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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 05:48 AM   #21
 
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

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Ok, so now you are splitting your fixed expenses with your wife who also has income. *I don't think you mentioned that before. *Will she also be saving $250K and ERing with you, or will she continue to work?
I did not mentionned her because it does not matter that much. I pay for my expenses, she pays for hers. If we ever split, I will have a smaller condo and smaller expenses (it would surely cost me more than today, I agree, but on the other hand, I have a more frugal stylelife than she does, so that I would be able to cut some expenses further).

Anyway, I don't want to focus on figures, but on the way you can reduce expenses to increase savings. I will also try to show people that some assumptions from experts might be quite wrong for some people (for instance, the assumption that you will need 60-80% of the gross income you earned before retirement ).

How much wealth you need to retire, how you have to save and your budget depend on one personal situation that are mostly out of control in a retirement plan: where she lives, if she has children, her current income, etc. I could discuss about figures all day long, but this would make no sense because your own situation is much different from mine.

The basic fact is that most people that I know, with a similar personal situation than me (they live in the same city, same level of income, etc.) think they'll need to work until >60 before being able to retire. I think this is true because people believe they will need 80% of their actual income to retire.

I want to show (I'm not the first, many people actually did what I say I will try to do, my blog is not a secret or magic recipe, I'm just applying what others have done in the past; my blog is original only because I will be a "real-time" description of my progress) how we can retire MUCH earlier than that.

The lifestyle I could affor with my plan would not suit most people. But maybe I can convince some that they could easily retire by 50, for instance, and still have enough money to do what they intend to do when there are retired. As I said previously, if my figures are wrong as you seem to think they are, well, maybe I will retire a bit later, say at 39 or 42. Anyway, that would be much sooner that what I expected a few months ago (my previous "plan" was to try to retire by 55). But my goal is 37, and I am pretty confident I will succeed, even if things could happen and prevent me from doing it: me or wife loosing job, stock market crashing, etc.

Regards, Jack
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 06:26 AM   #22
 
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

A word re. spouses, expense sharing and
early retirement, single vs. married. I was married in 1993 when I semiretired (PT work). I was single in 1998
when I quit completely. I remarried in 2001 and my wife works 32 hours a week. My net worth has increased
pretty steadily since 1993, except for the "split" when I divorced. Anyway, it (ER) worked as a single and it's still working as a couple. Obviously
a working spouse is a major help, especially now that
my net worth has kind of stabilized. Current plan is
for her to work 2 more years until I can draw SS, and
then see where we stand. BTW, even though we have a pretty solid prenup, we don't get too fancy with who pays for what, it just sort of developed by itself over time. I am kind of in the same situation as Cut-Throat
in that I produce income by the results of my nearly 40
years in the workplace, and my wife produces it by
continuing to work. Everyone is okay with that. It's
the other details that bedevil us.

John Galt
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 12:11 PM   #23
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

Hi Jack,

First, congratulations on getting an early retirement plan in place. I wish you great success.

Your planned nest egg is a little bit light to support even your intended lifestyle if you compare it to historical worst case analysis. It sounds like you are using fixed average return and average inflation numbers as the basis of your plan and that could give you problems. But you have time to refine your plan if your returns don't match your expectations, and as you've mentioned, you can always work a few more years and still enjoy a long early retirement. You might want to run your plan through FIRECALC or another historical simulator and see for yourself how it would have fared historically.

Also, you sound as if you might think you have made a unique discovery about the relationship between "Living below your means" and building a retirement nest egg. Most of the posters on this board are very familiar with this concept and it actually is the subject of many of the threads here. In fact, the things you discuss are the central themes in a number of books that are often discussed on this board. If you aren't aware of this literature, you should check out some of the threads here and look at the reading lists. Some very good ideas have been published by a number of people who have retired very early. Their experience might be useful to you as you go on your own path.

Good luck.
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 02:14 PM   #24
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

You need to get a life Jack! I hope your girlfriend heads for the hills because with your attitude she needs to find someone with balls. Trust me........she WILL want to have children someday. At 29 it is prudent to have a general retirement plan in place, but to make it the #1 priority in your life is ludicrous. Your figures to retire at 37 are naive. Unless you are expecting a big inheritance or you strike it rich with Lotto 649, you need to at least double, if not triple your stash. Forget any meaningful QPP benefits, and OAS would be 29 years away. You could be dumpster diving and living in a fridge box by the St. Lawrence. Maybe welfare or the Men's Mission would do in a pinch.
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 03:40 PM   #25
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

[quote]You need to get a life Jack! I hope your girlfriend heads for the hills because with your attitude she needs to find someone with balls. Trust me........she WILL want to have children someday.

