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Old 09-07-2015, 12:00 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by daylatedollarshort View Post
As Walt said, there is your culture, and there is what your mom is willing or not willing to do, there's you not wanting to live with your mom and then there's math. Math always wins out in the end.
True that numbers do not lie but I still believe in miracles.
I guess that's the nurse still in me.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:03 AM   #62
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Read the other thread, and see you are still looking for the magic answer.

You need to sell your house or the house you own jointly with your mom, (since you bought it, tell her the house has to be in your name only). And if you sell your house, suck it up and live with her.

You alluded to giving your mom money but didn't say how much and that your Italian brother does not (is that the culture?). Does she really need it? Does she not get a pension ?
If you truly need to give her money for food (you cannot afford for shopping trips), then do it as a 1099 as you get to deduct it, and she will be a 0% tax rate probably.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:11 AM   #63
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I'm Asian and grew up in the Philippines. The cultural norms are actually pretty similar.

Prior to my maternal grandmother's death, my mom was sending her money every month and helped her with unexpected hospital bills. She was living independently in a condo but after her last hospitalization and needing 24/7 care, we convinced her to live with my aunt so my aunt can have greater oversight on her care and expenses. I also send my paternal grandmother money every month to pay for her meds so I know about being obligated to help your elders.

And yes, I actually still live with my parents. My mom and I are the primary breadwinners in the family. I expect that to continue even after I retire so I'm taking measures now to ensure I can continue helping support them. It's a good thing I don't plan on getting married.

That said, I don't cede my entire paycheck to her although I do give her more than half of my take-home pay apart from paying for utilities and vehicle expenses. Admittedly, mom is much, much more frugal than I so savings rate will likely be a lot higher if I let her manage my money. Alas, she's also extremely risk averse so long run, inflation will probably eat away at the savings so I manage her 457 investments.

I really hope you're successful in your ebay business. However, I have to say your current situation makes me nervous.
Yes it makes me nervous too and is why I found you guys in the first place.

And I know Filipino culture is the same. My best friend is Filipino and she's been supporting her Mom for probably 40 years now since she came to the USA but it's cheaper to send money "home" as she says than to bring her here. But she's got two other siblings helping her do the same thing so it's not as much of a burden.

Mom doesn't want to leave the US. She talked about it one time but her sister in the Dominican Republic died so she decided to dig in her heels here.

I've been out on the ledge for 3 years now so am getting used to the view.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:17 AM   #64
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True that numbers do not lie but I still believe in miracles.
I guess that's the nurse still in me.
The problem with miracles is that they do not occur as often as foreclosures and bankruptcies. We have friends that lost their jobs, tried to hold on to the house and lifestyle until the bitter end, and ended up losing the house and along with it their equity. It was a really expensive house - if they had been more proactive and downsized the house and lifestyle early on they might have held on to some of their equity and still had a retirement nest egg.

Good for you for being proactive with the eBay business. I always have some kind of little online business or two going on myself. I hope it works out. But a thriving business and lower run rate combined will allow you to save more for retirement and give you more financial peace of mind. Good luck.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:21 AM   #65
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(1) If all went well with your online sales - what do you think your yearly profit (not gross) could be given your current time / ability to work?

(2) I'd be very reluctant to further real estate investment unless it is sure to provide a steady income with little risk of needing large amounts of cash to fix issues in the properties.....I'm not into real estate so you probably have a much better feel for this... but I haven't got the feeling that is typical situation for new investments.

I really hope all works out well for you but, as others have said, your situation looks very concerning to me. Hopefully some of the posted comments/ideas will be helpful.
Honestly not sure how much profit I can make but if I didn't purchase any more inventory which honestly I believe I have enough for a few years, then I think I could pull at least 4-5K cleared out of the business. I don't think it's unrealistic as my biggest expense has been postage and purchasing inventory.

I have changed my business model to buy less finished product and just make my own designs and I can scale up and down depending on sales as opposed to being stuck with a lot of things that aren't selling which was a problem in years past.

