Hastert should resign? - Page 6

Texas Proud · 10-05-2006, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donheff

This is a bit of a hijack, but this theory always steams me. Whether or not we drove the USSR into destitution by out spending them is irrelevant to the Reagan tax cuts. We didn't go knowingly go into a massive deficit in an effort to fight the commies. We went into a deficit because the republicans were wrong about the effect of the tax cut -- remember the Laffer curve et al? The cuts were supposed to pay for themselves.

So, either we blundered into massive deficits because the Reagan crowd didn't unbderstand what they were doing or they lied to us about what they believed about tax cuts. Sounds familiar doesn't it? Kind of like the war in Iraq that would pay for itself.

Just want to put some of this in perspective...

The Laffer curve actually worked!! Most people don't know this, but what it was is you would get more tax revenue with a tax cut because people would recognize gains, and 'make' more money.. and that is what happened..

The other side of the Regan plan was to cut spending.. this never happened... it went UP... just like Bush.. it has gone UP.. I am embarrased that the Republicans kept saying that they would 'balance the budget' and cut spending if they got into power and they are the worst in history!!!

I am hoping that they lose... can't be much worse with the Dems in place..

Texas Proud · 10-05-2006, 11:15 PM

My own thought...

Yes, he should resign.. It seems that his office had been informed a few times.. and maybe many years ago.. so, if he was not told, then he had very bad assistants.. which he is responsible for hiring etc... if they swept it under the rug so HE did not hear it... it is still on him...

I am sure Nords will verify this.. but the captain of the ship is responsible even if he was not on the bridge when something bad happens...

sgeeeee · 10-06-2006, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Proud

Just want to put some of this in perspective...

The Laffer curve actually worked!! ...

That's not the way I remember it. The stories I read said that Laffer himself said there was no indication it could or would work for practical taxation rates. He simply had hypothesized that at some rate it would be possible to turn the curve around.

youbet · 10-06-2006, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Proud

I am hoping that they lose... can't be much worse with the Dems in place..

Actually it could be! But, I too think it would be worth taking the chance.

brewer12345 · 10-06-2006, 09:17 AM

Heh, I saw this on the Rude Pundit's site:

"Headlines That Give the Rude Pundit Night Sweats, Part 1:
From TPMmuckraker:

"Hastert: I Want a Good, Thorough Probe."

Thank you, and good night."

Nords · 10-06-2006, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Proud

I am sure Nords will verify this.. but the captain of the ship is responsible even if he was not on the bridge when something bad happens...

As long as he's in command, he's responsible whether or not he's even on board.

More COs have been hung by their standing orders than by conning their ships onto the rocks...

ladelfina · 10-06-2006, 11:38 AM

Good one, brewer! But check out Wonkette for the full "coverage":

(screen grab from Time mag website)

House Repubs Pull a Real Boner
Was Hastert Too Cocksure?
GOP No Longer Cruising to Reelection
Foley Comes at Uncomfortable Time For Reynolds
Will GOP Leadership Reach Around to Protect Foley?
New York Times: In Foley Blame Game, Republicans Line up Into Givers, Receivers

http://www.wonkette.com/politics/mar.../?refId=205016

Never a dull moment at Wonkette...

FinanceDude · 10-06-2006, 12:05 PM

I'm getting really sick of Congress...........can't them do so pork barrel legislation or give billions to some buddy so we can get back to business............

brewer12345 · 10-06-2006, 12:09 PM

I think they've decided to dispense with the "barrel" and the legislating and just concentrate on the porking.

FinanceDude · 10-06-2006, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brewer12345

I think they've decided to dispense with the "barrel" and the legislating and just concentrate on the porking.

Yeah, it gives more meaning to the phrase:

"we're getting screwed by Congress"..............right?

donheff · 10-06-2006, 02:17 PM

I am laughing until I'm crying. Keep these puns coming (no pun intended)

**REWahoo** · 10-06-2006, 04:08 PM

Per Leno:

"Since Foley resigned, I guess his seat is up for grabs. Wait a minute...isn't that how we got here?"

sgeeeee · 10-06-2006, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brewer12345

I think they've decided to dispense with the "barrel" and the legislating and just concentrate on the porking.

donheff · 10-07-2006, 10:58 AM

Well, it might have been nice to let this thread die out but this mess keeps spinning further and further out of control for the Republicans. It always seems with these scandals that embarassed pols squirmming to escape start lying to divert attention and obscure what happened. The truth inevitably comes out and the focus swicthes to a cover up - often the cover up ends up being worse (sometimes felonious) than the original allegations. And so it is with Hastert's/Hastert's staff's role in Foleygate.

There is a front page article in this morning's Washington Post that is a bombshell if true. Kirk Fordham, the former Foley chief of staff who resigned after it came out he tried to convince ABC to hold back some of the nasty IMs, has said that he spoke with Hastert's staff 3 years ago to try to get the leadership to deal with Foley. Hastert and Scott Palmer (Hastert's Chief of Staff) denied that any of this took place. Palmer has vehemently denied any meetings with Forham and any related meetings with Foley. Now other GOP staff have confirmed to the Post that Palmer did meet with Fordham and, in fact, confronted Foley about the allegations in a meeting way before the November 2005 date that Hastert and company say was the first they knew of any of this.