Zipper: Was going to respond to that young man, but at this point don't feel like piling on. (You covered it pretty good). With sisters, and two daughters, it is really comforting to know that there are lots of men with "broad shoulders" left in the world
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 04:29 PM   #26
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

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Quote:
Trust me........she WILL want to have children someday.
Zipper: Was going to respond to that young man, but at this point don't feel like piling on. *(You covered it pretty good). *With sisters, and two daughters, it is really comforting to know that there are lots of men with "broad shoulders" left in the world
ex-Jarhead, not sure if I understand what you are saying. Are you suggesting that people who don't want or don't have children aren't somehow shouldering some imagined burden to continue to increase the world population? :-/

As for women not wanting children it hasn't been that uncommon an occurence in my dating days for women to have not wanted children. I can't say that 100% of them maintained that view past the point of no return but of those that I know of or still hear about through "the grapevine" I'd say about 75% or more have kept that conviction. Now it's hard to say if those who changed did so because they really changed their mind or they did so for their partners.
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 04:40 PM   #27
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

Uh oh. Somebody just pushed one of Jarhead's hot-buttons!
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 04:44 PM   #28
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

[quote]

Zipper: Was going to respond to that young man, but at this point don't feel like piling on. *(You covered it pretty good). *With sisters, and two daughters, it is really comforting to know that there are lots of men with "broad shoulders" left in the world ex-Jarhead, not sure if I understand what you are saying. *Are you suggesting that people who don't want or don't have children aren't somehow shouldering some imagined burden to continue to increase the world population? :-/

Hyperborea:

I am not saying that at all. Whatever works for a married couple is their business. What I was responding to was covered in his post. As i said to Zipper, I don't feel like piling on, and will leave it at that.
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 05:39 PM   #29
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

I just wanted to second the fact that there are plenty of women who do not want to have children. Some do change their minds, but many maintain this decision throughout their lives and do not regret it. There are also plenty of women who regret having children, but are afraid to admit. I have encountered a few who are willing to admit it. Parenting is great path for some, but not all.
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 07:53 PM   #30
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

Yep, here's another woman with absolutely zero interest in having kids. No, I take that back: less than zero, as I actively DON'T want to have any. Total agreement from my husband on the subject.

The human race is genetically programmed to want to have kids (weirdos like me promptly remove ourselves from the gene pool...) but there are some who don't!
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-16-2004, 08:31 PM   #31
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

Not only are we programmed to want kids, but I'm pretty sure that once we have kids, we're programmed to like them.

My wife hit the procreation panic button at 34. *I tried to convince her that we didn't need kids since we had dogs, and dogs were better in almost every way. * I lost that argument.

Now that we have a toddler, I've fallen for her hook, line, and sinker. * *There's no logic to it. * I'm sure other kids are just as cute and smart, but I don't necessarily like them.

I'm still trying to understand the attachment. * There's certainly intellectual pleasure in watching the developmental process unfold. * *I've always been floored by the complexity and beauty of biology, so I'm hugely fascinated by seeing the most complex being on the planet develop from a couple of single cells merging.

And I'm sure I'm proud of my contributions in raising her, both genetically and environmentally, but of course having sex wasn't much of a sacrifice, and I have no doubt that she'd turn out fine without my guiding hand.

So, I think what really happens is that some hormone kicks in that makes me take delight in what others would consider banality, and also turns me from an *easy-going pacifist to somebody who wouldn't think twice about eliminating any threat to her existence.

Biochemistry. * Really fun stuff *
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 04:23 AM   #32
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

Being a grandparent is even better. I take my 3 year old grandaughter to our nextdoor park and she plays as long as she wants. I watch moms and dads bring their kids for 15 minutes max, and then "the hurry up disease" calls and they're gone. Usually with the kid crying to stay!
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 05:18 AM   #33
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

[quote]Not only are we programmed to want kids, but I'm pretty sure that

So, I think what really happens is that some hormone kicks in that makes me take delight in what others would consider banality, and also turns me from an *easy-going pacifist to somebody who wouldn't think twice about eliminating any threat to her existence.