Honestly real estate does not scare me. It's been good to me in the past and I don't see why it wouldn't continue to be so. But I do understand why it scares many. I have had my share of crazy tenants who have destroyed a few units but even so I still managed to make a profit. Maybe it was just luck.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:26 AM   #66
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Take out 457 money, you possibly pay penalty, no longer have the savings, and then go bankrupt and end up with nothing. By keeping your money within Retirement accounts it is sheltered from bankruptcy (which is where you are headed).
I've got a govt 457 and on our plan, we can withdraw funds anytime without penalty as long as we're already separated from service. I think I saw the OP mentioning working for a county hospital somewhere so it might be the same for her. Granted, losing liquid assets as she's planning to do scares me. And yep, I agree about keeping the ERISA protected assets intact.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:32 AM   #67
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All of these answers are terrible choices that you are thinking are answers because they are quick, easy and you don't see the Bigger problem they create.
You rent out your place and move to a cheaper place (by the time you subtract your rent from the other costs of your place you are still losing money each month and now risk of damage by tenants.)

Drop homeowners insurance - nice that you skipped by earlier for 5 years, but it just takes 1 hurricane to destroy the house and you lose everything.

Take out 457 money, you possibly pay penalty, no longer have the savings, and then go bankrupt and end up with nothing. By keeping your money within Retirement accounts it is sheltered from bankruptcy (which is where you are headed).
I thought the 457 was deferred compensation and did not have a penalty, at least that is how they sold it to me.

And I don't really like the idea of dropping the homeowners insurance but you'd be surprised at how many people here do. The house has hurricane straps and shutters so could withstand a category 1 or 2 and survived Andrew but it's older now and could be a different story with a repeat category 5.

And yeah renting out my place isn't really what I want to do but I want to stay as long as possible as my area is really appreciating rapidly with all the cash investors coming here from Europe and South America. My condo building has passed up the bubble days. The chances of having someone destroy this unit are much less than in other parts of town. This area is mostly young professionals making good salaries and wanting to live near downtown.

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Read the other thread, and see you are still looking for the magic answer.

You need to sell your house or the house you own jointly with your mom, (since you bought it, tell her the house has to be in your name only). And if you sell your house, suck it up and live with her.

You alluded to giving your mom money but didn't say how much and that your Italian brother does not (is that the culture?). Does she really need it? Does she not get a pension ?
If you truly need to give her money for food (you cannot afford for shopping trips), then do it as a 1099 as you get to deduct it, and she will be a 0% tax rate probably.
Of course I'm looking for magic. Isn't that what you guys and gals do here?

I give Mom about $700 a month. I don't physically give it to her, it goes into a joint account to pay the taxes and insurance on the house. She buys her own food and pays her own car expenses and utilities with her rent money from her sister and her SS check. It's complicated but we have a joint bank account but I am the only one who uses it. She has a credit union account for herself that I do not have access to. I have no idea what she has in there. Couldn't be much.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:40 AM   #68
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The problem with miracles is that they do not occur as often as foreclosures and bankruptcies. We have friends that lost their jobs, tried to hold on to the house and lifestyle until the bitter end, and ended up losing the house and along with it their equity. It was a really expensive house - if they had been more proactive and downsized the house and lifestyle early on they might have held on to some of their equity and still had a retirement nest egg.

Good for you for being proactive with the eBay business. I always have some kind of little online business or two going on myself. I hope it works out. But a thriving business and lower run rate combined will allow you to save more for retirement and give you more financial peace of mind. Good luck.
I know this is a retirement forum and that my focus should be on retirement but all that money sitting there for my elder days would be wonderful except that life happens. If I found myself facing foreclosure I would certainly not hesitate to withdraw everything and bail myself out of my mess. I know that's not the general consensus here and I totally get it, but the way I see it, that's my money and if I need it now, then I need it now.

I really don't want to do that because I don't want to be a destitute senior citizen but if the nursing home is going to get everything anyway it may one day have made sense to cash out and solve today's problems.
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Old 09-07-2015, 12:44 AM   #69
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I've got a govt 457 and on our plan, we can withdraw funds anytime without penalty as long as we're already separated from service. I think I saw the OP mentioning working for a county hospital somewhere so it might be the same for her. Granted, losing liquid assets as she's planning to do scares me. And yep, I agree about keeping the ERISA protected assets intact.
That's how it was sold to me and what the Financial Planners suggested that I contribute to since even had I stayed the full 30 years, I was still going to only be 51, so 457 money was supposed to be the best option for me over the 403b, which is what I was initially contributing to.
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Old 09-07-2015, 01:41 AM   #70
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I have read through this entire thread as well as the other one started by the OP, and frankly, I am beginning to think this story is made up. On the one hand, the OP claims to have been an ICU nurse for decades. I know a lot of ICU nurses, and they are usually very competent, shrewd people. She drops numerous hints at expertise in real estate, claiming to have been a realtor on the side. Yet the main theme is a complete lack of understanding of personal financial management coupled with a severe victim mentality and a dogged determination to shoot down any and all helpful suggestions aimed at avoiding inevitable foreclosures and bankruptcy. It just doesn't add up.

