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Old 09-10-2014, 03:22 PM   #21
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Nope. I think you have it backwards. This is a way for Apple to make owning Apple devices even more valuable to consumers.

The iTunes music store was like this for years - Apple never really made much/any money from the store (after expenses) but it helped Apple sell iPods. Oh yes.
Same with the App Store. App developers make things you want to use, but you need an i___________ to use it.
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Old 09-10-2014, 03:22 PM   #22
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I am interested in Apple Watch primarily as an activity monitor. I currently have a Fitbit. I like it, but I'm not enthused with Fitbit as a company and I am quite interested in the heart rate sensor part of the Apple Watch.

What was unanswered to me is whether the Apple Watch will provide enough information to be viable as an activity monitor (there may be answers today to some of these questions but I haven't had an opportunity to search them out).

1. Does the device track steps? I know the iPhone can, but does the watch?

2. Is the heart rate sensor usable continuously throughout exercise? Some of the watch based sensors are fine to occasionally measure your heart rate but don't do a good job of monitoring heart rate continuously while exercising. Currently I wear a bluetooth heart rate monitor which talks to Digifit (through an iPhone app) which then talks to Fitbit. That works but it is a lot of steps. It would be great to have a wrist based monitor that cuts out all the middlemen.

3. If the answer to 2 is yes, how comfortable is the Apple Watch to wear to do this? On some wrist based heart rate monitors you really have to wear the watch very, very tightly for it to work well.

4. Well the software for activity monitoring work well to integrate data from other software? For example, with my Fitbit, I record my food eaten at MyFitnessPal. That data goes to the Fitbit and the Fitbit software tells me my calorie deficit in real time during the day. As someone working on weight loss this is really important to me. Some activity monitors of other manufacturers don't let you do that. That would be a huge negative for me if the Apple software didn't allow integration of calories eaten from MFP.

Also, I use a digital scale (Withings) that talks to Fitbit and MFP to record my weight each day. Will the Apple software take in the data from that scale and use it with the activity monitor information?

I am a WW member. WW in Germany is working with Fitbit so that data from Fitbit is uploaded into your WW account to provide information regarding your activity level and calorie burn to Weight Watchers which is used to determine your Activity Points. WW plans to do this with a variety of different activity monitors. Will the Apple Watch be one of them?

So -- for me -- I just need more information to decide on the Apple Watch.

I currently have an iPhone 5s. To use the Watch you need a 5s or iPhone 6. So I can use the Watch without upgrading to the iPhone. But that iPhone 6 Plus looks great so I am really tempted to go ahead and upgrade.

The Apply Pay does look interesting.
The watch has its own accelerometer. So it can detect movement on its own. But it would still require some information from the iPhone to get a full picture (GPS and barometric data for example).

You can find more information here:
Long-awaited Apple Watch tracks heart rate, activity, calories burned, but not sleep | mobihealthnews
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Old 09-10-2014, 03:27 PM   #23
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Katsmeow, I also use Fitbit.

1. It's not clear if it has its own sensors or uses the one in the iPhone. It's also not clear if you have to have the iPhone paired and in proximity to the watch in order to record the fitness data. It would obviously be more convenient if you didn't and could just sync it later to iPhone or iPad, as you can with the Fitbit (the later models allow this).

2. Unknown, it would be interesting if it did and gave you charts.

4. This is still unclear. HealthKit in iOS8 is suppose to provide some standard for this but obviously many apps. are sharing data amongst themselves already. Will companies like Fitbit and MFP use HealthKit now and maybe aggregate data against your AppleID? Or would they still want you to create an account with them?

I didn't know Withings worked with Fitbit, since it has a competing wireless scale. I may get one so that's good to know.


I think something like Fitbit, while it doesn't collect heart rate data, is easier to use, clip on your waistband, it's very unobtrusive and much cheaper so you don't worry as much about losing it.

Plus one week battery life, versus charging the Apple Watch every night.
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Old 09-10-2014, 04:09 PM   #24
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Apple Pay of something like it is inevitable, and apps/systems like it will be as ubiquitous as credit cards soon enough (I hope). Square has made small inroads, more than the others AFAIK, and maybe Apple Pay (which does far more than Square, Google Wallet, etc.) will spread payment apps much further (NFC).

Like others, since I have a smartphone with me most everywhere I go, I quit wearing watches years ago. The Apple Watch isn't going to change my needs, since it relies on the phone I already carry anyway. And I don't want another battery to worry about charging.

