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Old 09-20-2007, 08:07 PM   #21
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My ex divorced me 2 decades ago because she wasn't happy with living beneath our means. After a year she had spent all of her settlement, and then her means were well below the way we were living. She changed her mind about the divorce but: too late --- so had I

If we hadn't divorced, it wouldn't be RE, it would be RN (retire never).
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Old 09-20-2007, 08:37 PM   #22
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I hear some serious emotional baggage expressed here. I guess that is to be expected when divorce comes into the conversation. Life is tough enough without going through all that. It's too bad they don't give a test before they issue a marriage license.

By the way Ha, I hope it didn't sound like I was complaining about DW, I wasn't. I wouldn't trade her for anything I've ever met, yet. Of course by now it probably wouldn't matter anyway. But we DO have different ideas about spending money: she's normal, and I'm real tight. So on average, we'll be just fine.

So far I would parse the data thusly, #1 being RE earliest:

1. Married, both working at LBYM
2. Single, driven to RE
3. Married but reasonably dedicated to FI
4. Single or married and hopelessly clueless about FI or ever RE

But so far, it looks like finding yourself in the #1 category is, well... rare, and priceless. Congratulations Nords. Of course two pensions, adjusted for inflation can't hurt either.
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Old 09-21-2007, 06:18 AM   #23
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It's too bad they don't give a test before they issue a marriage license.
That's for sure. And another one before having kids (I would have flunked that one flat, I'm sure! though I tried to learn on the fly).
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:42 AM   #24
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My ex divorced me 2 decades ago because she wasn't happy with living beneath our means. After a year she had spent all of her settlement, and then her means were well below the way we were living. She changed her mind about the divorce but: too late --- so had I

If we hadn't divorced, it wouldn't be RE, it would be RN (retire never).
Amen to that. Sometimes for whatever reason we think that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence but when we take the leap and jump over the fence - we find out that things were not what they appeared to be and the grass that we left was indeed just what the doctor ordered.
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:55 AM   #25
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I've noticed that many members of this board who are working hard to RE, or have already done so, are single. It got me wondering whether the ability to achieve FIRE was in any way correlated to one's marital status. I know from experience that DW often spends money in ways I would not spend if single. Of course there are other tradeoffs too.

So here's the poll question: if you have already achieved FIRE, are you married or single? Has status changed since RE?
I haven't retired yet, but FI has been achieved, and I'm just here trying to wrap my peabrain around RE, but more to the point, It isn't marital status or kids that holds one back. This opinion is not likely to be popular with most of the folks in this forum, but I think that what holds people back is playing it safe when you are young and/or single. I'm glad that I was brave enough to take a risk at a young age that could have harmed me somewhat financially, but to which there was also a huge potential upside. I think that everyone comes across these opportunities from time to time, but few act on them.(starting or buying a business, or rolling the dice big time on a speculative stock that you believe in)

This or these risks should ideally be taken earlier in life so that a recovery is possible, because once wife & kids are in the picture, then the only responsible thing to do to achieve FI/RE is to scrimp and save and do without some of the comforts and advantages that you might otherwise have. Also, I would think that often the "what if?" question would pop into your head (welcome to your mid-life crisis).

The frugality while working for others method of achieving FI/RE is a noble pursuit, but to me seems tedious. Don't get me wrong, I don't spend like a drunken sailor, and in many ways I am frugal, but my wonderful wife and kids and I live to an upper middle class standard without needing to account for every penny all because I took a risk early on.
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Old 09-21-2007, 09:27 AM   #26
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Interesting angle on the question, Grizz.

I too had a number of business opportunities early in my career. I passed on each one without a whole lot of consideration. Not because it was riskly though, but mostly because they didn't interest me at the time. Oddly enough, I wasn't motivated by money. I had trained to be an engineer, and by gum I was going to be one. Of course the irony of that was that once I started in engineering, I was only "doing" engineering work for about two years. I was promoted quickly into management, doing for others what I had rejected for owning my own business earlier. Go figure. As it turned out, I was a much better manager than I was an engineer anyway.

Life offers up many roads not taken.

"I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference."

Indeed
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Old 09-21-2007, 09:42 AM   #27
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I haven't FIRE'd yet. Sadly, I still have a looooong way to go. It would be an even longer journey without my wife there to help us achieve our goal. We split most of the work evenly for the most part and we both have our strengths. I handle most of the macro issues like long term planning, fund/stock/ETF picking, etc. and she handles ost of the the micro issues like coupon cliping and shopping around for the best deals on whatever we need. It's a combination of these two that will make it possible for us to retire early.

