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Old 01-27-2009, 11:02 AM   #21
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One of the discoveries I made about retirement is that the old saw about needing 80% of pre-retirement income to maintain the same standard of living is nonsense. Since one then has all that free time, and even driving to a local park costs something in gas money, it is better to have about 120% of pre-retirement income.
Well, the thing is, what people want to do in retirement varies so much from person to person that even a "guideline" of 80% (or any other number) is silly. One needs to look at their own situation. Anyone who wants to travel a lot more obviously needs to assume much more retirement income than someone who just wants to be a homebody with simple tastes.
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Old 01-27-2009, 11:23 AM   #22
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Pleasantly occupying time in ER without spending a lot of money can be something of a challenge.
HMMMM... You know, I think you're right!! It seems like everything free requires some initial investment.

I spent maybe $500 for a Wii and a bunch of software last summer and fall, and now I can occupy all the time I want, ever so happily, without paying a cent. I envision doing that in ER. But then, it will probably become obsolete and I will think I need a "Wii II" or something.

I plan to invest more in gym equipment from Craigs List, once I have moved north. That will occupy time too, but like the Wii requires an initial investment.

One great thing about Springfield is the new public library. The reading room is heavenly and the books are new and well chosen. However, even if Frank and I take turns driving there, gas isn't free.

He was looking at a bicycle built for two last weekend. I'd rather ride individual bikes together, so if I plan to promote that then I'll probably need to buy one at some point.

Still, I can afford a lot of this sort of start-up equipment within my ER budget, since I do not have the travel bug. And there's always Craigs List to lower expenses.
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:13 PM   #23
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My wife and I are both travel lovers and homebodies. When we are not travelling, we stay at home, and do not even go out to eat. Even before the economic downturn, when we want to get out of the house we go grocery shopping together or to the library. We do not even go to movie theaters, preferring to watch DVD at home with the caption on, leave alone eating out. We have more fun cooking our own food than going to restaurants. Of course fancy restaurants would be an experience we enjoy. but cost way too much. And we do not care about so-so restaurants that do not serve better food than what we can do. About shopping, we have not set foot inside a mall for a long time. When needing something, we dash in to grab it and get out of the stores. When travelling, particularly in Europe, it is entirely different of course. Each meal is an adventure.

I have enough electronics toys, and PC hardware and software accumulated over the years to keep me busy. There are laboratory grade electronic equipments (from my failed business) that beckon to be turned on, if I feel like building an electronic gadget. My wife just lounges around with a book, or a puzzle, or Sudoku.

Our life now in this hard economic condition is the same way we always live. So when the going is tough, by just cutting out travel expenses and staying home to watch the Travel Channel, we become super LBYM'ers and do not feel deprived at all. Does that make sense to anybody?
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:58 PM   #24
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dh2b and I do the same but for different reasons.
my FIRE income is steady and sufficient. I can save and invest as usual.
I usually can fund the extra fun stuff.
dh2b pays 17% child support of his total income for 1 teenager, for 4 more years. he lost 37% of his mil retirement to the ex. there is not much left for himself after he throws in 50% of our joint living expenses. he can't even afford a used car for himself.
we save and invest together for cruises and bigger ticket items we both want.
so we do simple things here at home. we go out to eat once a month if we can afford it.
nonetheless, we are happy with LBYM. we have Netflix, we have a snowmobile, we have a boat, all paid for. so we don't suffer.
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Old 05-04-2009, 07:34 AM   #25
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I started this thread back in January....I was contacted by a former employer asking me to come back to work after being ER'd for about 7 months. I went back to work and have now been there about 3 1/2 months. Most of the work has been OK but recently they have started running out of work and of course they have started creating busy work....ugh! Also, my manager told me that I'd be on call....I said "No, I won't do that!...that wasn't part of the job description when I started.". In addition I'm working with one person who's extremely paranoid and complains continuously. In times past when I had to work I would have put up with all of this but my tolerance for this kind of stuff is almost gone. I'm finding myself getting slightly depressed on a daily basis because of this job. I think it might be time to pull the plug on this job.

To top this off another manager at the same company asked me if I'd be willing to work on her project. I hate to turn her down if it comes to that. Someone suggested to me that if I decide to work on this other project that I ask if I can work part time - perhaps 3 days a week....so that I can tolerate the B.S easier. Have any of you decided to go back to the same type of work that you did before you ER'd but are only doing it part time? Did you find it easier than working full time?
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:04 AM   #26
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Have any of you decided to go back to the same type of work that you did before you ER'd but are only doing it part time? Did you find it easier than working full time?
It has some similarities, but it's a long way from what I used to do. From law enforcement to security work. Not nearly as exciting as police work and a lot more boring. In police work, you want to get the call for "the big one" - the gasoline tanker exploding on a bridge at rush hour or some such - and in security the emphasis is on insuring that nothing out of the ordinary ever happens. The pay is much better than normal security work because it's armed and they want people with a minimum of 5 years experience.

It's easier than full time. Technically I'm "full time" since I normally work 32 hours a week. I love the short commute - 3.4 miles - and no paperwork to speak of, but this is certainly not something I'd want to make a career of. Right now it's something to do when there's nothing else to do and the extra income, most of which we're banking, is nice. Maybe later on I'll go back to school and take some classes in photography or fiddle-playing, or something.

And in the meantime if somebody gives me a boatload of crap I have the option of walking away. That makes a huge difference.
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:29 AM   #27
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...creating busy work
...I'd be on call...wasn't part of the job description when I started.
...working with one person who's extremely paranoid and complains
...getting slightly depressed on a daily basis because of this job.
...pull the plug on this job.

