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Old 12-22-2011, 12:39 PM   #161
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Too cute! Just kick him to the curb.
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Old 12-22-2011, 12:42 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by ratto View Post
Call me cynical, is this another revamped version of "It's not you, it's me" routine by George?
Have to say that that was my first reaction while reading.
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:00 PM   #163
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<snip> He meets with his lawyer on December 30 so I guess we're basically in a holding pattern until then. He said he's not in a hurry to divorce. He claims to still care about me and he wants to keep me on his health insurance until I get a job where it's offered.
Oh, you're not working. Are you in an alimony state? Also, if you don't have a separate checking account now is the time to get one. Ask your attorney how to protect yourself against his running up the credit cards or incurring new debt (if this is a community property state). You may want to consider putting a credit freeze on your accounts with all three credit bureaus.

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In Texas, even if you own a property before you get married (which makes it separate), once the wife moves into the property she has rights to live there. If the husband dies, the wife can live in the house as long as she wants even if she does not own it. And she does not have to pay to fix it up if she does not want to....
Not exactly. The surviving spouse does have a homestead interest in the deceased spouse's separate property house with several conditions. The mortage (if there is one) must continue to be paid, the house must be maintained, property taxes must be paid, and the homestead issue only exists if s/he continuously lives in the house. S/he can't move out and rent the house (or allow anyone to take possession of the house such as his/her children) or live in one place part of the time and this house part of the time. Also, if the surviving spouse has another house in his/her name then that becomes their domicile. It's up to the decedent's heirs to monitor their property and take legal action to evict if any of the conditions are not met.
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:16 PM   #164
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Oh, you're not working. Are you in an alimony state? Also, if you don't have a separate checking account now is the time to get one. Ask your attorney how to protect yourself against his running up the credit cards or incurring new debt (if this is a community property state). You may want to consider putting a credit freeze on your accounts with all three credit bureaus.
I am working. It's just that my current job does not offer health insurance. I am losing my job at the end of March, so will have to find a new one then, with health insurance.

I will get maintenance, but not a lot. However, I am educated and have an in-demand profession, so I know I'll be OK. Plus, once the divorce is final, I will have no debts and I live below my means, so no money worries, assuming I can find a job. It's just more having to realize that the life I thought I was going to lead even last month is no longer reality.

I have a call in to my lawyer about what to do regarding checking account/credit cards. I am in a community property state. With the holidays, she is out until Tuesday. I don't want to take any actions that will end up harming me down the road.
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:22 PM   #165
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Remember, if you are healthy with no or very minor pre-existing conditions, you may want to consider a HSA. One of the benefits is you don't have to be employed (such as FIRE'd ) and still have one. Plus, you won't be dependent on others for the insurance which is a big advantage. In my sister's divorce, she tried to stay under her ex's insurance for her and her daughters. But there's was no guarantee he'd be employed. Plus, he was the controling type, so anyway to control, even out of spite, he'd take that path.
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:36 PM   #166
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Marathoner,
You've been hammered with a lot of stuff all at one time, and it's going to take time to absorb it before you can deal with it in a unemotional way. The forum posters here have provided good suggestions, and it sounds like you have a good support team behind you.

Having not been in your situation, I would only offer this: allow yourself some time to grieve for your loss, even as you go about the mechanics of unwinding your joint lives. You have suffered a death in your closest relationship and you need time to adapt to the new reality in your life. Take care of yourself. Listen to your inner you.

And know that time softens even the harshest blows. You'll be fine.
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:44 PM   #167
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You can always try to get health insurance from him as part of your maintenance settlement.

Talk to your lawyer about the possible/most likely outcome if your case went to trial. You really need to know this to be in a good position to bargain/collaborate.

Make no mistake, the other side will try to shortchange you.

Good luck!
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:50 PM   #168
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Similar thing happened to my wife (for almost similar reasons) 5-6 years before I met her. It's good you have a lawyer, as my wife's ex made a bunch of promises that got wittled down with time and eventually left her screwed come filing time.

