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Old 09-16-2013, 10:58 PM   #21
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Er yes, have been watching.

May I ever so politely point out that we aren't Aussies, we're Kiwis! We get very sensitive about that down these parts. They live across the ditch from us.
My bad... I knew that AND the announcers have been saying it for days.

I'm guessing that there were a bunch of guys with black uniforms and brown pants inside when the boat was about to go over at 25 knots or so. That was close.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:01 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by pb4uski View Post
My bad... I knew that AND the announcers have been saying it for days.

I'm guessing that there were a bunch of guys with black uniforms and brown pants inside when the boat was about to go over at 25 knots or so. That was close.
Lol, all good. We've been putting up with it for years. When hubby and I were in Ireland someone kindly suggested it must be difficult being so far away from Sydney. We have a pretty good-natured rivalry with our Convict Cousins!

Yep, that race was heart-in-mouth moment...I can't believe they were prepared to go out for the second one. Crikey, is about all I can say. And that's an Australian word.
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Old 09-17-2013, 08:15 AM   #23
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It has finally gotten exciting with OR (USA) competitive upwind with NZ. Races 9 & 10 were great! Unfortunately with the score at 7-1 NZ-OR, the odds of OR winning 8 races before NZ wins another 2 seem very high...it would be a miracle if the Cup doesn't end up in NZ now. It could end today.

After the LVC Cup was a total blowout, thank goodness the AC finals include some tactics/strategy instead of just a lopsided drag race...
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Old 09-17-2013, 09:49 AM   #24
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I've been watching and love it. The mistake in Race 8 was awe inspiring to see.
Too bad we're so far behind, it's an extremely uphill battle to defend the cup.
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Old 09-17-2013, 10:51 AM   #25
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Did anyone see the New Zealand cat almost capsize during Race 8? Incredible footage.
Yep saw it.

Check out this incident during Race 1 of the Louis Vuitton Cup:



Half the boat went under water, bow first, and 2 people went overboard...
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Old 09-17-2013, 03:57 PM   #26
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I couldn't read the speed but it looked like they were going over 30 knots just before they buried it. I suppose that it didn't pitchpole only because they buried both pontoons rather than just the leeward pontoon (and the boat is 7 1/2 tons). I can't imagine seeing a 7 1/2 ton cat pitchpole.
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Old 09-17-2013, 04:17 PM   #27
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I couldn't read the speed but it looked like they were going over 30 knots just before they buried it. I suppose that it didn't pitchpole only because they buried both pontoons rather than just the leeward pontoon (and the boat is 7 1/2 tons). I can't imagine seeing a 7 1/2 ton cat pitchpole.
I am guessing you know there have been two AC72 capsizes. The first was Oracle essentially pitch pole/capsize, see link below at about 0:40. The second was Artemis where the boat broke up in moderate wind, not really a "crash" per se, and a crew member died/drowned. In both cases, the boats were almost destroyed.

ORACLE TEAM USA "17" Capsize - The Whole Story - YouTube

It appears today's races have been postponed to tomorrow due to high winds.
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Old 09-18-2013, 08:23 AM   #28
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Did anyone see the New Zealand cat almost capsize during Race 8?
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Yep, that race was heart-in-mouth moment...I can't believe they were prepared to go out for the second one. Crikey, is about all I can say. And that's an Australian word.
For those who may not have seen it...
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Old 09-18-2013, 08:24 AM   #29
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Did anyone see the New Zealand cat almost capsize during Race 8?
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Originally Posted by annienz View Post
Yep, that race was heart-in-mouth moment...I can't believe they were prepared to go out for the second one. Crikey, is about all I can say. And that's an Australian word.
For those who may not have seen it...

YIPES!!!
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Old 09-18-2013, 03:13 PM   #30
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Rumour has it down these parts that Team NZ are the dog and on this occasion Oracle were the lamppost. I couldn't possibly comment.
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Old 09-18-2013, 05:09 PM   #31
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The America's Cup Home page was completely unintelligible to me... twice as bad as Nascar website... try to find information? Yuck. Schedule and results? Strange... Couldn't find any commentary on the races. But they DO offer a Clean Boater Pledge, considerable information on AC Open, and more info on the Concert Series.

The sports pages of the major newspapers don't seem to know what to make of the races. Reporting is terrible, and a few days behind.

That said, watching the replays has been a fascinating experience. From what I can see, we're still in a learning experience, with so many variables I doubt that any computer could sort the strategy out.

The sail
The total weight, incredible, and bouncing like a tennis ball
The team weight, moving from side to side
The required strength from the winders
The hulls, in and out of the water
The daggerboards and it seems, no trim tabs (that I could see), so reliant to the manual raising and lowering. Flexible to a fearful level.
Tacking with a foil sail
Covering @ 45 mph
Jibing... how would ya know?

Almost everything that one has ever learned about sailing, different. A whole new dimension. The learning curve is apparent with each race, as speeds and "apparent" strategy changes.

A lot of the racing doesn't make sense to me... some racing with both hulls in the water, some with one... and anywhere from 1 to four daggerboards in the water... Boggles the mind.

On board cameras amd microphone...very exciting.

The cideo is great, not kust for the shots, but the "lines" on the screen, showing distance, and the speedometers showing comparitive speeds. A fabulous viewing experience.

If the printed media, the online coverage, and the TV networks can ever get their acts together, it could be a great sports experience. NBS sports is not in my DirecTV package, so the tv menu doesn't show it. Strange... with no notice from anyone, the cup coverage is available there, but the channel is blocked on a usua, regular basis.

It's like a superbowl that is being ignored.

