Credit/debit card skimmers

[SkisALot]

They will blame the merchant.

In my case, the merchant said the gas was pumped (and showed a receipt for it) so we are liable no matter who did it. The CC company wanted evidence that we did not pump the gas.
Huh? How do you show a receipt for something you didn't get?

 

[SkisALot]

Sorry my above post was muddled. I was referring to our gas pump experience that I posted about (Beware of Gas Pumps) in which the pump malfunctioned, keeping our credit card open so that the person behind us used our CC card to pump gas.

 

[mpeirce]

I think the only decent solution is where the cc information changes as it's used. I know the technology is there, just not very widely used...yet.

I favor merchants where I can use Apple Pay. They never get their hands on my CC number.

There are a surprising number of smaller merchants that can accept Apple Pay. They have new terminals where the NFC is enabled and it "just works". My dry cleaner for example, "I see you have a terminal with NFC, I'll bet I can pay with my phone." "Really? Go ahead a try...." Worked like a charm.


https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT203027

After you use Touch ID or enter your passcode on iPhone, or double-click the side button on Apple Watch at a payment terminal, the Secure Element provides your Device Account Number and a transaction-specific dynamic security code. This information is sent along with additional information needed to complete the transaction to the store’s point of sale terminal. Neither Apple nor your device sends your credit or debit card number. Before they approve the payment, your bank or payment network can verify your payment information by checking the dynamic security code to make sure it’s unique and that it’s tied to your device.

 

[audreyh1]

I've had numerous incidents when my credit card had to be replaced due to fraud. Never had a fraudulent charge challenged.

 

[Alan]

I've had numerous incidents when my credit card had to be replaced due to fraud. Never had a fraudulent charge challenged.

Same experience here.


Last time it happened was when my card was cloned and the the thieves racked up $23k in 2 days worth of charges before I spotted it. Big hassle as we were in Europe on vacation at the time the cloned card was being used in stores in New York and Atlanta, but every $ was refunded.

 

[bingybear]

I'm unclear about skimmers. If there is a skimmer on the gas pump, will it keep my card from working on the pump card reader? Thinking I wouldn't be able to push it far enough in......

the gas pump skimmer connects to the circuitry inside and reads the info while it goes to the gas pump circuitry. So you would never know as the pump would work as normal.

 

[gauss]

is the chip going to help with this issue?

Probably not for a while in that if the CC companies will still authorize purchases based on mag strip data (such as online purchases), then this info can still be skimmed even if the card has an emv chip.

If merchants eventually cease taking mag stripe data or card numbers for purchases and instead require something like Apple Pay or some other tokenized system where the actual cardholder info isn't used in the transaction then this hole in the system will start to close.


-gauss

 

[Elbata]

Youtube video about this:

 

[Alan]

If merchants eventually cease taking mag stripe data or card numbers for purchases and instead require something like Apple Pay or some other tokenized system where the actual cardholder info isn't used in the transaction then this hole in the system will start to close.


-gauss

I was listening to a UK news item this week about payments to merchants and there has been a very rapid rise in the use of biometric payment devices such as ApplePay, and touch less cards for purchases under £30 ($50), meaning that much less cash is changing hands and sticking cards into machines is greatly reduced. I believe for touch less cards you are required to validate your purchases online every few days, and they are protected from fraudulent purchases in exactly the same way as regular credit card payments.

 

[SkisALot]

I've had numerous incidents when my credit card had to be replaced due to fraud. Never had a fraudulent charge challenged.

That was our experience in the past too, with this same CC company. This time is different, even though they replaced our card with a new number. Another difference is the quality of the customer service. The "dispute specialist" has been extremely nasty.

 

[utrecht]

That was our experience in the past too, with this same CC company. This time is different, even though they replaced our card with a new number. Another difference is the quality of the customer service. The "dispute specialist" has been extremely nasty.

Surely you can understand why? Anyone could call them and say that they didnt get the gas that was pumped using their credit card. Your card was scanned and gas did get pumped. I believe you, as you have no reason to make this up, but it would sound pretty suspicious in general.

 

[audreyh1]

On ATM cards:

Last year I set up a separate bank account to use just for ATM withdrawals, to keep it separate from my regular account where I do all my bill paying, etc. This was mostly for international travel, but is an option to use in the U.S., and I might just start doing this.

I rarely use an ATM card in the U.S. We just don't use much cash.

Another alternative is to go inside the back and walk up to a teller to withdraw cash. It means waiting in line though.

 

[kcowan]

In my case, the merchant said the gas was pumped (and showed a receipt for it) so we are liable no matter who did it. The CC company wanted evidence that we did not pump the gas.
Huh? How do you show a receipt for something you didn't get?

