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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 12:36 AM   #61
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

So the Border Patrol should focus only on vehicles but anyone on foot should be allowed free access into the country?
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 12:45 AM   #62
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Art
So the Border Patrol should focus only on vehicles but anyone on foot should be allowed free access into the country?
Not exactly, but pretty close. I'm not concerned about vehicles. But I am a little concerned about what they can carry. We have laws and regulations that protect us from faulty, unsafe and unhealthy products. It costs manufacturers money to comply with those laws and regulations. If we don't keep faulty, unsafe and unhealthy products from crossing the border, what's the point of the regulations and laws?

But I am not very concerned about individuals crossing the border to find work, prosperity and a better life. The only reason most of these people are illegal is because our laws are arbitrarily written to define them as such. If we outlawed toilet paper, then only outlaws would have toilet paper. If we outlaw crossing the border to obtain gainful employment, then . . .

Does the idea of making legal border crossing cheap and easy bother you?

Why?

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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 12:46 AM   #63
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Quote:
Originally Posted by - SG
How does this ratio of good/bad effects compare to any other particular part of our population?
Yeah, like (other) low income people...
or obese people.

I know a few folks who are illegal and are better 'Americans' than many americans I know.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 01:34 AM   #64
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

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Originally Posted by JB
Yeah, like (other) low income people...
or obese people.

I know a few folks who are illegal and are better 'Americans' than many americans I know.

Yeah and then there are the few who shoot cops and then cross the border never to be seen again....
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 01:59 AM   #65
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

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Originally Posted by - SG
Does the idea of making legal border crossing cheap and easy bother you?

Why?
Yes, I believe the borders must be enforced by any means necessary. I am not opposed to legal immigration. I am opposed to illegal immigration.

Why?

Well, the contraband that concerns you enough to check vehicles can easily be carried by people on foot. But this is not my main concern.

Mexican and Central American street gangs and other violent criminals in LA and now all over the US are made up largely of illegals. We have enough home-grown predators- we don't need to import any more.

Diseases we wiped out or never had are coming back due to illegals. We have enough disease- we don't need to import it.

Illegal aliens strain our medical system. And our education system. And our criminal justice system. And our military's training operations by accidentally crossing through training areas.

Google: Illegal aliens and health care (or crime, or education) and read as much as you want about it. My first article on this post has info from sources such as:

Dr. Laurence Nickey, Director of the El Paso Health District
Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons, Spring 2005
Congressional Testimony from the American Medical Association, 1991








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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 02:39 AM   #66
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Quote:
Originally Posted by - SG
Does the idea of making legal border crossing cheap and easy bother you?
LEGAL border crossing should be as cheap and easy as possible consistent with effective public health/criminal background/national security screening.

ILLEGAL border crossing should be made impossible- by any means necessary.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 08:06 AM   #67
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Not with my tax money!

I propose we fire the Border Patrol - stiff em on any pension's.

Shoot the Buffalo - worked on the Plains Indians by starving them onto the reservation.

Sooo - we pay bounty for any employer who hires illegals - enough so an alien can ER in the country of his choice

Confiscate everything the employer has - like we do drug dealers and sell at public auction - use the money to cut taxes - throw them in jail with the druggies - then rent them out as dirt cheap labor - to defray taxes.

Bring back vagrancy laws for the street gangs - if they can't produce a valid W-2 or post bond as independantly wealthy - throw them in the slammer with the* dealers/employers and rent them out for cheap labor also.

Heh, heh,heh - this be a before sugar doughnut post.

This is America - we need to run this thing profitably.
BTY - Does the Chinese army still run businesses with prison labor?

Perhaps we can send some MBA's over to copy the business model.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 09:12 AM   #68
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

UncleMick, I like your ideas... they fall under the category of "by any means necessary".

But rather than firing the Border Patrol, couldn't we just put them in charge of managing criminal employers and captured illegal aliens?
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 09:17 AM   #69
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Quote:
Originally Posted by unclemick2

Sooo - we pay bounty for any employer who hires illegals - enough so an alien can ER in the country of his choice

Confiscate everything the employer has - like we do drug dealers and sell at public auction - use the money to cut taxes - throw them in jail with the druggies - then rent them out as dirt cheap labor - to defray taxes.

Bring back vagrancy laws for the street gangs - if they can't produce a valid W-2 or post bond as independantly wealthy - throw them in the slammer with the* dealers/employers and rent them out for cheap labor also.

This is America - we need to run this thing profitably.
BTY - Does the Chinese army still run businesses with prison labor?

Perhaps we can send some MBA's over to copy the business model.
UncleMick, why do you call yourself a liberal? No capisce.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 09:33 AM   #70
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

I think he might be pulling your leg...
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 09:43 AM   #71
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

ME!!!!!! - pull somebodies leg? Speak tongue in cheek?

Naw!

I'm only thinking of myself - throwing employers in jail and impoverishing law enforcement types - will only improve the conservative/liberal ratio for future debates at the doughnut shop.

"Conservative who's been thrown in jail" and all that stuff.

Heh, heh - dead silence on the "liberal who's been mugged."


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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 09:44 AM   #72
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

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I think he might be pulling your leg...*
Uncle Mick can be pretty subtle. Part of his charm

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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 09:55 AM   #73
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

I'm new here- thanks to all for the help. Now I capisce.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 10:45 AM   #74
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Art:

I believe your posts are a public service.*

We all have a stake as citizens to comply with the rule of law in this country or risk loosing everything.* Its personal to me, as a lawyer.* I did all the legal paperwork, hearings and assorted legal processes so that my spouse, a legal immigrant, who was here by way of academic sponsorship to teach at a major Med School here in the US, could gain US citizenship.