We'll see, but unfortunately for Apple I think Jobs unique legacy is still intact. It seems the revolutionary Apple has become incremental evolution like all other consumer electronics companies, they have their hands full with Samsung and others.
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Old 09-10-2014, 04:16 PM   #25
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I sure hope the security is okay with Apple Pay. Otherwise, instead of pick pockets to go after the wallet, it'll be pick wrist to go after a paying watch.
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Old 09-10-2014, 04:16 PM   #26
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I've always loved Apple keynotes, just fun to watch. I think the Watch is a beautiful design, although it looks to be thicker than many normal watches.

I'm one if the few people I know who still wears an old school wristwatch. It's even got an analog face. Do people in the target demographic for the Apple Watch still wear a wristwatch?

I won't be buying one. I don't have an iPhone although I love my iMac and iPad. I love gadgets but this is not something I want or need.


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Old 09-10-2014, 04:29 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by easysurfer View Post
I sure hope the security is okay with Apple Pay. Otherwise, instead of pick pockets to go after the wallet, it'll be pick wrist to go after a paying watch.
As always we'll have to see, but...

The iPhone security architecture is truly impressive. If you are interested in the technical details there was a white paper released earlier this year:

http://www.apple.com/ipad/business/d...rity_Feb14.pdf

Steve Gibson discussed this on this Security Now podcast - the transcript (and audio) is at

https://www.grc.com/sn/sn-446.htm

Security on the iPhone is not an add-on afterthought. Nothings perfect, but Apple has put some serious effort into it all.

We'll have to wait for details on the watch until it actually exists in the wild.
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Old 09-10-2014, 05:35 PM   #28
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Katsmeow, I also use Fitbit.

1. It's not clear if it has its own sensors or uses the one in the iPhone. It's also not clear if you have to have the iPhone paired and in proximity to the watch in order to record the fitness data. It would obviously be more convenient if you didn't and could just sync it later to iPhone or iPad, as you can with the Fitbit (the later models allow this).

2. Unknown, it would be interesting if it did and gave you charts.

4. This is still unclear. HealthKit in iOS8 is suppose to provide some standard for this but obviously many apps. are sharing data amongst themselves already. Will companies like Fitbit and MFP use HealthKit now and maybe aggregate data against your AppleID? Or would they still want you to create an account with them?

I didn't know Withings worked with Fitbit, since it has a competing wireless scale. I may get one so that's good to know.


I think something like Fitbit, while it doesn't collect heart rate data, is easier to use, clip on your waistband, it's very unobtrusive and much cheaper so you don't worry as much about losing it.

Plus one week battery life, versus charging the Apple Watch every night.
DW has a Fitbit and uses it a lot, I am holding off for something that integrates an activity monitor with a heart rate monitor and maybe blood pressure too. We take a 3 mile walk a few times a week, DW's fitbit says she has walked 8k steps, my iPhone says I went 7.5k steps, which may be true since I have longer legs but the iPhone will show how far and a GPS map of the walk. I have a Pulsar heart rate monitor; I have a-fib so I want a good heart monitor. The Pulsar is the minimum that is useful; it shows my current rate, max rate average rate and how long I have been in the fitness zone ( above a certain BPM). I would like to also have the ultimate health/exercise watch to monitor sleep patterns as well. And I want a record available, I have an iPhone ap Azumio Heart Rate monitor which works for pulse (heart rate) by reading heart rate via the camera lens for one minute tests but does have a graph of my basic heart pattern. I would like to be able to capture this kind of information and be able to email it to my doctor. I do not care if I need to wear a chest strap if the system captures a lot of data and communicates to the watch or iPhone.
So I want it all in one place and easy to use. It looks like the watch is a step in the direction I want but not there yet. If I could get it 'all' then the cost would matter less to me. It seems likely Apple will add features and I will get one when it does what I want.
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Old 09-11-2014, 07:35 AM   #29
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I don't know, maybe. I think I will wait a couple of years and see how functional it is. I still wear an analog face wristwatch. Not sure quite why - I guess I just like it as the sole piece of jewelry I wear (other than my wedding band). Apple has designed a nice looking device and I kind of like the remote speaker phone capability (when paired with the iPhone). But, then, I really don't get a ton of calls so how useful could it be? A remote GPS monitor to call up easily while on the street? Maybe, but I suspect that battery drain on both the phone and the watch would be daunting. A heart beat monitor? I like that but doubt it will work well while working out -- at least not in today's version. A bike trip monitor? Could be useful. I carry an iPhone in a handle bar bag when riding. I don't like mounting it on the bars. Being able to glance at my wrist to see my speed and distance would be nice but, again, that would require running a suitable app on the phone and monitoring on the watch over a significant period of time draining the battery. My Garmin works OK already - although like the iWatch you have to recharge the darn thing all the time - what a PITA.

