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Old 01-11-2014, 04:24 PM   #21
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I have not had much field experience with the iPhone GPS, but so far it often pinpoints the location in my home to the right bedroom! My Garmin occasionally has trouble locking on to GPS signal inside the home due to roof penetration attenuation, but this may be due to it being an older unit.

As explained earlier, I still keep my waterproof Garmin GPS for outdoor activities, and the netbook-displayed big map for RV driving. But most people do not have these needs...
Lest people think I am an exaggerating liar but too polite to say it, I will add something here.

I downloaded the free app Google Maps to supplement the built-in map, because I read that the former could cache maps for use when the data link was not available. What I saw was that when zoomed in, the Google map showed the outline of each home. And my position is pinpointed fairly accurately within my home outline, within 5 ft I would say.

I have a 2-bedroom addition, and that is reflected in the outline which is different than those of my neighbors. Google must have generated that from satellite pictures. They constantly amaze me with things like that. Google maps on PCs also have home outlines now, which I swear was not there before.

Anyway, I will not turn into one of those youngsters like my children who constantly pull their phones out and swipe them with their fingers, but I can now see how a smartphone can be a Swiss-knife thing to have handy.
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Old 01-11-2014, 04:30 PM   #22
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Lest people think I am an exaggerating liar but too polite to say it, I will add something here.

I downloaded the free app Google Maps to supplement the built-in map, because I read that the former could cache maps for use when the data link was not available. What I saw was that when zoomed in, the Google map showed the outline of each home. And my position is pinpointed fairly accurately within my home outline, within 5 ft I would say.....

Made me look . In satellite view where it is photographic google maps puts me exactly where I am using this tablet. In non-satellite view, where I do see the outline of my house, it puts me in my neighbor's house. Weird.
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Old 01-11-2014, 04:32 PM   #23
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[QUOTE=Live And Learn;1402058
I also no longer have a stereo system. I generally use my mp3 player with a single cord to a mini boom box for external music, or I use my headphones.[/QUOTE]
My CD Player attached to the stereo died as did the tape player. I had a spare laptop, and now use it to feed the amp. I guess one could use an MP3 player as well. One nice thing compared to tapes or cd's or let alone vinyl is play times can be far far longer. I then bought a usb turntable and digitized the vinyl records as well. So the vinyl is now an archive media. If your old enough to have had vinyl and still have it, consider this a usb turntable and free software allows you to digitize the record, and never again have to risk the vinyl disk.
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Old 01-11-2014, 04:36 PM   #24
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I looked again. Satellite view or home outline, it still puts me in my bedroom where I am (I would be in big trouble finding myself in the neighbor's bedroom, I think).

However, when I first turned it on, it put me in the driveway. Then, 5 seconds later, it jumped to the more correct position.

PS. Uh oh! Spoke too soon. I am outside the home now, and in the backyard. About to fall in the pool now...

PPS. Does this thing store position by default? Need to find out and turn it off. What if my wife looks at my phone and sees that I was "wandering" over to the neighbor's house? How would I explain that?
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Old 01-11-2014, 04:43 PM   #25
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.... Besides that, does anybody actually use a built-in conventional oven any more, other than ladies baking mountains of cookies and pies? With all the great countertop devices (microwaves, electric grills, electric woks, toaster ovens, and more) I just don't think the built-in conventional ovens can compete, especially for those watching our weight.
It is hard to make homemade bread in a toaster oven. We use our oven quite often, with an added bonus that out house is so tight that it actually increases the warmth of the great room a few degrees.
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Old 01-11-2014, 04:47 PM   #26
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I looked again. Satellite view or home outline, it still puts me in my bedroom where I am (I would be in big trouble finding myself in the neighbor's bedroom, I think).

However, when I first turned it on, it put me in the driveway. Then, 5 seconds later, it jumped to the more correct position.
This puts a whole new twist on what my Uncle Guido used to say to people who annoyed him, "We know where you live."
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Old 01-11-2014, 04:52 PM   #27
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...
My CD player, OTOH, I wouldn't replace. Everything has been ripped to mp3 format and that's all I buy now, as I listen to my mp3 player on the run or connect it to my stereo, or listen on my PC.
...
I have not been replacing audio CD players as they die. But I still need the CD reader in a computer, and I still purchase music on CDs.

I don't want to pay for mp3 compressed music, so for most music, the only option is for me to buy the CD, rip it lossless format (FLAC), and store the file on a hard drive. The CD goes on a shelf.