Have any of you decided to go back to the same type of work that you did before you ER'd but are only doing it part time? Did you find it easier than working full time?
Forgive me for overediting, but I wanted to give you a "Con" list to look at. I couldn't find any "Pros" in your post.
I'm 100% convinced - pull the plug if you still have the FI part of FIRE covered.
Life is way too short for this nonsense.
I have not gone back to w*rk. If I had to, it would never be the same kind of w*rk. My field was full of prima donnas and complainers and managers who felt like they owned you.
Good luck with your decision.
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Old 05-04-2009, 11:35 PM   #28
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The Pro is the paycheck. Only Dallasguy can tell if it cancels out the other Cons.

About working 3 days/week, it can only help. Why not try that to see if it works? It appears that you can always walk away if that 2nd job does not work out. You've got nothing to lose here.
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Old 05-05-2009, 12:03 PM   #29
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I would never go back to mega-corp....except to massage!
I understand that the recent stock market has everyone a bit nervous.....but if you have enough....why put yourself through this misery to make more money!!!
If you want to pad your account....find something fun to do where you enjoy working another aspect of yourself.

We live in an abundant universe....there is more than enough for everyone....I think we fail to realize that sometimes out of sheer greed.
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Old 05-05-2009, 01:42 PM   #30
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This week I heard that a colleague who is about my age has metastatic cancer. If I were in that situation I would walk away from my job and try to enjoy whatever time I had left. Now imagine that you had similar news. Would you go back to work?
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Old 05-05-2009, 06:02 PM   #31
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I have thought about going back to work. However, I have not regretted not going back to work.
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:21 AM   #32
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Thanks to all of you for your advice on going back to work or working part time in a career that I no longer enjoyed. I gave my 2 week notice yesterday and turned down the other job the same company offered me. The reason: Career Burnout. My conclusion was that the stress and frustration of working in a high paced computer programming job was just not worth the extra money anymore. I feel for the people that are stuck in these types of jobs and have no choice but to toil on in a very stressful job. Thank God I had the foresight 30 years ago to start saving for early retirement so I could end this insanity on my own terms.

Anyway, I'll be FIRE'd again soon!
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:55 AM   #33
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Anyway, I'll be FIRE'd again soon!
Congratulations, and good luck. Although your dip back into the pool wasn't pleasant, at least you know about this now and won't always be wondering about what it would have been like.

In regard to your question about part-time work--that's similar to what I'm doing, but as an independent contractor (self-employed) not an employee. Maybe this would work for you, too. I only have one client, and they call me when they have work that needs to be done. It's for a fixed duration, and I'm free to say "yes" or "no" to each opportunity. I sign an agreement each year that specifies the hourly rate, so there's no haggling over that. It has worked out well for me and, I think, for them. I enjoy the work and the guys I work with, and the client apparently feels they are getting good value for their money. There's flexibility ("I'll be out of town in June, so I won't be able to take any work") and there's a distinct lack of BS. As an employee you get dragged into staff meetings, additional assignments, possibly supervising others, office politics, etc. As the "guest-help" temp guy, you come in and work on a project, get it done, and go home for weeks at a time. That time away from the office makes you a very unattractive candidate to do the recurring unpleasant admin tasks that proliferate in most offices. There's no sense in having you do the weekly TPS reports* if you'll be gone next week. . .
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*Dom Portwood: Hi, Peter. What's happening? We need to talk about your TPS reports.
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Dom Portwood: Ah! Yeah. It's just we're putting new coversheets on all the TPS reports before they go out now. So if you could go ahead and try to remember to do that from now on, that'd be great. All right!
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:56 AM   #34
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Thank God I had the foresight 30 years ago to start saving for early retirement so I could end this insanity on my own terms.
LBYM'ers rule! Good for you.

I just came back from a trip for megacorp. Without the work, I am not going hungry or anything, but the pay allows me to go to a higher equity AA (someone's got to buy looow), and to splurge on travel when a good deal comes along.

As long as they treat me nicely and have interesting work for me, I don't mind doing it. Else, I walk. It's nice to have options.
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Old 05-16-2009, 12:00 PM   #35
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Congratulations! Ultimately you are the expert on what is right for you, of course. Hopefully the discussion helped you to sort through the possibilities and make the right decision.
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Old 05-16-2009, 02:17 PM   #36
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...The reason: Career Burnout. My conclusion was that the stress and frustration of working in a high paced computer programming job was just not worth the extra money anymore. I feel for the people that are stuck in these types of jobs and have no choice but to toil on in a very stressful job. Thank God I had the foresight 30 years ago to start saving for early retirement so I could end this insanity on my own terms.

Anyway, I'll be FIRE'd again soon!
I just LOVE happy endings.
The important thing is YOU made the decision, not the industry nor the project nor the managers nor the whiners
Closing this door could open a new one for you.
Keep your options open. Especially the goofing off options.
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Old 05-17-2009, 03:23 AM   #37
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This week I heard that a colleague who is about my age has metastatic cancer. If I were in that situation I would walk away from my job and try to enjoy whatever time I had left. Now imagine that you had similar news. Would you go back to work?
This reminded me of an experience around 1993 that helped opened my eyes to how short time can be.

I was called in to take over a one person (computer) project with no notice, training, or documentation. The original programmer, a married man in his thirties, had not been feeling well for a while, so he went to his doctor. He went into the hospital that day and died a few months later of leukemia.
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Old 05-17-2009, 08:33 PM   #38
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Yay!!! I am so glad that you gave the two week notice Dallasguy!
Now you can hang out during the am with us here!
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