Air-Powered Car Coming to U.S. in 2009 to 2010

[cute fuzzy bunny]

See what I mean about making sure you understand all the implications of a major change, other than just the 'good' ones?

 

[samclem]

In terms of well to wheels efficiency, battery electric vehicles are the only technology that can theoretically approach unity efficiency (approaching 100% of source power being delivered to the wheels). Air cars are horrible thermodynamically, and hydrogen is pretty bad too.

Huh? Even theoretically, please describe how you are going to produce this electricity (to go into the batteries) with anything close to 100% efficiency?

Hydrogen isn't even a factor. As we've discussed previously, it's not an energy source, just a (poor) energy transfer and storage medium.

With an internal combustion engine, the original (chemical) energy source* (oil) is converted to mechanical energy directly. With an electric (or compressed air, or hydrogen) car, the first conversion occurs somewhere else to make this transfer medium, then another conversion occurs in the car. This entire chain is usually less efficient than direct conversion into mechanical energy in the car.

The off-site initial conversion does have several advantages, but efficiency isn't one of them:
- If burning fossil fuels, pollution controls are easier to implement at a central point than in millions of cars.
- Flexibility: Burn coal now, use nuclear energy tomorrow, use wind energy when available, etc. The cars could get their electricity from a lot of different sources. In addition, by making it feasible to use cheap, clean fuel (e.g. nuclear power now, maybe solar someday), the efficiency argument becomes irrelevant. Who cares if the whole process is efficient if the original fuel is abundant and cheap.?


* of course "oil" isn't the "original" source of the energy in oil (or coal). The original source is nuclear power (in the sun) which drove the photosynthesis in plants millions of years ago, and that chemical energy is now available.

 

[USK Coastie]

Guys we ain't gonna run out f oil !!! See my OOOPs Jacklope post. Under the wheat field of North Dakota and Montana we have the Bakken formation which holds between 100 and 500 billion barrels of recoverable oil. Of course it will cost $20 - $40 per barrel to recover.

 

[USK Coastie]

Guys we ain't gonna run out of oil !!! See my OOOPs Jacklope post. Under the wheat field of North Dakota and Montana we have the Bakken formation which holds between 100 and 500 billion barrels of recoverable oil. Of course it will cost $20 - $40 per barrel to recover.

 

[packrat44]

Do we need to go back to the time of using a horse and wagon?

How about the use of oxen to work our fields?

Emissions exceed the EPA standards.

 

[free4now]

Huh? Even theoretically, please describe how you are going to produce this electricity (to go into the batteries) with anything close to 100% efficiency?

You are correct that it's not possible. I should have said the transmission and in-vehicle storage can approach 100% efficiency. E.g. 100% efficient superconductor transmission and current conventional batteries can return more than 95% of the charging power.

This contrasts with air cars, hydrogen, and fossil fuels which use inefficient transmission (usually driving it down the highway in tankers), and inefficient thermodynamic processes for converting the stored energy into usable power in the car.

 

[chinaco]

Am I missing something about the Hybrids? GM (Saturn) is selling a hybrid in 2008. THe mileage seems kinda low to me.... 24mpg/32mpg.

A 4 cyl volks Passat gets 19mpg/28mpg


This hybrid has an approx. 25%/14% improvement in gas mileage.

I did not compare the weight and size of each vehicle so I suppose the Saturn could be much heavier?? But I thought the hybrid would be more efficient? What gives? Where is the 50 mpg?


Saturn | 2008 VUE & AURA Green Line | Hybrid SUV & Hybrid Car