When the batteries get so good that I can run the phone and the watch for 24 hours straight with a GPS app running I may pop for this combo. Or maybe I will like it enough as the reviews come in that I will take a dive next spring. We shall see.
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Old 09-11-2014, 07:58 AM   #30
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As some realize, it's the "Apple Watch", not the iWatch FWIW. An understandable mistake, even Tim Cook (of all people!) slipped up on the name in a recent interview.

Why isn’t it called the Apple iWatch? - Telegraph
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Old 09-11-2014, 07:59 AM   #31
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It's the "Apple Watch", not the iWatch FWIW. An understandable mistake, even Tim Cook (of all people!) slipped up on the name in a recent interview.

Why isn’t it called the Apple iWatch? - Telegraph
Maybe. But I bet it becomes the iWatch in common parlance.
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Old 09-11-2014, 08:03 AM   #32
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Maybe. But I bet it becomes the iWatch in common parlance.
I don't doubt that...it'll take a long time for the "i" to become silent.
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Old 09-11-2014, 11:07 AM   #33
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Vivofit:
1) Available now for a much lower price.
2) Battery life is 1 year
3) Good for what I need, an accurate distance monitoring device
4) Can read it in bright sunlight or dim light
5) Has other functions like time, date, goal, calories, steps. I don't use these.

I'd like to see the Vivofit functionality added to my Timex Ironman. How do people get by without a stopwatch, count down timer, or alarm on the wrist?

I don't know how the Apple watch will get visibility in bright light working. I carry way too many chargers on vacations as it is. What a pain.
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Old 09-11-2014, 12:00 PM   #34
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Had to look up a Vivosmart band.
It is made by Garmin, and looks like it does a lot of the same thing as Ap. Watch. No ApPay.

According to Cnet Garmin Vivosmart Preview - CNET looks like it is about $170, I would really have to be into fitness bands to pay that. My Fitbit One is about as high as I was willing to go. Still a nice looking band, with lots of functions, tha syncs to both Iphone and Android Phones. (Cnet link is a good video review)
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Old 09-11-2014, 02:51 PM   #35
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If you plan on using the Apple Watch simply to get notifications from your phone, etc., I don't understand the appeal. You have to have your phone with you for the Apple Watch to work, so why not just look at your phone? duh!

If you're going to use it for something that the watch can do that the phone can't do, then I could understand why someone would get it. But at $349, it seems way overpriced....like most Apple products.
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Old 09-11-2014, 05:01 PM   #36
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Old 09-12-2014, 06:37 AM   #37
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If you plan on using the Apple Watch simply to get notifications from your phone, etc., I don't understand the appeal. You have to have your phone with you for the Apple Watch to work, so why not just look at your phone? duh!
That's because you are an old guy in a retirement forum Loads of people will love being able to glance at their wrist to see what the buzzing in their pocket or purse is all about, make quicky speaker phone calls, etc. without having to pull out the phone and enter a pass code. The fact that the watch is joined at the hip with the phone is the whole point of this thing. Loads of people will buy it.
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Old 01-01-2015, 06:12 PM   #38
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Wow, I saw my first iPhone 6 Plus today when a friend brought his new toy to a gathering. The screen is huge and beautiful, BUT:

The thing is enormous!
My first clue was that my friend walked into the room with it in his hand instead of his pocket, and he immediately laid it down on a table.

I put it in my shirt pocket, and it fit, but stuck up so high it looked kind of weird.

Definitely not for me. I can certainly see myself getting an iPhone 6 eventually, mainly to be able to use the Apple Pay functionality, but the Plus is too huge for comfort (and I'm a certified Apple fanboy).
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Old 01-01-2015, 06:33 PM   #39
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Wow, I saw my first iPhone 6 Plus today when a friend brought his new toy to a gathering. The screen is huge and beautiful, BUT:

The thing is enormous!
My first clue was that my friend walked into the room with it in his hand instead of his pocket, and he immediately laid it down on a table.

I put it in my shirt pocket, and it fit, but stuck up so high it looked kind of weird.

Definitely not for me. I can certainly see myself getting an iPhone 6 eventually, mainly to be able to use the Apple Pay functionality, but the Plus is too huge for comfort (and I'm a certified Apple fanboy).
+1 It is ridiculous unless you carry a hand bag. DS and DD have the regular sized iPhone 6 and its big enough.
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Old 01-01-2015, 09:10 PM   #40
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We have a Nexus 5, dimensions are 5.4 x 2.7. Apparently it's the same as the iPhone 6. I have no problem fitting it in my jeans pocket and I'm not a big guy. Are people exaggerating or coming from a small is better angle?

To do some web surfing you want a larger screen I think.
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