Why, as a society do we discuss our religious beliefs, sexual desires, etc. with our potential spouses but not our monetary beliefs and spending habits? Why is it taboo to talk about money and debt and planning with the person you chose to spend the rest of your life with?

Maybe I just got lucky to find someone who is as frugal as I am with the same desire to leave the workplace as early as possible. Or, maybe that's one of the reasons I was attracted to her in the first place.
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Old 09-21-2007, 02:21 PM   #28
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Why, as a society do we discuss our religious beliefs, sexual desires, etc. with our potential spouses but not our monetary beliefs and spending habits? Why is it taboo to talk about money and debt and planning with the person you chose to spend the rest of your life with?
Well said, and why do we not spend time learning about the myriad of investment opportunities out there while in high school? Why is it inappropriate to discuss money matters in polite company? I don't give a damn how much money you have, but talking about ROI in terms of percentages and taxes and the like is very productive, and if it weren't a social no-no to talk about such things with friends and family perhaps lots more people would become aware of the quality of their investment choices.
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Old 09-22-2007, 03:26 PM   #29
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As I read the personality profiles

the odds of being a FIRE type are only about 5%, so if uncorrelated, the odds of two both being that would only be 0.25%. Two could do it much easier, but the odds are heavily weighted against them. There are probably others that could do so if they wanted to and worked towards that, but really don't give it a thought. Retirement isn't usually on most peoples minds until middle age.
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Old 09-23-2007, 03:24 PM   #30
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the odds of being a FIRE type are only about 5%, so if uncorrelated, the odds of two both being that would only be 0.25%. Two could do it much easier, but the odds are heavily weighted against them. There are probably others that could do so if they wanted to and worked towards that, but really don't give it a thought. Retirement isn't usually on most peoples minds until middle age.
.25% probability for both partners having a FIRE mental state! That's lower than I would have thought. In fact, that's so low as to almost be statistically irrelevant. Where did you come up with the 5% figure? I rarely mention my retirement plans to anyone but my closest friends, so I wonder if there might be more out there suffering in silence. DW seems to mention my plans (and hers) continuously to her co-workers. Their reaction is always shock and disbelief, which I find to be a combination of amusing and just a little bit irritating.

DD text messaged me last week that she was considering finishing up her undergrad degree early. I tried not to respond the way I actually felt.
Seems she received some strong interest from an investment banking outfit (whatever that is) that got her all charged up. This from a girl who only last year tried to convince me that money was not important to her.

I guess not, when Dad is footing most of the bill. Well I hope she asks the right questions of any future potential husband so she can get into the .25%-5% range of FI thinking, leading to financial choices instead of financial imperatives.
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Old 09-23-2007, 05:34 PM   #31
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Was married ,Was divorced ,Was remarried ,Was widowed ! I've weathered all these storms and have ended up FI .I atribute it all to being really cheap .I mean living below my means.
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The 5% figure
Old 09-24-2007, 04:45 PM   #32
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The 5% figure

is from looking at the Retire Early Personality Poll for percentage of people that have personalities consistent with early retirers out of universe of possible personalities. Some of these may not discover or seek it out but these would be the ones most likely to do so. Now given you are interested in FIRE, there is only the probability of your spouse being so at 5% or 1 in 20. Sounds like there should be a dating thread around here .
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Old 09-24-2007, 06:39 PM   #33
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"Hey, want to have coffee sometime? Oh, but first, just fill out this Myers-Briggs test. If you're not INTJ, forget the coffee."

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Old 09-24-2007, 11:50 PM   #34
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"Hey, want to have coffee sometime? Oh, but first, just fill out this Myers-Briggs test. If you're not INTJ, forget the coffee."

2Cor521

Better test.

Ask WHERE they want to have coffee sometime. If it's Starbucks, run for the hills!
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Old 09-25-2007, 08:58 AM   #35
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. Sounds like there should be a dating thread around here .
Who would moderate that, Ha or lazy??
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Old 09-25-2007, 09:29 AM   #36
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Who would moderate that, Ha or lazy??
uh... not me. maybe we could do a moderator exchange deal with The Loveshack Forums
:confused:
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Old 09-25-2007, 01:11 PM   #37
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Who would moderate that, Ha or lazy??
If we move fast, JG might still be available...
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