I either play from the hard drive with a computer (my old worn out netbook) with a USB DAC connected for hi-quality sound, played through a good amp and good speakers, or copy the files to a player (maybe compressing to 192Kbps ogg format for casual listening). It sure is nice having all the music in my library accessible with a few keystrokes.

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Old 01-11-2014, 05:09 PM   #28
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I see wristwatches as a dying device.

I'm not in the same camp as others here claiming the decline of GPS - lots of new things continually coming out to keep this technology going for decades.

Cameras? Possibly a decline in sales due to smartphones, but cameras will be around as long as they outperform the phones.

Personal computers - Decline due to tablets but will be around as they outperform tablets for the stay at home person.

Stereos, DVD players, land phone lines - yep they're dying.

If one really thinks about it, doorbells, conventional garage door openers, appliances, lawn mowers, furnaces, etc - almost everything is being tweaked by technology and the former designs are being discontinued
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:14 PM   #29
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I'm not in the same camp as others here claiming the decline of GPS - lots of new things continually coming out to keep this technology going for decades.
I read the OP's comments as a reference to stand-alone GPS devices, like a Garmin. I agree with you that GPS based technology is here to stay - if an asteroid doesn't come along and wipe out all those satellites.
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:17 PM   #30
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I looked again. Satellite view or home outline, it still puts me in my bedroom where I am (I would be in big trouble finding myself in the neighbor's bedroom, I think).

However, when I first turned it on, it put me in the driveway. Then, 5 seconds later, it jumped to the more correct position.

PS. Uh oh! Spoke too soon. I am outside the home now, and in the backyard. About to fall in the pool now...

PPS. Does this thing store position by default? Need to find out and turn it off. What if my wife looks at my phone and sees that I was "wandering" over to the neighbor's house? How would I explain that?
I don't know how the phones do it, but one's position determined by GPS is generally determined by the strength of the constellation oF GPS satellites being tracked at a specific time. If there are 12 satellites more than 15 degrees above the horizon that are being tracked, the dot on your screen will be more accurate than if there were only 3 satellites. The number of available satellites varies during the day, so the position can jump around a bit.
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:27 PM   #31
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I read the OP's comments as a reference to stand-alone GPS devices, like a Garmin. I agree with you that GPS based technology is here to stay - if an asteroid doesn't come along and wipe out all those satellites.
I agree that the little handhelds may be used less - I have a Garmin Etrex and my iPhone now does the same thing. So my etrex sits in the drawer. But Garmin has a good foothold in mapping for cars/planes, etc, so they should be ok.

If asteroids hit most of the GPS satellites, I agree - we'll have some big problems
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:37 PM   #32
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I don't know how the phones do it, but one's position determined by GPS is generally determined by the strength of the constellation oF GPS satellites being tracked at a specific time. If there are 12 satellites more than 15 degrees above the horizon that are being tracked, the dot on your screen will be more accurate than if there were only 3 satellites. The number of available satellites varies during the day, so the position can jump around a bit.
All GPS receivers are basically the same, but there are enhanced features. My rather old Garmin has WAAS, while your surveyor-quality GPS has a dedicated link for differential correction.

I do not know if the iPhone GPS has WAAS or not (need to search the Web), but have read that it uses augmentation from cellular base station triangulation. Of course one needs to log long data record for analysis, but off-hand I usually do not see my old Garmin jumping 20 ft like the iPhone just did.

PS. Nope. iPhone GPS does not have WAAS. Not even in iPhone 5.
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:44 PM   #33
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Makes me wonder what things will be like in 30 years:

"Wow, you still use a third generation direct neural interface? You should check out the new ones they have now"
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:46 PM   #34
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I read the OP's comments as a reference to stand-alone GPS devices, like a Garmin. I agree with you that GPS based technology is here to stay - if an asteroid doesn't come along and wipe out all those satellites.
It may not get the satellites on the way in, but it will take out the locations and the people using GPS's. Then in 200 million years + or - 100 million, the dinosaurs will be back.
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:52 PM   #35
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t, does anybody actually use a built-in conventional oven any more, other than ladies baking mountains of cookies and pies? With all the great countertop devices (microwaves, electric grills, electric woks, toaster ovens, and more) I just don't think the built-in conventional ovens can compete, especially for those watching our weight.
I use my oven a decent amount . I bake chicken,turkey ,salmon , ham, assorted casseroles , pork barbecue, homemade pizzas ,banana bread and I use the broiler for shrimp or chicken scampi .SO makes the cookies .
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:54 PM   #36
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All GPS receivers are basically the same, but there are enhanced features. My rather old Garmin has WAAS, while your surveyor-quality GPS has a dedicated link for differential correction.

