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Old 11-12-2014, 05:04 PM   #121
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One would ordinarily expect the number of UFO sightings/photos to increase roughly on pace with the increasing number of cameras around, but that has not occurred...
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Old 11-12-2014, 05:15 PM   #122
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One would ordinarily expect the number of UFO sightings/photos to increase roughly on pace with the increasing number of cameras around, but that has not occurred...
... and no increased sightings of Loch Ness monster, Yeti, unicorn, ...
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Old 11-12-2014, 05:32 PM   #123
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The reason we don't see more UFO's or alien ships with more and better tech gear is because we can't get our faces off the smart phones and I Pads!
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Old 11-12-2014, 05:42 PM   #124
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:04 PM   #125
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We have detected many planets orbiting other stars by either radial velocity measurements, observing the shifts in the spectrum of light from the star caused by the orbiting planet, or by occultation.....the planet passing between us and the star and dimming the apparent brightness of the star. A few exoplanets have actually been directly imaged by the new generation of large telescopes and some spectra taken to allow some conclusions to be made about the chemical composition of their atmospheres.

I have no idea whether there is "life out there"...the ingredients are there, but until I see actual evidence I'm agnostic about it. Believing in aliens is just like believing in God, both are possible....but you won't get me to say either exist without actual proof, but I will say the arguments for one are better than the other.
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:12 PM   #126
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If you Google "space aliens in the middle ages" (or, something like that) you will find that our ancestors were visited as well.
Now we are expected to believe Google as well?
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:25 PM   #127
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Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
I was going to say exactly that and attribute it to Richard Dawkins. Glad you made the statement first.
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:27 PM   #128
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...


So do you believe these stories or not? You say you aren't necessarily believing in them...but then you say that all of them cannot be hoaxes (which implies that at least one is true - but that then begs the question "how do you know which wild fantasy is actually true, and which of the wild fantasies are hoaxes?")

And funny how all of these cases are in the last 50 years or so. Guess the aliens just happened to start showing up then? Or they didn't care about investigating us back in the middle ages, or earlier civilization times?

And are all of these reports about the same alien race? Do they have the same spacecraft? Or does our planet double as the intergalatic alien interchange where various alien civilizations visit us all at the same time, as I doubt all of these 'eyewitnesses' would describe the same aliens, exact same spacecraft, etc.

Suppose all of these stories are true - you want us to believe that the aliens came all that way to leave a burn mark on someone's stomach? Or to probe someone's rectum? Then turn around and disappear? No need to communicate with or probe any of the other world's 6 billion residents?

If they have a need to travel all that distance to examine us, why not communicate with us? Why these sporadic, handful of allegations? If you're going to make contact like that, why stop? And if they did want to examine us discretely, they are able to bend the fabric of space/time for their space travel - yet they can't wander around our planet without going unnoticed....except by people out in the middle of nowhere?

And let's take a quick look at just one random pick from your list:

Michelak case of 1967 in Canada

Ah, yes. An advanced alien civilization that can travel through wormholes or travel at faster than the speed of light has a spaceship with mere "blinking lights"...just like on a 1960s computer! Guess that special effects team on the 1970s Star Trek series weren't that far off with their infamous "blinking lights" that controlled the Enterprise! All you need are a few lights to turn on or off to maintain a ship traveling through wormholes. Advanced warp drives and other technological feats by alien races apparently do not accompany advanced communication display or controls technologies.

It "melted" his glove? I presume it wasn't a metallic glove, and rather a cotton or 'rough denim'-like glove. I highly doubt it dissolved the glove like a solvent would, and rather was so hot that it vaporized his glove -but at either rate, is he suggesting he had his glove partially pulled off of his hand? If he was wearing his glove like a normal person would, and if his finger was at the tip of the glove, when the glove tip dissolves/evaporates, why didn't his fingertip also evaporate? If the glove evaporated from extreme heat, then the gases would partially rise up inside his glove and burn his fingertip. If the glove 'dissolved' magically from solvents or chemical reaction, then why didn't his fingertip also meet the same fate? Or is he suggesting he somehow has a .001 second reaction time and somehow knew that his glove was 'dissolving' the absolute split second it came into contact with the UFO, so he didn't continue pushing forward with his fingertip? And if it was hot enough to incinerate his glove....wouldn't he feel the heat emanating from it before he touched it?

Oh, and funny how it dissolved his glove, yet doesn't do anything to the soil on the ground that it's sitting on.



Let me get this straight - a blast of "hot air" hit his shirt and it was so hot that it caught his outer and UNDER shirt "on fire" (and apparently left circle burns on his stomach)...yet, this same blast of hot air didn't do anything after it hit his shirt? (i.e. didn't partly deflect up and burn his face?) A story said he had 'redness' on his face...but if just air was directed at his shirt and 'caught it on fire', I would expect that air to be hot enough to actually burn his face as well.

Also - and more importantly - he describes the holes as being 1/16" diameter?!!? Do you realize what would happen if you had a series of holes that small with hot gas being pushed through it? It would diffuse similarly to one liquid being diffused through similar holes into another fluid (for visualization). In other words, the gases would slow down in velocity, and the gases themselves would spread out in shape. The alleged round circles that burned his shirt and his skin would never be caused by holes that would maintain that perfectly spherical shape - unless his shirt was touching the actual holes (which it doesn't say it was).

