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Old 01-02-2013, 04:51 AM   #21
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One thing that I don't understand is why all OTA TV isn't available via the web (commercials and all). We live in a rural area where OTA TV reception is poor. I would like to get my local OTA channels via the web and then dump my satellite provider and then go with Hulu Plus/NetFlix, etc for other programming, but the inability to get my locals via web is keeping me on satellite.
[I am assuming pb4uski was talking about live streaming, not just the ability to watch programming online a day later.]

There is nothing preventing the stations from doing that, except the folks who make television programming generally reserve the rights to broadcast over the Internet. They do this for several reasons, money being one of them, but also they make a promise to each station that they'll have exclusive rights to present the programming that they've created for a certain period of time. If some station in another market is freely broadcasting over the Internet, then that takes away from the folks who make television programming their rights to control distribution, and make more money from wider distribution of what they've created.

There is a way around that, now: ISPs know precisely where each connection is coming from, and together they can limit access to specific content to certain geographical areas (in compliance with the wishes of the content creators). Those arrangements are possible. I can get over 40 channels on my Xbox 360, now, because my ISP has gotten together with cable channels to allow what is essentially Internet streaming of those channels to my IP device. We don't see it all that often with the OTA channels because what profit motive are we, consumers, offering content creators and ISPs to invest money in such arrangements?

If we consumers don't do our part, it isn't reasonable to expect what we want to be handed to us on a silver platter.
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Old 01-02-2013, 07:34 AM   #22
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What OTA shows are you referring to? I can get to ABC, CBS and NBC shows usually 1 day later on the web. FOX makes you wait 8 days if you're not a cable/satellite subscriber.
My main concern is local and national news of our CBS affiliate. I could live with waiting a day for major network shows.

The local news station we watch the most does have many of their news features as video on their website, but I am lazy and like having them "deliver" the news to me rather than having to go fetch it.
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Old 01-02-2013, 07:42 AM   #23
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Every rational, data-based analysis shows that most customers benefit from that arrangement. If you need some insights into this, switch to C-Band and see how much it costs per channel. The break-even point for me was 6 channels: ABC Family, USA, Syfy, TNT, CNN, FX, AMC. If you like sports, the break-even point is earlier.

This I think indicates the problem with your logic: You're presuming entitlement to high-quality, inexpensive entertainment. There is no such entitlement.

That much is true, but what you're suggesting reflects the true cancer in society - not media outlet seeking to be compensated for what their offerings are worth, based on what the marketplace is willing to pay - that's tried-and-true American capitalism - but rather the cancer is those within society who seek to place themselves above others by exploiting, abusing, and otherwise transgressing against responsible conduct.

Expecting people to pay what something is worth in the marketplace is fair, though.
Something is only worth what people are willing to pay. If people are willing to commit a crime to get it, the product is probably overpriced.
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Old 01-02-2013, 07:43 AM   #24
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Something is only worth what people are willing to pay. If people are willing to commit a crime to get it, the product is probably overpriced.
or the people who are stealing are exceedingly cheap - take your pick.
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Old 01-02-2013, 07:51 AM   #25
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Something is only worth what people are willing to pay. If people are willing to commit a crime to get it, the product is probably overpriced.
If you really believe that, then we have no common basis on which to have a discussion about it.


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or the people who are stealing are exceedingly cheap - take your pick.
I prefer the term, "offensively self-entitled". Others would use harsher words like "selfish", but I think they go too far, because our society has done such a poor job communicating reasonable parameters for opportunistic self-enrichment.
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Old 01-02-2013, 08:22 AM   #26
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You don't believe that things are only worth what people are willing to pay for them? You can think your baseball card is worth $200 but if nobody will pay you that much, it isn't worth that much.
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Old 01-02-2013, 08:33 AM   #27
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You don't believe that things are only worth what people are willing to pay for them?
I believe things are worth what the people who are willing to pay for them are willing to pay for them. I also believe that self-centered greed motivates some people to steal, without regard to the worth of things.

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You can think your baseball card is worth $200 but if nobody will pay you that much, it isn't worth that much.
And if someone steals your baseball card, that doesn't actually change its value.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:42 AM   #28
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You don't believe that things are only worth what people are willing to pay for them? You can think your baseball card is worth $200 but if nobody will pay you that much, it isn't worth that much.

Of course I do! If someone is willing to pay $200 for a baseball card, that card is worth $200. That is not to say it will be woth $200 in a month, but at that point it is worth $200.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:47 AM   #29
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Something is only worth what people are willing to pay. If people are willing to commit a crime to get it, the product is probably overpriced.
Hmm, I may need to rethink my "it's okay to talk to the police" belief if you truly believe things that are stolen are probably overpriced....
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Old 01-02-2013, 03:46 PM   #30
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Food for thought about reducing TV costs.
The Future of TV May Not Be Worth It
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Old 01-02-2013, 03:49 PM   #31
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It's not unreasonable to think that ESPN alone would cost upwards of $20 per month as a standalone product.
This really should help folks understand just how valuable cable really is, and how much more most of us would pay if channels were a la carte.

It also is upsetting to think that I'm paying more so other people can enjoy ESPN for a lot less than they should be paying for it, but that's a slippery slope.
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Old 01-02-2013, 04:32 PM   #32
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Hmm, I may need to rethink my "it's okay to talk to the police" belief if you truly believe things that are stolen are probably overpriced....
The more overpriced things get, the more they get stolen. Gas is getting stolen at a record pace. That doesn't mean that I condone it. I'm a law abiding citizen.
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Old 01-02-2013, 06:29 PM   #33
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The more overpriced things get, the more they get stolen.
Uh, no.