Wab: Ah, the power of a small child. Has turned you from a pacifist to a candidate for the U.S.M.C. Raider Battalion
Actually, both you and TH, in my opinion are having children at the perfect time in your life.
I have very few regrets so far in my life, but one that stands out, is when we had children, I was struggeling to make ends meet, and with job and outside business committments, didn't have the amount of time I would have liked to have had with them when they were growing up. It was my loss, not the kids, as my wife was a stay at home mother, and they had a great deal of support from her. Before I knew it they were gone.
Good to hear that you are enjoying the development of your child.
Regards, Jarhead


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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 09:08 AM   #34
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

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The lifestyle I could affor with my plan would not suit most people. But maybe I can convince some that they could easily retire by 50, for instance, and still have enough money to do what they intend to do when there are retired. As I said previously, if my figures are wrong as you seem to think they are, well, maybe I will retire a bit later, say at 39 or 42. Anyway, that would be much sooner that what I expected a few months ago (my previous "plan" was to try to retire by 55). But my goal is 37, and I am pretty confident I will succeed, even if things could happen and prevent me from doing it: me or wife loosing job, stock market crashing, etc.
Jack;

It appears that Zippy and Jarhead have given you a bums rush welcome. *You are absolutely right that the key is to get started by saving money and the way to do it is by reducing your expenses below your current income. *It is pretty difficult to predict future investment returns and future cost of living, but one thing for sure, you can't get there unless you start saving.

Please continue to post here and illigitimati non carborundum.

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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 12:40 PM   #35
 
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

It's actually Non Illegitimi Carborundum. Hope you don't think me abrasive

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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 12:55 PM   #36
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

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Non Illegitimi Carborundum.
Don't eat fake sugar?
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 01:16 PM   #37
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

ExJarhead,
Thanks for the insightful post on having kids later in life. I'm 39, and starting a PT lifestyle next week. I like the hot weather and warm water (and waves) of Costa Rica. I don't have any kids, but I'm thinking of maybe setting up camp... and having a kid or two outside the US after a few years of PT. Anyone here ever raised kids in Central America?

Surf

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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 02:44 PM   #38
 
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

I raised all of my kids in "Central America".
Lots of corn and soybeans along with good old- fashioned "Bridges of Madison County" values.

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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 07:16 PM   #39
 
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

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Jack;

It appears that Zippy and Pinhead have given you a bums rush welcome. *You are absolutely right that the key is to get started by saving money and the way to do it is by reducing your expenses below your current income. *It is pretty difficult to predict future investment returns and future cost of living, but one thing for sure, you can't get there unless you start saving.
Hehe. Yes, I don't understand what I've said to deserve those replies, I did'nt mean to offend anyone. I didn't expect this from a forum dedicated to early retirement.

Sure, I might be wrong with my projections of investments returns and cost of life. But it is not like if I expect a 10% return; an average of 4% above inflation seems not overly optimistic, but only time will tell. I have some room in my budget, so that should my return not high enough a given year, I'll be able to put some money in to balance. I think people should also have in mind that retiring at <40 is somewhat less risky than retiring at 65.

If your projections are wrong when you retire at 65, you have no choice but to live with your errors. At 37, if I'm wrong and need more cash in my budget, I can easily go back to work two or three years, maybe part time would be okay.

As you say, some things can change in 8 years (and after that), like us wanting children. But I have nothing to lose by saving money meanwhile. And saving for me is not difficult, I don't have to deprive myself. Some people need a large car and a large house and most of their money are spent there. I am happy with a small car that I don't use very much and a small condo.

But I go to restaurant two or three times a week, I buy books whenever I want (e.g.: one or two books a week), I travel a lot, but not very far away (and I prefer camping to hotels, I prefer to visit relatives than doing tourism), I take lessons at a circus school, I enjoy movies at theatre or at home, I buy the CDs I'd like to have, I do photography and painting, we have dinner with our friends, my cellar contains good wine... Even if I spend > 400$ a month to do that, I still can save much because my home and car are inexpensive and because I bike to work or I use public transportation.

Kind regards,

Jack
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37
Old 09-17-2004, 08:02 PM   #40
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Re: The Blog of a Man Who Plans to Retire at 37

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I didn't expect this from a forum dedicated to early retirement.
Jack, I think "early" means different things to different people.

There can be a big difference between the mindset of somebody looking to knock a few years off the rat race at, say, 55 and somebody looking to live a carefree life starting at 38. The ones retiring at 55 often still have a strong belief in the puritan work ethic, duty to family, duty to country, and all of those other "duties" that conflict with a carefree hedonistic life.

Not that there's anything wrong with that
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