Call me cynical, but I just don't buy this train wreck tale. I'm calling the OP's bluff.
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Old 09-07-2015, 02:13 AM   #71
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On the one hand, the OP claims to have been an ICU nurse for decades. I know a lot of ICU nurses, and they are usually very competent, shrewd people.

<snip>

Yet the main theme is a complete lack of understanding of personal financial management.
Just because someone is good at their job doesn't mean they have their financial house in order. I think you can probably find lots of intelligent, well-paid professionals (including doctors and nurses) living paycheck to paycheck despite having sizable incomes.

That said, it does seems like the suggestions from forum members have all pretty much been exhausted with none being acceptable to the OP.
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Old 09-07-2015, 05:34 AM   #72
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Old 09-07-2015, 06:14 AM   #73
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............It's her medicare paid social club where she hangs out at the gym, takes computer classes, learns knitting, eats lunch and gets her toe nails done. Why would she give that up? They even have birthday parties and all sorts of other parties for their members. But you are right she could very well live to be 100 with that kind of health care. LOL
Medicare pays for a social club? I'm not near Medicare age but did not know there were things like this paid for by Medicare.
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Old 09-07-2015, 06:40 AM   #74
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......Of course I'm looking for magic. Isn't that what you guys and gals do here?
Absolutely not. You are living in a fantasy land.

Based on your replies in this thread, and the other thread you started, your "plan" is to "hope" and "wish" that everything works out in the end, if you just keep adding to your real estate portfolio and working on ebay.

No matter how many thoughtful and constructive responses and suggestions you receive, you shoot every one of them down. You are not looking for an actual solution. You are looking for people to validate your choices so far, which as far as I can tell have gone like this: it's my money, and if I need it now I need it now, and to heck with the future. I'm just a victim of my stubborn mother and my culture, and there's nothing I can do about it. Woe is me. I'll just buy more real estate and hope for the best and if it doesn't work out I'll survive on reverse mortgages (which you flat-out stated in your other thread.)

According to you:
You "can't" live with your mother to save money.
You "can't" continue working as a nurse, not even working from home as a consultant, because of your health issues.
You "can't" do any other kind of job, because of your health issues.
You "can't" sell any of the properties you own, or downsize.
You "can't" stop giving your mother money every month.

The fact is "can't" can be replaced with the word "won't" in every instance.

You blame your mother.
You blame your cultural traditions.
You blame your sibling who won't contribute.
You blame your health issues, and the meds you take, for not being able to work more.

Interestingly enough, according to one of your posts, you were well enough to attend many trade shows this year.

I don't know of anyone on this board, or in real life, who reached financial independence by following the "Hoping-and-Wishing-for-a-Miracle" plan. You can continue on the path you have chosen (and you have chosen it, you are not a victim) and eventually math will catch up to you.
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Old 09-07-2015, 06:48 AM   #75
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Old 09-07-2015, 07:09 AM   #76
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Medicare pays for a social club? I'm not near Medicare age but did not know there were things like this paid for by Medicare.

This is news for me too. I don't know the answer but this is Miami, Florida, the Medicare/Medicaid scam/fraud capital of the U.S. A simple google inquiry would give the details.


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Old 09-07-2015, 07:10 AM   #77
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I've been watching this thread for it's entertainment value. If it is for real. Many things in her responses make me wonder. I'm only going to post once in this thread.

OP claims to have an illness which keeps her on sedating meds but is able to place post after post after post here.

She claims to be unable to work but then in another post says she doesn't want to because of "changes in the health care industry" and in another post says she won't pass drug screening due to narcotic meds she's being prescribed. She let her license go only two years after getting this illness, whatever it is.

She is running out of money yet keeps giving her mother $700/mo because it's part of the culture. She's headed toward homelessness, so what's her mom going to do when she has nothing to give and is on the street?

She has $50K in credit card debt and she gives money away. This doesn't make sense.

Her profile here lists her interests: Cruising, travel, timeshares, going to the beach. Really?

She says she believes in miracles and says that others here do too. Where did that come from? I'm pretty into reality, myself, not dreams and miracles.

