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Old 03-17-2015, 10:33 AM   #41
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utrecht,

I notice you did not note any experience in kicking children out at 18. So how many have you kicked out at 18 and how are they all doing?

If you read some of the other posts in this thread you will find multiple instances of people in their 50s and 60s living with parents. I don't think this is a new problem.
I moved out and got my first apt at 18. I was working at Highland Appliance which has since gone out of business but was similar to Best Buy. My son, who lived with his mother moved out of his mother's house at about 21. Neither or us went to college. I joined the Army a few yrs later and went on to become a police officer. My son started as a waiter and worked his way up and now is a manager of a Chili's.

I have a 16 year old son. We will see how that goes but I can tell you how it wont go. I'm not advocating flat out kicking a kid out at 18, but if the only choices were kick them out at 18 or let them sponge off you for an undetermined long time, I would choose kick them out at 18. Its much healthier for them long term in most cases.
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Old 03-17-2015, 10:37 AM   #42
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Have a discussion with your daughter about what it costs to live with you every month. Things like, this is what we pay for electricity, water, sewer and trash pickup. You are 1/3 of the household but you certainly don't use 1/3 of this, more like 1/5th. Your groceries may run about $750, for example, but that includes things besides food. How much of that do you feel you should contribute? 1/4 to 1/5 of that may make sense. Same for things like internet and tv service. Include all the things that she'd have to pay for if she moved out on her own.
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Old 03-17-2015, 10:52 AM   #43
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I agree with other posts. Have your daughter start paying for some of her expenses ( prescriptions and cell phone come to mind). Then wok with her on a plan to transition more financial burdens to her. Maybe something like "starting now you are responsible for X and Y. In two months you need to start paying Z."

Our DDs are 25 and 23 years old, and off our payroll. That helps in FIRE.
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Old 03-17-2015, 10:59 AM   #44
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I don't consider that enabling. You're helping a sick child. I think that's admirable.

Never forget about all the very successful folks that have that disease. Ted Turner, Adam Ant, Dick Cavett, Mel Gibson..... some say Van Gogh and many others. Not saying it's easy but some have dealt with it and done well. Wish your DD all the best.
I, too, think it's admirable helping a sick adult child.

However, in the example above of those whom have done well, none of them are mothers with children. And, perhaps Mel Gibson and Van Gogh could have benefited from a bit more healthy parental guidance.
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Old 03-17-2015, 11:08 AM   #45
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I was "nudged" out of the nest at age 21 after my parents paid for my liberal arts degree. I agreed reluctantly with them it was probably the right thing to do. The words "tough love" were actually used. But wow, what a "welcome to the jungle" experience it was for me.
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Old 03-17-2015, 11:13 AM   #46
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OK add, Anna Marie Duke(Patty Duke) to the list. Carrie Fisher too.There's many more. Didn't mean to omit well known woman.
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Old 03-17-2015, 11:38 AM   #47
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OK add, Anna Marie Duke(Patty Duke) to the list. Carrie Fisher too.There's many more. Didn't mean to omit well known woman.
OK, just don't do it again!
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Old 03-17-2015, 11:41 AM   #48
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Patty Duke isn't bi-polar. She has multiple personality disorder
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Old 03-17-2015, 11:58 AM   #49
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This is one of those situations that at face value is easy - kick 'em out! give them an ultimatum! But you are usually dealing with more issues than just this, plus they are your kids. It's difficult, I know.

We did a similar approach to several who have commented here - let them know early on that they'd be on their own after college. Once college was over, they were more than happy to move out on their own, primarily so that they'd be completely independent. To ease their transition, I did give them money for one of the biggest expenses - the first six months of car insurance (about $600), but I gave the money to them and made them write the check to the insurance company (so it 'felt' like they were paying it). Never looked back. Also told them about three months in advance when cell phones would switch over to them, and asked if they understood why we were doing it. All were fine. Two down, one to go when he graduates in December. Pay raise in 2016!
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Old 03-17-2015, 12:03 PM   #50
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I agree with the general sentiment of setting boundaries and expectations, though blanket statements about "kids" must come from folks with no/one kid, because anyone with multiples would soon determine that they all have different personalities, and can't effectively be treated exactly the same...
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Old 03-17-2015, 12:06 PM   #51
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+1 it continually amazes me given the same parents, same home environment, same parenting, etc. how drastically different our children are. How the heck does that happen?
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Old 03-17-2015, 02:25 PM   #52
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+1 it continually amazes me given the same parents, same home environment, same parenting, etc. how drastically different our children are. How the heck does that happen?

Because evidently you didn't beat them hard enough to establish conformity and molding them into your true wishes!
Actually in the scheme of things, parenting is a bit overrated. Yes, you need to do the basics and all that, but they are going to determine the final outcome.
I love my daughter and we get along great, but my land she is a 180 degree polar opposite of me. I would have worn a box of belts out trying to get her to conform to my standards.


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Old 03-17-2015, 02:25 PM   #53
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Part of it is just the age. Long term planning, budgeting and career planning are hard issues for many mature adults let alone for young adults who may not have fully developed cerebral cortexes until they are 25.

Some suggest that the new cutoff point for adulthood should really be 25:

BBC News - Is 25 the new cut-off point for adulthood?