That's my opinion...
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Old 09-18-2013, 05:29 PM   #32
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Some comments if you're interested.

BTW, NZ won the 1st race today and the 2nd was postponed due to high winds (again). Now at 8-1 NZ-USA. First to 9 wins the Cup, so it may be over tomorrow.
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The America's Cup Home page was completely unintelligible to me... twice as bad as Nascar website... try to find information? Yuck. Schedule and results? Strange... Couldn't find any commentary on the races. I have to agree the site is clumsy at best.

The daggerboards and it seems, no trim tabs (that I could see), so reliant to the manual raising and lowering. They are raised/lowered manually. They also pivot fore/aft (same effect as a trim tab), controlled by the helmsman/driver, controls are on inside rim of steering wheel.

A lot of the racing doesn't make sense to me... some racing with both hulls in the water, some with one... and anywhere from 1 to four daggerboards in the water... Boggles the mind. Each hull has one adjustable daggerboard and one rudder (that can't be adjusted up/down, no moveable trim tab) - four appendages as you noted. Whenever windspeed and point of sail (upwind, reach, downwind) allow, they'll be flying on the leeward (hull away from where the wind is coming from) daggerboard/foil and rudder. [You will never see them on just one appendage (daggerboard/foil or rudder) except maybe for a split second.] The windward daggerboard/foil is raised and the windward rudder will dip in and out of the water, purely a function of heel angle. More often than not, it seems there's one foil and two rudders in the water. Foiling downwind and reaching is typical, upwind occasionally. Going upwind they will have both hulls in the water at times.

The video is great, not just for the shots, but the "lines" on the screen, showing distance, and the speedometers showing comparative speeds. A fabulous viewing experience. A great advance in sail TV technology to be sure. Too bad the AC72 racing was so boring before the finals. The AC72 challenger races were awful, Sweden and Italy weren't at all competitive with New Zealand. More like a parade than a race. Having great graphics/video doesn't matter when one boat beats the other by more than 5 minutes.

If the printed media, the online coverage, and the TV networks can ever get their acts together, it could be a great sports experience. NBS sports is not in my DirecTV package, so the tv menu doesn't show it. Strange... with no notice from anyone, the cup coverage is available there, but the channel is blocked on a usua, regular basis.

It's like a superbowl that is being ignored.Sailing has always been a niche sport, and probably always will be. The organizers had high hopes for attracting a big audience to this Americas Cup to promote sailing, but that hasn't happened at all.
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Old 09-19-2013, 07:37 AM   #33
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Thabks for a great, informative explanation...
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Old 09-19-2013, 04:43 PM   #34
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Well team USA (Oracle) took the first race today, but the second race was abandoned due to high winds (GT 23 knots wind & current for more than 30 seconds). So ETNZ has won 8 races and OR has won 4, score stands at 8-2 (with USA 2 race penalty). Takes 9 to win, so USA must win 7 straight, NZ only needs to win 1 race in next 8. Tall odds against USA...
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Old 09-19-2013, 05:07 PM   #35
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Thabks for a great, informative explanation...
This is even better than words if you're interested. Good explanation on foiling, adjustments, speeds, etc. - just a couple of minutes.

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Old 09-21-2013, 12:43 PM   #36
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I'm hoping that a forum member can solve a mystery for me. If one boat fouls another (like in yesterday's race) what is the penalty for the foul?

When I was racing small boats we had to do a 360 within a certain amount of time as the penalty for a foul. Obviously, not likely with a 72' cat. Just wondering.
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Old 09-21-2013, 01:08 PM   #37
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I like sail racing, but haven't been watching. I'm hoping the KW's go ahead and wrap it up. They are messing up my F-1 Quali from Singapore. I had planned to record it from my DVR to a R&W DVD so I could watch it at work today. But alas, it was pushed back because of the AC. It hadn't recorded by the time I had to leave.
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Old 09-21-2013, 06:42 PM   #38
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I'm hoping that a forum member can solve a mystery for me. If one boat fouls another (like in yesterday's race) what is the penalty for the foul?

When I was racing small boats we had to do a 360 within a certain amount of time as the penalty for a foul. Obviously, not likely with a 72' cat. Just wondering.
You're right, a conventional 720 penalty turn (360 is only for touching a mark) wouldn't make sense for a 72 ft catamaran, they'd have no chance of recovering from two 360's, it takes too long for a multihull. For this AC, the penalized boat must immediately slow down and give up two boat lengths. You might think it would be hard to verify, but with the telemetry on these boats, the race officials signal the penalty and then tell the slowed boat when they have satisfied the two boat length penalty using a system of lights on board. No talking required, all done with lights on board both competitors boats.

America's Cup AC45 Tech: Lighting the Christmas Tree - from CupInfo
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Old 09-21-2013, 10:16 PM   #39
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Thanks Midpack. It has been so long I couldn't remember whether it was 360 or 720 but I think you are right and it was 720. If it was at the start or in traffic we could use some judgement to get out of the pack and then do the penalty.

Interesting the way they do it now, though two boat lengths is nothing at the speeds they are doing.
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:38 PM   #40
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Midpack....

You mentioned in the middle of a quote that they were hoping for better TV watching.... well, for me they actually have to put it ON TV.... the only way I can watch is after the fact on youtube....


I think the racing is interesting.... much more so than auto racing...

The other bad thing about interest in sail racing is that there is not a lot out there that is interesting.... I remember watching when they had the old boats... and it was a lot less interesting.... the strategy was so subtle you could not even see it.... on the ones now, you can see if it worked pretty quickly....
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