Her answers to why she cannot find other work are all over the map: can't pass drug test, doesn't want to work for $10/hr, can't do case management due to quotas, can't do the work or reinstate her license after less than two years off the job. Why not?

She refuses any and all reasonable suggestions with inconsistent responses. "Yeah, but..." An example: case management for an insurance company, from home, online and by phone. I personally know several nurses who do exactly that. She claims she can't due to he workload and quotas. That's plain b*****t.

One very basic requirement for early retirement is financial independence. I'm not seeing that in her case.

One other thing. The OP posted on this thread 31 times, 28 times in the last 24 hours starting at ~1PM EDT and her last post was probably at about ~3AM. And her posts aren't exactly short. She could certainly handle an online case management job, and she does not exactly seem sedated.

This whole thing seems fishy. I'm not going to bother posting any direct responses to the OP because all of us have posted many things I have thought as I read this thread and the OP has rejected every bit of help offered. There's not much point in continuing an advice thread if the person asking for advice refuses all the advice offered. She's dug herself into a hole and everyone has told her to stop digging but her only response is that she has to keep digging to get out of the hole. She's going to eventually lose both homes, one through foreclosure and the other to the government when she eventually fails to pay taxes.

OP, I'm not sure your story is real. And if it is, then I would not to want to be a patient with a nurse who is as adept at making excuses as you have exhibited here, in order to avoid dealing with the reality of your situation.

Yes, I am being harsh. But her story is either real or it's not. And if it is real, then her rejection of everyone's advice is an insult to our collective wisdom, a waste of our time, and frankly, it's getting boring.


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Old 09-07-2015, 07:39 AM   #78
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I have read through this entire thread as well as the other one started by the OP, and frankly, I am beginning to think this story is made up. On the one hand, the OP claims to have been an ICU nurse for decades. I know a lot of ICU nurses, and they are usually very competent, shrewd people. She drops numerous hints at expertise in real estate, claiming to have been a realtor on the side. Yet the main theme is a complete lack of understanding of personal financial management coupled with a severe victim mentality and a dogged determination to shoot down any and all helpful suggestions aimed at avoiding inevitable foreclosures and bankruptcy. It just doesn't add up.

Call me cynical, but I just don't buy this train wreck tale. I'm calling the OP's bluff.
When I stopped working the hospital I had a chunk of money saved up. I have exhausted that but I was fiscally responsible before all this started. Obviously not like you guys since you live and die by your retirement plans. I was working my 30 year plan too and it was what I thought was the right thing at the time but life happens. I am not a train wreck. I knew where I was going until I had a derailment.

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Just because someone is good at their job doesn't mean they have their financial house in order. I think you can probably find lots of intelligent, well-paid professionals (including doctors and nurses) living paycheck to paycheck despite having sizable incomes.

That said, it does seems like the suggestions from forum members have all pretty much been exhausted with none being acceptable to the OP.
I was not living paycheck to paycheck. I did have my financial house in order. But 3 years of 1/3 of my salary was too much for me to float. I guess the dream of retirement is no longer a dream to me.
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Old 09-07-2015, 07:42 AM   #79
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The game is called "Yeah, butt". Are we having fun?
Apparently we are.

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Medicare pays for a social club? I'm not near Medicare age but did not know there were things like this paid for by Medicare.
Come to Miami because they most certainly are.
Leon Medical Centers ? Serving Miami?s Medicare Community


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This is news for me too. I don't know the answer but this is Miami, Florida, the Medicare/Medicaid scam/fraud capital of the U.S. A simple google inquiry would give the details.


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President Obama even came to check this out as a model for what he wanted ACA to be.
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Old 09-07-2015, 07:44 AM   #80
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I have read through this entire thread as well as the other one started by the OP, and frankly, I am beginning to think this story is made up. On the one hand, the OP claims to have been an ICU nurse for decades. I know a lot of ICU nurses, and they are usually very competent, shrewd people. She drops numerous hints at expertise in real estate, claiming to have been a realtor on the side. Yet the main theme is a complete lack of understanding of personal financial management coupled with a severe victim mentality and a dogged determination to shoot down any and all helpful suggestions aimed at avoiding inevitable foreclosures and bankruptcy. It just doesn't add up.

Call me cynical, but I just don't buy this train wreck tale. I'm calling the OP's bluff.

+1 it's a story, no answer will work since that could end the tale


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