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Old 06-13-2019, 12:50 PM   #81
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The Law of Unintended Consequences is one of my favorite truths in life.

Interestingly enough I learned one of its corollaries from an acquaintance who was a strong environmentalist. The corollary is "You can never do just one thing." ...
That's an interesting way to turn it. It's true, isn't it.

Along those lines...

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... And the use of any herbicide as a crop dessicant strikes me as a very bad idea, in general. ....
That was my initial thought as well, considering the spraying is so close to harvest (though I still am not really all that concerned). But then, reflecting on the above....

Hmmm, what if by getting the crop to dry out faster, it reduces the levels of molds and fungi? IIRC, there are some mold and fungi that have health issues, and has anyone tried feeding these molds/fungi to animals at 128,000 ppM levels for years?

So maybe, just maybe, applying RoundUp as a desiccant is actually a healthy thing to do? Who can know? I would not rule it out, and with the risks so apparently low, I just can't get worked up about it.



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... I do try eat as many veggies as possible from my own vegetable garden, though, and I use no pesticides/herbicides there. So, I do what I can to minimize my exposure to them.

I'm not telling anyone else what to do - just explaining my rationale for avoiding oats, since you asked.
That makes sense, I mean, why not avoid the 'stuff' that we don't really know for sure if it may be harmful. And you have the opportunity by doing your own gardening, so I can appreciate that.

My issue is more with the activists that push for/against some of these things, and may very well be doing more harm (for the general public, overall) than good.And likely raising prices in the process. As pointed out above, RoundUp won't just go away, something will be used in its place.

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Old 06-13-2019, 01:37 PM   #82
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A couple of years ago, when visiting Death Valley I learned of the operation to mine borax there 100 years ago.

I researched the different uses of borax, and learned about the use of it as a food additive and preservative. The use of borax in food has been a controversial issue, and borax is still used today in caviar. Interesting subject!
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:08 PM   #83
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Who's to say that established limits are good for a particular individual? Roundup on my Cheerios? Good for the heart? What a maroon I've been...
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:16 PM   #84
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The claims of cancer causing violates many scientific principles, but many of the anti-glyphosate folks hang their hats on it. And the lawyers are interested in their percentage more than they are interested in the safety of the chemical.
The main impetus behind the attacks on glyphosate, at least in Europe, comes from people who are opposed to GMOs. One of the classic GM tricks is to make your crop glyphosate-resistant, so you can spray it without needing to keep it off the crop, thus getting rid of more weeds for less effort. The leader in this technology is Monsanto, who invented glyphosate. But crucially, I think, glyphosate is out of patent and can be made by anybody.

I asked an online biochemist friend about this and he doesn't think there is anything wrong with glyphosate, based partly on the structure of the molecule. It's certainly likely to be less harmful to health than halogen-based weedkillers like 2,4-tD and 2,4,5-T (aka Agent Orange - which Monsanto didn't manufacture during the Vietnam War; they bought the company that did afterwards).

I worry that we are starting to see the elimination of a lot of cheap, useful, and essentially harmless (bio)chemical products, due to the Facebook mob phenomenon. The glyphosate story reminds me a lot of the attacks on vaccines: Anyone who argues for the status quo is quickly accused of being in the pockets of the industry. The elimination of glyphosate would have less immediate consequences for public health than the continued erosion of vaccination rates, but there would be an impact on food prices all the same, notably in developing countries.
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:16 PM   #85
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Who's to say that established limits are good for a particular individual? Roundup on my Cheerios? Good for the heart? What a maroon I've been...
I am low carb. So I don't eat cheerios. But, I do add glyphosate to my eggs! I try to stay under the EPA limits though.
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:23 PM   #86
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I am low carb. So I don't eat cheerios. But, I do add glyphosate to my eggs! I try to stay under the EPA limits though.
What do you use to portion your glyphosate? World's smallest measuring spoon?
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:29 PM   #87
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What do you use to portion your glyphosate? World's smallest measuring spoon?
I had not participated in a thread today. And, this was the best I could come up with.
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:34 PM   #88
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I am low carb. So I don't eat cheerios. But, I do add glyphosate to my eggs! I try to stay under the EPA limits though.
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What do you use to portion your glyphosate? World's smallest measuring spoon?
You can use dilution, in the manner of homeopathic dilution, but don't go too far or there's nothing left.
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:51 PM   #89
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I had not participated in a thread today. And, this was the best I could come up with.
Alternatively, you could use a micro scale, measure carefully, and add to your eggs.
This is the best I can come up with after being tapped on the bridge on the drive home.
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:55 PM   #90
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Alternatively, you could use a micro scale, measure carefully, and add to your eggs.
This is the best I can come up with after being tapped on the bridge on the drive home.
Yikes. I hope everyone is ok.
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Old 06-13-2019, 02:59 PM   #91
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You can use dilution, in the manner of homeopathic dilution, but don't go too far or there's nothing left.
Yea, I want to make sure I get all the benefits. Why should the cherrios crowd get all the best chemicals?