She has an MD/Phd (Bio-Chem) educated in Poland (MD) and Russia (Phd).* She has something to offer any nation and could immigrate into virtually any western country on merit. I had to endure five years of INS incompetence, and even though I am a lawyer with plenty of trial and Adminstrative law experiance, it was a nightmare out of a Frans Kafka plot.* She was naturalized in a ceremony in the federal district Court before a Judge I knew personally from my trial practice, in which the majority of the new American citizens were from the professions, most of them from India, Canada, Asia, and Western and Eastern Europe.* Based on my experiance (I have since done several pro-bono citizenship applications for foriegn professionals seeking US residency) most of those that initially comply the US system of immigration laws are also the ones that will support it and are the type of citizens this country requires to mainatin its technical and economic viability.* I want immigrants from countries with great educations and skill sets that respect the law, citizens from cultures that win Nobel prizes, not revolutions against the latest junta.* *


The illegals streaming in (mainly from Mexico) are for the most part poorly educated will become a net burden on the country for at least two generations.* I lived in Mexico, speak perfect spanish, and am of latin extraction, so this is not from a racist view.* Mexico and the US have been in a war for land in the southwest for two centuries.* Illegal immigration by Mexicans is an effective long term strategy of Mexican occupation to advance reconquista of US resources.* It's presented as a refuge issue, and sold as 'those poor' campasinos willing to stream across the Arizona desert just for a living wage.* THIS IS AN INVASION FROM MEXICO, NOT A HUMANITARIAN EVENT.* WE DESERVE THE RIGHT TO SELECT WHO COMES INTO THE UNITED STATES, NOT VICENTE FOX OR SOME OTHER THIRD WORLD DESPOT. I have meet Phds in Poland that have legally applied to immigrate into the US and can carry their weight the day they are allowed to work here.* They can not get a visa, while the low caste Mexicans (and the rest of latin America) are rewarded for braking the law and overloading the welfare systems.* They are a net burden, despite the cheap source of low skilled labor.

ANY OF YOU WHO SEEK TO REWARD ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION WITH THE RIGHTS OF CITIZENSHIP, you are wrong, wrong wrong to suggest that rewarding illegal immigration is somehow offset by the hard working vigor of Mexicans.* There are millions in Asia, Russia, and many other places who deserve the same oppurtunity to apply and be fairly considered for legal immigration.*

If we are to allow immigration it should be based on merit, the process of law, and NOT the corruption and CULTURAL/TERRITORIAL war underway on boths sides of the US/Mexican border.

NOW, PLEASE FLAME THIS POST.* *ILLUSTRATE YOUR VALUES AND ETHICS FOR ALL TO EXAMINE.*

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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 11:02 AM   #75
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Thanks, Lex.

You're a brave man to post such a brutally honest message here. The truth in your post will be too much for many posters here to tolerate. You will be called a liar, a racist, and worse. Don't let it bother you. Consider the source. This is, for the most part, a politically liberal website.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 11:17 AM   #76
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Art
This is, for the most part, a politically liberal website.
Actually Art, this is an Early Retirement website.
And if you want my sources to verify that, just check out the URL at the top of your screen.

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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 11:19 AM   #77
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Sticks and stones may break my bones,
but whips and chains excite me!!!
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 11:24 AM   #78
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Quote:
Originally Posted by REWahoo!
Actually Art, this is an Early Retirement website.*
Actually REW, this is an Early Retirement website whose members are, for the most part, politically liberal.

And if you want my sources to verify that, just read the posts.
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 11:40 AM   #79
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

Flame, flame, flame.

Over at one of one my other retiree places (mostly engineers) - have a buddy from the old plant - Mexican American whose ancestors (CA, CO) were here BEFORE America. He sides with Art and Lex. Tough neighborhood to be a liberal.

My ancestors ( a reasonible fraction thereof) came as uneducated 'Swedish maids' and the Finns - ahead of the Russian draft board - Siberia service and Aganistan weren't all that popular in the late 1800's. Still liked Rudyard Kipling - Brits and Russia were rivals.

My two cents - Between Homeland Security and the current Immigration laws/level of enforcement - expect a long learning curve - with a lot of screaming and yelling along the way.

The Maine wasps and odd German or two - don't even count - not very interesting - AND not one Norwegian. I understand that genelogy is a big hobby for many retiree's.

Back (1990's) when I was collecting baseball caps - got three from final bidders on border radar via one of my doughnut shop buddies. Haven't seen a Coast Guard cutter hiding in the entrance passes with 50 cal deck guns in years - don't fish that much anymore. For them - the drug smugglers were always more fun.

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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!
Old 07-04-2005, 12:16 PM   #80
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Re: Numbnuts thinks ILLEGAL aliens are good for us!

When Homeland security does the post mortem of a serious terrorist event and finds the WMD (Biologic or radiological source material) came up through Mexico, the border might become a military issue and securing it an issue with momentum. Until then expect the Democrats to harvest the Alien votes through fraudulent voter registration and welfare paybacks, and the Republicans to harvest the cheap labor in exchange for their Agricultural and Construction PAC funding.





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