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Old 11-16-2012, 09:48 AM   #61
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Not only no, but I refuse to contribute to what retailers are doing to their employees these days. Forcing them to work on Thanksgiving? Starting work on Black Friday at 4 AM? (No doubt the executives making these decisions will not be working then.) No penny in potential profit can be left on the table as long as it's possible to get it by increasingly abuse your employees with the terrible job market as leverage.
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Old 11-16-2012, 02:37 PM   #62
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Not only no, but I refuse to contribute to what retailers are doing to their employees these days. Forcing them to work on Thanksgiving? Starting work on Black Friday at 4 AM? (No doubt the executives making these decisions will not be working then.) No penny in potential profit can be left on the table as long as it's possible to get it by increasingly abuse your employees with the terrible job market as leverage.
Wal-Mart management called. They'd like to have a word with you:
Wal-Mart Workers' Black Friday Strike - Businessweek
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Old 11-16-2012, 08:53 PM   #63
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The only time in my life (that I can remember, but that is a different thread) I went out shopping on Black Friday, is when our Micro Wave quit working. One of my favorite things about Thanksgiving, is leftovers the day after. We had a new one purchased and installed (over the stove model), in the nick of time.

Priorities, Priorities.
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Old 11-18-2012, 06:11 AM   #64
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DW and I had a too-close brush with it yesterday. Since we were literally driving right past it we stopped in an outlet mall for mundane things like socks and underwear. That's all we wanted. It's usually nice to go there, not crowded, plenty of parking, etc.

The crowds were astonishing! There were three busloads unloading and the parking lot was about 7/8 full. We went in, bought what we'd come for, high-tailed it out of there as fast as we could, and resolved to not go near the place until January at the soonest.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:20 AM   #65
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Not only no, but I refuse to contribute to what retailers are doing to their employees these days. Forcing them to work on Thanksgiving? Starting work on Black Friday at 4 AM? (No doubt the executives making these decisions will not be working then.) No penny in potential profit can be left on the table as long as it's possible to get it by increasingly abuse your employees with the terrible job market as leverage.
I agree. I don't like the idea of having these odd hours be a condition of employment, especially when it is time for family to be together, and it seems the best thing I can do is not support it, and encourage others to not support it.

This might sound like I'm waffling on my 'free market' stance - we might say that if the workers don't like it, they can find another job. But most things are not an all-or-nothing for me, there are places where regs/rules are appropriate. This may not be a big enough deal by itself to motivate workers leaving in large numbers, which is what it would take to force change, but maybe that gives the employer a bit too much leverage?

I'd feel better about it if they asked for volunteers, and ran the sale based on the number that sign up. From what I hear, there are a significant number of workers that want the extra pay, so that's OK for them. It would be a good PR move too.

And of course, some occupations require people to work through odd holiday hours (fire, police, hospital, etc), and you can also say that retail fits this as the workers know it's part of the deal. So it's not straight-forward.

I also worked a lot of OT for long periods, sometimes it was mostly self-motivated to get ahead, other times there was a very definite pressure to 'do it or else'. I didn't like that. I don't like to see others put in that position either.

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Old 11-18-2012, 09:41 AM   #66
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I have to admit that this thread made me look at a calendar and get my assets in gear.

Monday I'm driving down to Ala Moana to have three of my mother's rings appraised. We want to have a discussion about them with our daughter when she's home on Christmas break, but her entire break will be a terrible time to go to Ala Moana.

Tuesday I'm driving up to the North Shore to check out Chun's Reef and Jock's Break buy a long-sleeve high-neck 2mm neoprene jacket. Then the rest of the lineup won't have to listen to me whimpering when I paddle out.

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DW and I had a too-close brush with it yesterday. Since we were literally driving right past it we stopped in an outlet mall for mundane things like socks and underwear.
You went to a commercial facility on a weekend?!?
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:01 AM   #67
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No way will I shop on this day. I am appalled that people go out and knock each other over to get sale merchandise and get nasty the day after giving thanks for all they have.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:15 AM   #68
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That way I see it, from the stores' perspective, The Black Friday sale is about the "Holy Dollar". A good or bad selling season during the holidays can make or break a business. From the customers, I can't help but feel that they are like lemmings, following one another off the cliff hunting for a bargain. Last year, I was one of the lemmings and did snare the deal I was looking for. But they hustle and bustle and fighting for positioning in the store wasn't worth it for me. For some, they like the battle, but I'll pass on that .
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:31 AM   #69
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Not only no, but I refuse to contribute to what retailers are doing to their employees these days. Forcing them to work on Thanksgiving? Starting work on Black Friday at 4 AM? (No doubt the executives making these decisions will not be working then.) No penny in potential profit can be left on the table as long as it's possible to get it by increasingly abuse your employees with the terrible job market as leverage.
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That way I see it, from the stores' perspective, The Black Friday sale is about the "Holy Dollar". A good or bad selling season during the holidays can make or break a business. From the customers, I can't help but feel that they are like lemmings, following one another off the cliff hunting for a bargain. Last year, I was one of the lemmings and did snare the deal I was looking for. But they hustle and bustle and fighting for positioning in the store wasn't worth it for me. For some, they like the battle, but I'll pass on that.
I agree with both posts. Interesting but sad how these two thoughts go together. If the mainstream "we" would ever simply act on their (hollow) "outrage" - merchants would undoubtedly comply. Whatever you think about merchants motives, they're no better or worse than the rabid shoppers. The shoppers clearly don't give a hoot about store employees working holidays or crazy hours. Once again, 'we get what we deserve...'
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:05 AM   #70
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No way!
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:54 PM   #71
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BJs sent us coupons for "Black Friday Weekend" specials - Nov. 23/24/25.

I'm sure other merchants will follow suit. Why have just one retailer-created crazy sale day, when you can have 3?

Though now that I think of it, the "horror" is not that retailers create sale days. They are only trying to make a living. The "horror" is how the hoi polloi behave when offered a sale. And you don't have to be an INTJ to want to avoid it.

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Old 11-18-2012, 01:12 PM   #72
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We usually go early when it's easy to pickpocket.
but now that the openings will be at 8PM on Thursday won't be able to make it... Just can't stay up that late.
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Old 11-18-2012, 03:47 PM   #73
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Clearly a segment of the population gets all jazzed up by the idea of a wild massively crowded shopping and frenzied experience. Are these the same folks who go to casinos? Maybe they think they're getting something special that day that is otherwise unavailable. I don't get it because it sounds like a nightmare to me.

BTW, Black Friday is the only day that Apple gives discounts, but you can still shop on line. I think you might be able to get some of those discounts from other retailers, however, during the year.
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:30 PM   #74
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What is there that we need to buy? We have not been inside a shopping mall in years! We do not even shop online.

However, this thread reminded me that about this time last year I was surfing the Web looking to get a replacement for my laptop that croaked all of a sudden. I kept waiting for better deals, just to see the one that I wanted got sold out. I ended up going to BestBuy to get one that they had on sale.
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:35 PM   #75
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No, but I'm not a shopper.
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Old 11-18-2012, 06:00 PM   #76
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No way. Made that mistake 6 years ago, wasn't worth the aggravation of waiting two hours to pay!
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Old 11-18-2012, 07:57 PM   #77
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Clearly a segment of the population gets all jazzed up by the idea of a wild massively crowded shopping and frenzied experience.
Sounds like a bunch of ESFPs, we here know how *shudder* THEY are. ;-) http://www.personalitypage.com/ESFP.html
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:23 AM   #78
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You went to a commercial facility on a weekend?!?
Yeah, well, we all have our moments of lunacy.
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