ETA: Why can't they add hallucenogens to our food?
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:04 PM   #92
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Does MJ cause hallucinations, or only causes takers to giggle silly like often portrayed in movies? If it does, one can now readily get the ingredient for the job, instead of using some exotic mushrooms as I read about.
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:12 PM   #93
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What do you use to portion your glyphosate? World's smallest measuring spoon?

You really don't need to worry about adding it. A quick Google search shows that the glyphosate is already installed!


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“Of note is the finding that our samples of organic cage-free eggs contained more glyphosate than the allowable tolerance level.”

I am very concerned, however, that I could not find a link to the study being quoted, or even a link to where I could donate some money! I think the primary desired outcome is that I need to be scared of the monster under my bed.
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:16 PM   #94
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You really don't need to worry about adding it. A quick Google search shows that the glyphosate is already installed!
But, but, but, I pay $5 per dozen for eggs. I thought that protected me! The package includes the words, "pasture raised", "organic", and "only a smidge of glyphosate".
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:18 PM   #95
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Does MJ cause hallucinations, or only causes takers to giggle silly like often portrayed in movies? If it does, one can now readily get the ingredient for the job, instead of using some exotic mushrooms as I read about.
I don't want to harsh your mellow, but studies show that MJ could be full of pesticides also.

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Also in June, a white paper published by the Cannabis Safety Institute (an advisory group that provides research to the legal marijuana industry) revealed that many cannabis products contained pesticides at levels higher than what’s typically allowed for edible or smokable products. Of particular concern were the concentrates used to make candies, baked goods, and other edibles. Examples include concentrate samples with levels of carbaryl—a chemical typically used on fruits, vegetables, and ornamental plants—as high as 415 parts per million (by comparison, the tolerance for carbaryl on blueberries is three parts per million). Myclobutanil, a fungicide used to fight powdery mildew on vegetables, fruits, and leafy greens, was found at eight parts per million in pot flowers, and between 44 and 392 parts per million in concentrates (levels allowed on food items usually range from 0.1 to 10 parts per million). The paper also found residues for pesticides that aren’t allowed on any food crops.
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:27 PM   #96
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But, but, but, I pay $5 per dozen for eggs. I thought that protected me! The package includes the words, "pasture raised", "organic", and "only a smidge of glyphosate".

Organic! We like the words, but how can we trust those evil food corporations!


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The “USDA Organic” label on your produce aisle might not be as advertised. The inspector general released an audit yesterday that lights into agency officials tasked with overseeing organic standards.

The inspector general’s office decided it should look into this mess after alarming reports surfaced back in May that some 21 million pounds of conventional soybeans, plus a few million more of corn, had somehow entered American grocery stores carrying a bogus certified-organic label.

Farmers gripe that they have enough trouble as it is competing with cheaper foreign produce without sham “organic” importers finding ways to cut corners. The USDA failed to say in its report how widespread it thinks this problem is.
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:30 PM   #97
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I don't want to harsh your mellow, but studies show that MJ could be full of pesticides also.

... a white paper by the Cannabis Safety Institute (an advisory group that provides research to the legal marijuana industry)...
It sounds like a study to show the danger of consuming illicit MJ sold in the back alleys.

Surely, MJ grown in legal nice clean and enclosed greenhouses would not need to be sprayed with insecticides, and is all organic, wholesome, and conforming to all the requirements by FDA, EPA, USDA, FAA, CIA, DEA, etc...

Oops, no FAA nor CIA involvement here.

DEA?
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Old 06-13-2019, 04:54 PM   #98
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DEA?
The DEA is probably responsible for traces of glyphosate found in cocaine!

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Spraying with glyphosate began in the 1990s on a small scale and by the early 2000s it was established as a crucial aspect of Plan Colombia, a multibillion dollar push by the United States to aid in fighting rebel groups and drug traffickers in the country.
The challenge with all of this remains- who can you trust, and why? We are supposed to be alarmed and called to action about trace amounts. Then we find that the standard is suspect, the testing is suspect, and the science is suspect. On the flip side, the government is bought and paid for, the scientists will produce research based on where the grant money comes from and the popular press functions at a 2nd grade level.

What the heck are we worrying about anyways-

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A harrowing new climate change report warns we may be on the way to extinction, claiming there is a “high likelihood” human civilization will come to an end by 2050 unless action is taken on greenhouse gas emissions.
The dire paper, which predicts a biblical-like scenario of devastating floods, drought, famine and a breakdown in international order, has been endorsed by the former chief of Australia’s military.
I need to change my FIRECalc to no more than a 30 year horizon!
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Old 06-13-2019, 04:57 PM   #99
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You can use dilution, in the manner of homeopathic dilution, but don't go too far or there's nothing left.
I think you've ignored water memory.
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