I do not know if the iPhone GPS has WAAS or not (need to search the Web), but have read that it uses augmentation from cellular base station triangulation. Of course one needs to log long data record for analysis, but off-hand I usually do not see my old Garmin jumping 20 ft like the iPhone just did.

PS. Nope. iPhone GPS does not have WAAS. Not even in iPhone 5.
What you say makes sense. It makes sense that they use cellular triangulation to augment the position - after all it is a phone. But I didn't know they they didn't use WAAS. They wouldn't need the cellular triangulation if they had WAAS. Oh Well, I guess its ok GPS for a phone. I haven't got lost with it yet. I just found this on apple's site:

"the iPhone does have a GPS receiver, and has since the iPhone 3G. And as Rudegar pointed out, the iPhone also has A-GPS capability, which lets the GPS receiver determine its current location much faster than normal. Without A-GPS, the GPS receiver has to wait -- sometimes multiple minutes -- before it can determine its location, because it doesn't know where the satellites are. A-GPS allows the phone to download satellite almanac data over the cellular network, so the GPS receiver can immediately know where all the satellites are. A-GPS is not necessary, however, for GPS operation -- even if you have no cellular service, you can still use the GPS receiver in the iPhone. I have done this many times, so I have no idea why your friends have had trouble. I recommend the MotionX GPS app, and it works really well out in the woods. You can even download offline map data.

But what the iPhone does NOT have is WAAS capability. The GPS receiver works by measuring how long it takes for the radio signals to propagate between the satellites and the receiver. The propagation time varies based on the current density of the atmosphere between each satellite and the receiver. Because of the density flucuations, a standard GPS receiver can only get a fix that is accurate to about 10 meters. However, some geostationary satellites transmit atmospheric density information that lets GPS receivers compensate for current atmospheric conditions, and this enables accuracies in the neighborhood of about 1 meter. Garmin has had WAAS capable receivers for years, as have other hand-held and aviation-based GPS receivers, so it is a bit surprising that Apple has not incorporated WAAS into their GPS radio -- especially since WAAS density data can be downloaded via the Internet, eliminating the need for increased radio weight. I and others have submitted requests for a WAAS capable GPS receiver in the iPhone, but Apple has not delivered. Perhaps it is because WAAS is only available in North America. However, according to the specs for the iPhone 4S and 5, it now supports GLONASS, which provides near-WAAS accuracy when combined with standard GPS, and is available worldwide. At least that is the next best thing to WAAS.

Now, the CoreLocation service on the iPhone combines 3 completely separate technologies: GPS, cell tower triangulation, and Wifi-based location. I don't know the algorithm they use, but I presume that they use whatever service is currently providing the most accurate location information.
Note that cell tower triangulation has nothing to do with GPS."
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:03 PM   #37
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I have not been working in this field for a while, but still do not think that cell-tower and WIFI augmentation would really help GPS that much. WAAS provides a much better improvement but only covers North America, and fairly so as it is paid for by US taxpayers. We already provide GPS free to the entire world.
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:14 PM   #38
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I have not been working in this field for a while, but still do not think that cell-tower and WIFI augmentation would really help GPS that much. WAAS provides a much better improvement but only covers North America, and fairly so as it is paid for by US taxpayers. We already provide GPS free to the entire world.
I agree - the cell tower/ WIFI augmentation is not much of a help. WAAS & increased no of satellites is a huge help. We used to have Glonass at work, but discontinued the service because it really wasn't adding anything the past few years.

Here's something to watch out for: GPS/ Aerial Photography Drones - not yet approved by the FAA, but may be in 2015.

http://uas.trimble.com
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:24 PM   #39
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Percolators. Does anybody perk their coffee anymore?
Yep, I do. The water is hot enough to produce excellent quality coffee. Finding the filters is a trick though, since no grocery stores carry them any more.

I'd rather have an oven than a bunch of special cooking equipment.
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:35 PM   #40
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I'd rather have an oven than a bunch of special cooking equipment.

+1

Devices that do only one thing tend to less useful though there are obvious exceptions such as coffee makers.
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