And what's with the "rush of air as it ascended"? An object with no 'exhaust ports' and no apparent means of combustion has a need to move air as it ascends? Funny that he never mentioned any rushing air as it DEscended in the beginning. Yes, it initially descended "160 feet away", but you would both feel and hear it similar to how it would have ascended.

So his shirt - which was just smouldering - somehow caught moss on fire? Looking at the pictures of his shirt for the cover of his book, there's no way in hell a few tiny burn circles on a cotton shirt would catch moss on fire.
Without hard evidence there will always be those who question whether something actually happened.I understand completely this thought.This does not change the possibility it could of happened or even did happen.I allready admit I have no evidence any of these cases actually happened.Yet the eyewitnesses and testimony and physical evidence is there.If you want to believe in the possibility that any one of the cases happened great.If you don't that is fine also.It is not my responsibility to prove or disprove any of this.I think it is possible.I have no problems with someone who does not think so.I afford you the right to believe what you want to without question,why am I also not afforded that same right?
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:39 PM   #129
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Now we are expected to believe Google as well?
Well, not Google. But Google gives you links to stories (in this case alien sightings/interactions/behaviors/disgusting habits) in the Middle Ages (and previous to the Middle Ages).

But, I am a bit skeptical about some of these stories, especially the one that mentions that the aliens' favorite meal was celery with cream cheese on it. To further complicate things, there seems to be a series of sand paintings backing this claim. Interestingly enough, in the paintings, the space aliens don't appear to using their own orifices while eating. But, perhaps that's just the artist's interpretation.
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:46 PM   #130
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The celery sounds like maybe the aliens were the tree cats from the Honorverse!
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:51 PM   #131
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It is not my responsibility to prove or disprove any of this.I think it is possible.I have no problems with someone who does not think so.I afford you the right to believe what you want to without question,why am I also not afforded that same right?
Of course you have a right to believe what you believe and to say so on this forum. I do believe though that the world suffers materially from this type of thinking. Take the Ebola epidemic in west Africa. Many people there believe in superstitions or don't trust government authority or science and are influenced by conspiracy theories. This goes beyond just having an opinion that might be right. In their case it could kill yourself or your neighbor.

It is easy for us to talk about aliens from another planet because there are no real consequences to what each of us believe. But how people think about these things and other issues does matter. In this country is leads people to not vaccinate their children or to believe that cell phones are giving them brain cancer or that smart meters are making them sick . . . and then there is fluoridated water . . .

Hence the relatively strong opinions on this issue here.
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Old 11-12-2014, 08:48 PM   #132
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The celery sounds like maybe the aliens were the tree cats from the Honorverse!
Had to Google "Honorverse". Glad I learned something today.
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:08 PM   #133
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...It is easy for us to talk about aliens from another planet because there are no real consequences to what each of us believe. ...
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...
... you want us to believe that the aliens came all that way to leave a burn mark on someone's stomach? Or to probe someone's rectum? Then turn around and disappear? No need to communicate with or probe any of the other world's 6 billion residents?...
If they have a need to travel all that distance to examine us,...
Well, martyp, of course there are real consequences to what each of us believe. I mean, wouldn't it boost your self-esteem immensely if some alien came eight zillion miles and picked out your rectum to be probed over the world's remaining six billion rectums (minus one)? I bet you couldn't wipe that grin off of your face. Talk about feeling special. Isn't that an important consequence?
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:12 PM   #134
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:25 PM   #135
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I look at the "Are we alone" question from a another angle...

Do we believe in a Deity? Angels? Ghosts? Life after death?

A lot of folks who are considered rational do believe. If those things do exist, IMO, to believe that we are not alone is not a far stretch at all.
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:29 PM   #136
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Do we believe in a Deity? Angels? Ghosts? Life after death?
No. No. No. No.
Did I pass?
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:32 PM   #137
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No. No. No. No.
Did I pass?
Yep. You passed. Nothing wrong with not believing either.

Like the part in "Dead Poets Society" where Keating asks his students to walk their own way, and the one student choses not to participate and Keating says that is fine. To choose not to choose, is also a choice.

Here we go:

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Old 11-12-2014, 09:48 PM   #138
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Yep. Nothing wrong with not believing either.
What?!
A Voice of Reason?!
I don't know how to react to that, so I will choose FEAR!
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:59 PM   #139
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This thread got me reading on synthetic biology (because I was curious about the current ability or lack thereof to create artificial biological life).

They are closer than I thought. They have constructed a several million base pair DNA strand and inserted it into a cleaned out cell which "came alive" and started to replicate under command of the DNA.

Probably no more than a decade away at most from a true artificial cell.

That is probably the singularity. Someone will engineer a cell that can replicate and interface to a digital computer, sensors, and other similar cells in a known fashion. A brain made of these cells will be grown that has a much greater capacity for learning than humans. Skynet.
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:17 PM   #140
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That is probably the singularity. Someone will engineer a cell that can replicate and interface to a digital computer, sensors, and other similar cells in a known fashion. A brain made of these cells will be grown that has a much greater capacity for learning than humans.
Nations and coalitions of nations will build competing synthetic brains to outdo each other--outbet their stock markets, outstategize their strategists. The competition will boil down to the number of neural connections, or synapses, each megabrain has. We'll try to keep up with the Russians, but it's possible they will pull ahead. We'll have a synaptic gap.
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