however you want to say it...his former employer decided he was no longer valued enough to keep. That hurts! And it showed in Ted's post...I'm smart...and my former employer, as well as society in general, would have been better off to keep people in general employed...especially me. When Ted didn't get the kind of support he wanted...after so elegantly making his case, he went away.

If Ted had lurked a little before posting, he knew people here were striving toward ER. The fact that he chose to post what he did is telling to me...share your knowledge with the unenlightened and they will not only be awed by your brilliance but will see the light. That kind of resolve might explain why Ted was involuntarily retired.

I kind of feel sorry for Ted and hope he found another position where he could be properly appreciated.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

IIRC, Ted worked in sewage processing. One of his last projects involved analyzing the prospects of removing items like condoms and chewing gum from waste water for recycling purposes.

I remember hoping that they didnt use one to make the other.

Not sure there was much of a problem with Teds opinion that people are most worthwhile when they continue to do some sort of work that contributes to society at large and keeps that up as long as they're productive.

The problem seemed to show up when he stated that he respected the rights of others to retire early, then before his lips stopped moving judged that ER's are leeches.

 

[haha]

I have a different take on Ted. The first sentence of his first post spoke volumes to me.

Wow! A loving and likely accurate appraisal.

I liked Ted because he was challenging and smart, and he sure saw the best way to play the coming bull market in crude. But he was definitely no politician.

I have since come to think that possibly his main argument was in error. It is true that the only goods and services that are avialable today must be produced and performed in the present (Leaving aside old movies on DVDs, art and crafts from former eras, etc.)

What I think he may have missed is that as ERs, we have during our working lives saved and invested a lot of money. In a well functioning modern economy that savings and investment should on average increase productivity going forward, thus creating a larger pie, even though it is being produced by fewer workers (We won't be working!) So the share than we claim with our passive income is due to us, so to speak. Though there may at times be political intereferance with this.

Ha

 

[twaddle]

I'm sure Ted would be honored to know we're still talking about him. I liked him because he had a pretty fresh econ masters, so he still talked like a student. FWIW, there are about 100 Ted-alikes over at diehards.org. I can tolerate that forum for short bursts.