My education is several decades old, but I don't think the psychology of theft has changed much. From memory, some of the reason are: sensation-seeking (especially in the case of depression), risk-taking behavior, low self-esteem (the theft representing a claiming of power), inclination toward deviant behavior, defective concept of ownership.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:26 PM   #34
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Uh, no.

My education is several decades old, but I don't think the psychology of theft has changed much. From memory, some of the reason are: sensation-seeking (especially in the case of depression), risk-taking behavior, low self-esteem (the theft representing a claiming of power), inclination toward deviant behavior, defective concept of ownership.
LOL. Is that what they teach in books? You should go hang out in the projects for a few days. That might be why someone like Wynona Rider steals, but not the rest of the real world.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:39 AM   #35
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Every rational, data-based analysis shows that most customers benefit from that arrangement. If you need some insights into this, switch to C-Band and see how much it costs per channel. The break-even point for me was 6 channels: ABC Family, USA, Syfy, TNT, CNN, FX, AMC. If you like sports, the break-even point is earlier.

This I think indicates the problem with your logic: You're presuming entitlement to high-quality, inexpensive entertainment. There is no such entitlement.

That much is true, but what you're suggesting reflects the true cancer in society - not media outlet seeking to be compensated for what their offerings are worth, based on what the marketplace is willing to pay - that's tried-and-true American capitalism - but rather the cancer is those within society who seek to place themselves above others by exploiting, abusing, and otherwise transgressing against responsible conduct.

Expecting people to pay what something is worth in the marketplace is fair, though.
You're way out in right field on this. How much Comcast stock do you own?
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Old 01-03-2013, 04:40 AM   #36
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LOL. Is that what they teach in books?
No. It is was actual experts have learned from their research and expertise, and relayed to anyone mature enough to put their own personal preference aside to open their mind to what's actual.

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You're way out in right field on this. How much Comcast stock do you own?
I just sold it all. I'm sorry that the truth upsets you.

I know it is fun to speculate that some fanboy's wet dream of cheap teevee is what's right and true, and that some ridiculously overripe monster is depriving people of this dream. It's simply not the case.
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Old 01-03-2013, 07:47 AM   #37
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No. It is was actual experts have learned from their research and expertise, and relayed to anyone mature enough to put their own personal preference aside to open their mind to what's actual.


.
Ive spent over 22 years as a cop in one of the biggest cities in the US. With all due respect to whoever claims to have done research and written a book, I am pretty sure that I am more of an expert on certain basic human behaviors than any of them. Ive interviewed enough people one on one to know that if someone is broke and needs or wants something badly enough, they will take it. Its that simple. In most cases, it has nothing to do with low self-esteem or inclination toward deviant behavior or that other crap.

I've read about 50 of your posts recently and the tone of most of them indicate to me that you know everything, so obviously nothing I say is going to change your mind. This is my last attempt.
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Old 01-03-2013, 08:03 AM   #38
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The more overpriced things get, the more they get stolen.
Maybe you mean: "The more expensive things get the more they get stolen."

My argument to you is that if something is selling at a price it is not "overpriced" (if it is overpriced, it would not sell). Just because a person can not afford something does not mean it is overpriced; whether that be gas, ESPN or baseball cards. And because someone thinks they should not have to pay what someone is selling it for does not give then the right to steal it.

I have spent most of my life writing software, I could spend thousands of hours building something and because someone could make a copy and install it on their machine without paying, they think that is ok. Sorry, If someone uses cable, copies music, copies software, and then uses it, they are stealing. Just as if they are reaching into the owners pocket.
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Old 01-03-2013, 08:17 AM   #39
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I am more of an expert on certain basic human behaviors than any of them.
I'm sure that they disagree with you. Everyone speaks from their own experience and knowledge, and from their own biases if they have a reason to have a bias.

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I've read about 50 of your posts recently and the tone of most of them indicate to me that you know everything,
Right back at ya.

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so obviously nothing I say is going to change your mind. This is my last attempt.
You shouldn't be "attempting" to change my mind. We all post based on experience and acquired knowledge, and in the context of this forum all such contributions are every bit as valid as all other such contributions. I'll relay what I know; you relay what you know. If they aren't consistent with each other, live with it.

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My argument to you is that if something is selling at a price it is not "overpriced" (if it is overpriced, it would not sell). Just because a person can not afford something does not mean it is overpriced; whether that be gas, ESPN or baseball cards. And because someone thinks they should not have to pay what someone is selling it for does not give then the right to steal it.
Precisely right.
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Old 01-03-2013, 08:20 AM   #40
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I have spent most of my life writing software, I could spend thousands of hours building something and because someone could make a copy and install it on their machine without paying, they think that is ok. Sorry, If someone uses cable, copies music, copies software, and then uses it, they are stealing. Just as if they are reaching into the owners pocket.
I've always been interesting in the conflicting behavior of people. For example, about a year or so ago on a whim DW had a few Glamor Shots done at her hairdresser's. I was there because we were going elsewhere afterward.

In a discussion with the photographer she mentioned that it was easy to find a valid serial number for Photoshop so there was no need to pay for it. But I'm sure she'd be incensed if someone stole her photos.

That kind of disconnect has always fascinated me.

BTW, I did pay for my copy of Photoshop.
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