I'm hoping for the best for you and keep looking up!
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Old 12-22-2011, 01:53 PM   #169
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He took full responsibility for the demise of our marriage since he was so screwed up. He apologized for hurting me and for having an affair as I deserve better. He wishes he would have gotten help before things got too far. He said he can't ever see us getting back together because he is so damaged and I deserve better. And he's right.
Let me first say... WHEW!

I was cringing with the vision of your immediate future full of emotionally painful manipulation, should you have gotten back together with him.

Trusting that he is sincere (a leap, perhaps) I hope all goes smoothly and that you are able to start your new life quickly, or at least as quickly as you are comfortable with.

You seem to have everything in the world going for you. Soon I imagine your biggest problem will be to carefully manage all of YOUR admirers.

Best of luck!
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Old 12-22-2011, 02:16 PM   #170
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Call me cynical, is this another revamped version of "It's not you, it's me" routine by George?
Or maybe his counselor told him to be honest for the first time in a long time with regards to his soon-to-be ex-wife?
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Old 12-22-2011, 02:26 PM   #171
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Trust your instincts.
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Old 12-22-2011, 03:31 PM   #172
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Assuming you are healthy, health insurance may be relatively inexpensive. Don't over value the benefit of being on his insurance. A quick quote on the Humana website shows a 32 year old non smoking female pays $200 a month for a $2500 deductible in my state.

You can run numbers here:

https://www.humana-one.com/secured/i...ce-quotes.aspx
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Old 12-22-2011, 04:54 PM   #173
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Trust your instincts.
+1. That little Uh Oh person who lives deep in your gut is there for a reason.
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Old 12-22-2011, 07:28 PM   #174
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Old 12-22-2011, 07:43 PM   #175
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What's interesting to me is that he was so honest with you after his first counseling session. I wouldn't have thought that owning up to being a sociopath is something that a sociopath would do.

I think that this act of honesty was exactly what you needed from him in order to set yourself free.

Best of luck Marathoner - as everyone else has said, you're going to be fine.
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Old 12-23-2011, 10:39 AM   #176
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Not exactly. The surviving spouse does have a homestead interest in the deceased spouse's separate property house with several conditions. The mortage (if there is one) must continue to be paid, the house must be maintained, property taxes must be paid, and the homestead issue only exists if s/he continuously lives in the house. S/he can't move out and rent the house (or allow anyone to take possession of the house such as his/her children) or live in one place part of the time and this house part of the time. Also, if the surviving spouse has another house in his/her name then that becomes their domicile. It's up to the decedent's heirs to monitor their property and take legal action to evict if any of the conditions are not met.

Are you sure of these conditions I did not see anything about the mortgage, but I read somewhere that they did not have to maintain the house or pay the property taxes. I think it was in a paper where someone wrote to a lawyer and complained that they had to pay these expenses for their mother-in-law. Agree that she has to live there.
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Old 12-23-2011, 11:16 AM   #177
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When my mother's husband died (in Texas), the house went to his kids in the will but they could not make her move. She was allowed to live there the rest of her life by law. IIRC, she had to pay the principal and insurance and they had to pay the interest and taxes.

PS..there was a new will, but we could never find it. We assumed that the new will left the house to my mother.
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Old 12-23-2011, 05:15 PM   #178
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Marathoner,

A couple of comments from a guy whose wife divorced him 5 years ago (over very different views of money and the fact that she was dating someone else):

1. You will be OK in time, and you'll probably be great in time. But it can take longer than others expect. I've heard a rule of thumb that it's 1 year of recovery for every 2-3 years of marriage. I was married for 15 years and it took me 5 years to get to a point where I am finally good. So even though some people will say you should be fine in 6 months to a year, please give yourself years if you need it. Also, you'll alternatively make steady progress and periodically have times of sadness/frustration/loneliness/anger/grief/etc, but you will make progress over time if you have faith in yourself and don't lose hope.

2. Divorce laws vary by state, as you probably already have heard. That having been said, I believe most states are now no-fault, meaning the court could care less who has been nice and who is the real jerk; they just split assets/debt roughly down the middle, give or take some depending on the circumstances. Read the law in your state, find an attorney you feel comfortable working with, and ask him or her what is reasonable or likely.