"There are three stages of adolescence - early adolescence from 12-14 years, middle adolescence from 15-17 years and late adolescence from 18 years and over. Neuroscience has shown that a young person's cognitive development continues into this later stage and that their emotional maturity, self-image and judgement will be affected until the prefrontal cortex of the brain has fully developed."
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Old 03-17-2015, 02:51 PM   #54
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Part of it is just the age. Long term planning, budgeting and career planning are hard issues for many mature adults let alone for young adults who may not have fully developed cerebral cortexes until they are 25.

Some suggest that the new cutoff point for adulthood should really be 25:

BBC News - Is 25 the new cut-off point for adulthood?

"There are three stages of adolescence - early adolescence from 12-14 years, middle adolescence from 15-17 years and late adolescence from 18 years and over. Neuroscience has shown that a young person's cognitive development continues into this later stage and that their emotional maturity, self-image and judgement will be affected until the prefrontal cortex of the brain has fully developed."
They forgot the 4th stage of adolescence - 50+ years and retired, no longer gives a sh!t and acts like an immature adolescent once again.
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Old 03-17-2015, 03:00 PM   #55
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They still have no problem sending 18 year olds into combat.
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Old 03-17-2015, 03:36 PM   #56
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No kids so not sticking my paddle in regarding the OP.
I am curious about the parents that charge rent and then give it back to their kids when they move out. Why? Don't you have to pay to replace their bedroom rug (don't know what made me think of that) , pay for heating and cooling, Internet access, electricity, food. Isn't this pretty much the same as letting them stay for free? Someone at work is doing this (collecting nominal rent/food money and then going o give back when son moves out) with their 20-something son and all they do is complain about the food bill and his buddies hanging out. Is it really just because it's your child and you don't want to be "harsh".
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Old 03-17-2015, 03:39 PM   #57
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I hear all these stories and am thankful DW and I started to set expectations for our two children early in their lives. They were told (repeatedly) from middle school on that barring a medical emergency they would be on their own three months after graduating from college (or dropping out). Should they wish to continue living at home after that they would be expected to pay both rent and for their share of the grocery bill. And they knew we meant it.



Worked like a charm.

+1

Our kids our still at home (14/15), but we've made it clear that we're willing to pay for their education and not much more. They have their own money/allowance and for any extras, they have to pay for it themselves.

So far our kids are looking forward to being on their own. They don't like our rules, even though we give them a lot of freedom. We may have instilled a bit too much independence in them. We'll see how well this experiment works out...
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Old 03-17-2015, 04:04 PM   #58
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First, let me say that not everyone is the same. That is, not all adult children (over the age of 18) are actually adults able to manage adult responsibilities. On the other hand, I do think the expectations become different as they get older and should be commensurate with what they are able to manage.

We are about to face some of this with our daughter. She will be finishing up a community college program in December when she is 19. She is also not mature for her age and is nowhere near ready to be out on her own.

What we have told her is the following:

1. She can stay as long as she wants if she follows house rules and meets financial commitments.

2. She will need to either have a job or be diligently looking for a job. If she can't find a full-time job in a reasonable period of time then she needs to find a part-time job to pay some of her expenses.

3. We will charge her an amount to cover the incremental cost of her living in the house, basically food and the utility costs from her being there. She isn't rent, but is to make us whole for the cost of having her in the house.

4. Her other expenses are hers to pay. Her prescriptions are her cost. Her auto expenses are hers (we will be giving her one of our older cars). Her clothing costs, etc.

5. She is expected to save up money so that when she is ready to move out she has money saved up for emergencies.

6. Now, in truth, if she had a major expense early in this (major car repair, for example) that her savings wouldn't cover we would probably advance the funds to her with her paying us back over time.

She is agreeable to all of the above.
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Old 03-17-2015, 04:10 PM   #59
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....I am curious about the parents that charge rent and then give it back to their kids when they move out. Why? Don't you have to pay to replace their bedroom rug (don't know what made me think of that) , pay for heating and cooling, Internet access, electricity, food. Isn't this pretty much the same as letting them stay for free? Someone at work is doing this (collecting nominal rent/food money and then going o give back when son moves out) with their 20-something son and all they do is complain about the food bill and his buddies hanging out. Is it really just because it's your child and you don't want to be "harsh".
For us it wasn't at all about the $400/month, it was about wanting to create an incentive for DS to move out and also having a mechanism to help him do so. While it definitely cost us more to have him live at home between electricity and groceries, etc. the main objective was to get him to move out and preserve our relationship with him. I figured once his "freedom account" got up to be a few thousand that he would be motivated to move out to have access to those funds.

To show you what little I know, he moved out and never asked for the money. In the end it was used to reimburse me for a cellphone I bought for him when his went through the wash, into his Roth IRA and then I recently wrote him a check for the little remaining balance. Since most of the balance ended up in his Roth, it was a great overall result.

I guess that I could have kept the money and later helped him out monetarily with things here and there and achieved the same result, but that is just the way we decided to do it.
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Old 03-17-2015, 04:28 PM   #60
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Some food for thought here.....getting them out on their own is certainly a task parents need to get done right. We did it and it was a spotty exercise. Everyone is different and all family dynamics are too.

On another note, we experienced three of our (DW's from her previous marriage) children getting divorced in a period of three years while they (really grown adults now) were married over 10 years each. While all the drama and family breakups were going on, DW allowed two of the daughters to move in with us for a period of time while the disasters were underway. All is over now and all parties are in their respective places, but return trips can be in the cards no matter how successful parents are in getting them out of the nest in the first place.

As far as the OP goes, she is getting a lot of good advice in this thread. Hang in there, and work your plan.
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