I would try showing the bank my record of fill-ups while asking him to ID that receipt as mine.

 

[kcowan]

Surely you can understand why? Anyone could call them and say that they didnt get the gas that was pumped using their credit card. Your card was scanned and gas did get pumped. I believe you, as you have no reason to make this up, but it would sound pretty suspicious in general.

Although my bank treated me like a criminal, I was able to show that I had just filled up with gas on that card and that I never charge $400 for such purchases.

 

[MooreBonds]

I had a little bit of a scare recently with my bank's local ATM. About 18 months ago, they started putting stickers on the sides of the card scanners at their ATMs that had the bank's name on the sticker, and right after you swipe your card (and before you input your PIN), the screen asks "Do you see the bank sticker on the side of the card swiper?".

2 weeks ago, I went to my same bank ATM, and the sticker was gone (there was even the adhesive residue there where the sticker used to be), with a different card swiper installed. I was instantly suspicious, and tried swiping my card. I grew even more nervous when I noticed that the card swiper was VERY narrow, and I could barely get my card swiped in the slot (thinking someone put something over the swiper). The first screen didn't ask about the sticker, but instead asked me what language I wanted! Then, the next screen asked me to input my PIN, never asking about the swiper. At that point, I figured it was a legit reader....but I had a few nervous seconds there.

 

[mpeirce]

Square has introduced their contactless/chip reader. You insert a chip card into it or wave your contactless card/ApplePay/GoogleWallet/whateverNFC. It's $49, which isn't bad, but their old swiper thing was free (they actually still include one with the new reader).

I see lots of these (Square devices) at farmers markets and such. It's a cheap way to turn your iPhone/iPad into a credit card reader.

https://squareup.com/contactless-chip-reader

 

[utrecht]

Square has introduced their contactless/chip reader. You insert a chip card into it or wave your contactless card/ApplePay/GoogleWallet/whateverNFC. It's $49, which isn't bad, but their old swiper thing was free (they actually still include one with the new reader).

I see lots of these (Square devices) at farmers markets and such. It's a cheap way to turn your iPhone/iPad into a credit card reader.

https://squareup.com/contactless-chip-reader

Those things cost $49 but the first $49 in fees using the new reader are free.

 

[explanade]

There's a liability shift with the onset of chipped cards.

Merchants who still use magnetic readers and are hacked are liable.

Gas stations are exempted from this shift for another year or two while other merchants were suppose to have deployed EMV terminals by October.

Not sure if the CC companies will change the terms once enough locations take EMV cards. They might blame the card user for any hacks once they have chipped cards and most of the locations take chipped cards.

 

[winger]

Noticed this on the internet. Police say skimmer fraud is exploding

Use of Credit Card 'Skimmers' at Gas Stations, ATMs is Exploding - NBC News

 

[gauss]

There's a liability shift with the onset of chipped cards.

Merchants who still use magnetic readers and are hacked are liable.

Or accept a stolen CC that is EMV enabled without using EMV hardware on the merchant end.

Not sure if the CC companies will change the terms once enough locations take EMV cards. They might blame the card user for any hacks once they have chipped cards and most of the locations take chipped cards.

Card holders are protected by current Federal law to limit responsibility for "billing errors". Also the card holder does not control if there is a chip in his/her card, nor how the merchant processes the card.

The liability shift is purely between the merchant and the relevant bank.

 

[HFWR]

My CU called yesterday to tell me my card had been compromised...

Guess they downloaded the stuff from the aforementioned skimmer; my name had to be the last one on the list. They're sending a new card.

 

[easysurfer]

Noticed this on the internet. Police say skimmer fraud is exploding

Use of Credit Card 'Skimmers' at Gas Stations, ATMs is Exploding - NBC News

Saw that report too last night. Crazy how someone could just get a master key for the gas pump and install the skimmer. Just as crazy with the worker doing a double swipe to steal the card info.

 

[gauss]

My CU called yesterday to tell me my card had been compromised...

Guess they downloaded the stuff from the aforementioned skimmer; my name had to be the last one on the list. They're sending a new card.

Or perhaps the CU had their own record of your card being used at the pump where the skimmer was installed and assumed every card was captured/compromised within a given window of dates.

-gauss

 

[audreyh1]

Or perhaps the CU had their own record of your card being used at the pump where the skimmer was installed and assumed every card was captured/compromised within a given window of dates.

-gauss

This skimmer was at his CU, not at a gas pump, FWIW.

 

[explanade]

Which ATMs these days do not have a camera?

How would they install a skimmer on an ATM without being caught, though who knows how far back they keep the videos.