3. I highly recommend attorney-based mediation; it is faster, cheaper, and more under your control than going to court. You have your attorney, he has his attorney, and you go to a third one and hash out an agreement between the two of you. Once you have something that you both can live with, you each check with your own attorneys to make sure you haven't been taken advantage of. It's not binding unless you both agree, then a judge just stamps the thing and makes it official. The advantage of an attorney-mediator is that they can write it all up for you both, and can also probably give you both a pretty good idea of what the courts would end up doing anyway. The relevant phrase here is "stipulated divorce".

4. He has probably cheated on you before, this is probably just the first time you've caught him. As you get enough road time on being by yourself, you'll maybe even be able to look back and see clues. Cheaters almost never come clean and stay clean for the rest of their lives either, so even if he really wants to change you can probably plan on him falling off the wagon again in the future. I'd suggest asking yourself if that's what you really want.

5. This comment will probably draw controversy, but I would make sure you're OK on your own for a while and not start into a relationship too soon. It is tempting (and many others may recommend) to be in a relationship just because it is what you've been used to, and relationships do have their benefits. But it can also prevent you from really taking stock of yourself and your life, and deciding where you want to go in this world, who you want to become, what you want your life to look like. If you shortchange that analysis and work, you may find yourself ending up with someone who isn't right for you for the long run. [Full disclosure: I haven't been on a date since my ex and I separated, and I'm glad because I know that I'm a much healthier person now.]

6. Make all of your decisions from this point forward on what is best for you. This is not selfish; this is being levelheaded in a situation where your marriage is probably over and you could easily regret being overly nice to him in the negotiations out of a misplaced guilt or manipulation by him. Treat it like a business deal. For example, he says he's in no hurry. Fine, but if you decide it would be better for you to have the divorce go faster, talk with your attorney and take steps to make things go faster.

Finally, the vengeance card is overrated in my view. I made the decision early on to treat my ex civilly and reasonably throughout the whole deal, even when I thought she was being unreasonable. (I tried to remember that she probably thought me unreasonable at times.) In turn, she treated me pretty decently through the process too. Anyway, I have regrets about things I did and didn't do and about things I said (starting with "Will you marry me?" ) and didn't say during the marriage, but I can say that I was a decent guy during my divorce and I sleep better at night and stand a little taller having done that. My motivation was partly because of our kids, but even in the no-kids case there is a measure of self-respect that a person can be proud of later.

Good luck, and remember that life does get better over time.

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Old 12-23-2011, 05:55 PM   #179
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Are you sure of these conditions I did not see anything about the mortgage, but I read somewhere that they did not have to maintain the house or pay the property taxes. I think it was in a paper where someone wrote to a lawyer and complained that they had to pay these expenses for their mother-in-law. Agree that she has to live there.
Well, they may have agreed to it in order to keep the house in the family. A surviving spouse receives a homestead right to live in a house even if it was the primary separate property of the decedent. A survivor has the same rules as anyone - taxes must be paid and the house must be maintained in a health and welfare type of manner. If the house is deemed uninhabitable, then it can be demolished. A mortgage company has the right to foreclose if payments are not made.

I didn't spend a lot of time trying to find the reference; however, this one is still on the books: Williams v. Davis, 133 S.W.2d 275, 278 (Tex. Civ. App.—Fort Worth 1939, no writ). The survivor is required to maintain the homestead and make payments of all property taxes and mortgage interest without the right of reimbursement.

As with any legal matter, one should sit down with an attorney to review the will and decide what should and could be done in situations like this. In this case, if the MIL is from Texas, Texas does not have a filial law that mandates children take care of their parents.
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Old 12-24-2011, 09:58 AM   #180
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My boss is a sociopath/pyschopath and I've done a lot of research to figure what motivates him. Everything I've read says that therapy can't cure a sociopath, it just makes them better sociopaths.

The best description I found of how these people operate was in the book Snakes in Suits by Bablak and Hare. It focuses primarily on the workplace, but also talks about personnel relationships. They use to similar methods to form bonds with other people in all circumstances. Having a strong bond with a sociopath is like having a drug addiction and dissolving that relationship is like going though drug withdrawal. That is an apt description of what I observe at my workplace.
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