Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 06-30-2014, 10:16 PM   #61
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 65
Storage is happening, but it will lag a bit most likely. We don't need it in the USA for at least a decade. I believe ~30% of peak power coming from PV is the point where it becomes a real pain. It also depends on how interconnected the market is. A very big smart grid will do a lot better than small dumb ones. It only takes a couple hours storage to really help as well as it's the ramp rate around 5pm when the sun goes down and everyone goes home and turns up the AC that is the big issue. Plug-in cars may make this worse soon too.

I don't know if residential PV will last in its current form. Maybe BIPV will get cheap enough eventually. Commercial and Utility make sense without subsidies in many markets in the USA today. Thousands of big box stores currently get almost all their energy from PV on the roof, but they don't all actively tell their customers as it's seen as a marketing risk. What does that say about America?

PV is the future. 100 years from now it will dominate power generation. I expect it to surpass wind in a few years. Centralized power stations running through a big dumb grid have a limited life IMO.
__________________

__________________
FIGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 06-30-2014, 10:32 PM   #62
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,035
Just had a quote done, about 8.5k. Did the math, i feel way better putting that cash in the market, letting it grow to pay my electricity forever.


Sent from my iPhone using Early Retirement Forum
__________________

__________________
dallas27 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 03:56 AM   #63
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,204
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
It is not common for Europeans to have A/C in the homes.
Just to reinforce that one. Most hotels do have them, but I personally know no-one who has A/C in their home.

In warmer countries it is more prevalent though (Italy, Spain).

Other places just open their window when it is too hot
__________________
Totoro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 08:27 AM   #64
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,614
Quote:
Originally Posted by dallas27 View Post
Just had a quote done, about 8.5k. Did the math, i feel way better putting that cash in the market, letting it grow to pay my electricity forever.


Sent from my iPhone using Early Retirement Forum
$8500 x 6% returns = $510/yr = $43/mo.
Explanations:
You don't live near Dallas or anywhere else that is that hot.
"Pay my electricity" = "Pay for some of my electricity"
You've got a way to reliably generate more than 6% real return "forever"
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 09:29 AM   #65
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,204
Quote:
Originally Posted by samclem View Post
$8500 x 6% returns = $510/yr = $43/mo.
Explanations:
You don't live near Dallas or anywhere else that is that hot.
"Pay my electricity" = "Pay for some of my electricity"
You've got a way to reliably generate more than 6% real return "forever"
  • Expect energy prices to drop >3% in the coming year(s)
  • Expect solar panel prices to drop >3% in the coming year(s)
  • Don't trust the quoted numbers
Just a few examples
__________________
Totoro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2014, 11:43 AM   #66
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by samclem View Post
$8500 x 6% returns = $510/yr = $43/mo.
Explanations:
You don't live near Dallas or anywhere else that is that hot.
"Pay my electricity" = "Pay for some of my electricity"
You've got a way to reliably generate more than 6% real return "forever"

Not really, i learned they slowly wear out and drop output over time. Also, if i need to remove them for roof maintenance, I'm looking at a 3000 dollar hit just to move them out of the way. And the 6% doesn't compound. When i dot the math, long term i make more and have lower risk paying for the grid.

My roof is 15 years old, btw.


Sent from my iPhone using Early Retirement Forum
__________________
dallas27 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2014, 04:36 PM   #67
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Diego
Posts: 699
Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50 View Post
Yes, and there is a shut off for gas & electric. The problem, as I understand it, is there is no way to get to the panels to shut them off.

I don't know if firefighters won't spray water until they've verified the power is off or not. And maybe the concerns over solar panels are over-blown. But it would be interesting to ask, and get input from the local FD, no?

-ERD50
Weirdly, the local FD signed off on our solar project. There is a big, red sign on our breaker box with "Warning" and directions for manually shutting off the system. In the advent of a grid power failure, the PV system shuts down. The HOA, the county, the power company, and the FD all had to agree to the system before it could be installed and the latter three had to sign off on the installation before it could operate. I suspect they may have consulted with engineers about just the sort of problem you envision.

Re: Solar City
My parents used SC for their house in Tucson. The company is so busy that they had quite a wait time.
__________________
AllDone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2014, 06:32 PM   #68
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,929
The FD is likely checking the FD Roof Access Requirements. This covers things like weight load for the type of roof (e.g. 5 lb/sq ft, max 40 lbs at any support point), max height of panels above roof (18"), min 3' clearance from roof ridge for FD smoke ventilation operations, roof slope and access pathways (2:12 or greater slope requires 3 ft access pathways, some other req. based on roof geometry). They'll also check of there is a battery backup, disconnects, and hoe easily the panels can be tarped.

Building permits and inspections... Fun for everyone! (or not)
__________________
M Paquette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2014, 07:41 PM   #69
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 18,255
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllDone View Post
Weirdly, the local FD signed off on our solar project. There is a big, red sign on our breaker box with "Warning" and directions for manually shutting off the system. In the advent of a grid power failure, the PV system shuts down. The HOA, the county, the power company, and the FD all had to agree to the system before it could be installed and the latter three had to sign off on the installation before it could operate. I suspect they may have consulted with engineers about just the sort of problem you envision.

Re: Solar City
My parents used SC for their house in Tucson. The company is so busy that they had quite a wait time.
It's good that they were involved.

I suspect that one of the things they were checking was that the system would shut down or isolate itself, and not back-feed the grid in a power outage and kill a lineman making repairs. That's pretty much the default for a grid-tie system, but I suppose they need to check that you didn't also have some battery backup that could create that kind of hazard (that would require a transfer switch).

RE: In the advent of a grid power failure, the PV system shuts down.

Well, yes and no... that's the potential problem.

Yes, the inverters stop delivering power into the grid and into your home wiring if the grid is down. But unless you have micro-inverters attached to each panel, the panels are still putting out DC power, and the DC lines running to the inverters are 'live', and still represent some hazard. With micro-inverters at each panel, the power would stop at that point. Since they need to be weather-tight, I would think the risk to a fire hose would be pretty small with local micro-inverters, the 'live' area would be pretty well contained.

-ERD50
__________________

__________________
ERD50 is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Recent Medical Experience: Over medicated? Billy Life after FIRE 33 10-11-2009 10:22 AM
Experience buying vehicles via eBay? Achiever51 Other topics 19 09-13-2007 07:29 AM
NJ house hunting experience semtex FIRE and Money 40 09-03-2006 07:30 AM
Any advice on solar electric? Nords Other topics 30 06-08-2006 07:27 PM
Anyone Got Any Direct Experience with FISN? ShokWaveRider FIRE and Money 9 04-03-2005 09:23 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:25 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.