If the Post article has legs this will quickly become a scandal about a coverup. The GOP mouthpieces are already on CNN trying to spin this as just "a staffer" problem -- implying that some staffers that didn't know their place may have innappropriately taken things on themselves. But Palmer is a big deal, described by the Post as "more powerful than all but a few House members... Members know he speaks for Hastert." This isn't just some low level rogue staffer. If he goes, Hastert goes.

Zathras · 10-08-2006, 09:12 AM

Agreed 100%.
I would go so far as saying that the cover up is almost always a bigger issue than the issue being covered up.

Most people I know are more concerned about the Rep leaderships role in a cover-up than the poor judgement of a Rep from a state half way across the country from us.

Clinton never would have been indicted if he had not tried to cover up his games with Monica.

Any republican that had anything to do with anything that even looks like a coverup should have retired. Not only would their posesion of the house not been in dire straights, they could have turned it into a strength for the election.

**REWahoo** · 10-10-2006, 09:56 AM

"Let's bring our boys home...from Congress!"

- Robin Williams

View Poll Results: Hastert should resign?
YES	44	77.19%
no	13	22.81%
Voters: 57. You may not vote on this poll

10-05-2006, 11:15 PM	#102
Texas Proud Thinks s/he gets paid by the post Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,052	Re: Hastert should resign? My own thought... Yes, he should resign.. It seems that his office had been informed a few times.. and maybe many years ago.. so, if he was not told, then he had very bad assistants.. which he is responsible for hiring etc... if they swept it under the rug so HE did not hear it... it is still on him... I am sure Nords will verify this.. but the captain of the ship is responsible even if he was not on the bridge when something bad happens...

10-06-2006, 09:17 AM	#105
brewer12345 Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ... Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,248	Re: Hastert should resign? Heh, I saw this on the Rude Pundit's site: "Headlines That Give the Rude Pundit Night Sweats, Part 1: From TPMmuckraker: "Hastert: I Want a Good, Thorough Probe." Thank you, and good night." __________________ “When you realize that you are one of the rare few who observe moral principles in their relationships with others, there is a temptation to sink into amorality, not out of conviction or pleasure but simply to avoid further pain, because there is no greater suffering than being an angel in hell, whereas a devil feels at home wherever he goes.” – Martin Page, How I Became Stupid

10-06-2006, 11:38 AM	#107
ladelfina Thinks s/he gets paid by the post Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 2,652	Re: Hastert should resign? Good one, brewer! But check out Wonkette for the full "coverage": (screen grab from Time mag website) House Repubs Pull a Real Boner Was Hastert Too Cocksure? GOP No Longer Cruising to Reelection Foley Comes at Uncomfortable Time For Reynolds Will GOP Leadership Reach Around to Protect Foley? New York Times: In Foley Blame Game, Republicans Line up Into Givers, Receivers http://www.wonkette.com/politics/mar.../?refId=205016 Never a dull moment at Wonkette...

10-06-2006, 12:05 PM	#108
FinanceDude Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ... Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 7,411	Re: Hastert should resign? I'm getting really sick of Congress...........can't them do so pork barrel legislation or give billions to some buddy so we can get back to business............ __________________ Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:) President Obama, please know that I will continue to cling to my guns and religion........:)

10-06-2006, 12:09 PM	#109
brewer12345 Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ... Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,248	Re: Hastert should resign? I think they've decided to dispense with the "barrel" and the legislating and just concentrate on the porking. __________________ “When you realize that you are one of the rare few who observe moral principles in their relationships with others, there is a temptation to sink into amorality, not out of conviction or pleasure but simply to avoid further pain, because there is no greater suffering than being an angel in hell, whereas a devil feels at home wherever he goes.” – Martin Page, How I Became Stupid

10-06-2006, 02:17 PM	#111
donheff Thinks s/he gets paid by the post Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 2,694	Re: Hastert should resign? I am laughing until I'm crying. Keep these puns coming (no pun intended) __________________ Every man is, or hopes to be, an Idler. -- Samuel Johnson

10-06-2006, 04:08 PM	#112
REWahoo Administrator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 11,606	Re: Hastert should resign? Per Leno: "Since Foley resigned, I guess his seat is up for grabs. Wait a minute...isn't that how we got here?" __________________ [Closed for renovation]

10-07-2006, 10:58 AM	#114
donheff Thinks s/he gets paid by the post Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 2,694	Re: Hastert should resign? Well, it might have been nice to let this thread die out but this mess keeps spinning further and further out of control for the Republicans. It always seems with these scandals that embarassed pols squirmming to escape start lying to divert attention and obscure what happened. The truth inevitably comes out and the focus swicthes to a cover up - often the cover up ends up being worse (sometimes felonious) than the original allegations. And so it is with Hastert's/Hastert's staff's role in Foleygate. There is a front page article in this morning's Washington Post that is a bombshell if true. Kirk Fordham, the former Foley chief of staff who resigned after it came out he tried to convince ABC to hold back some of the nasty IMs, has said that he spoke with Hastert's staff 3 years ago to try to get the leadership to deal with Foley. Hastert and Scott Palmer (Hastert's Chief of Staff) denied that any of this took place. Palmer has vehemently denied any meetings with Forham and any related meetings with Foley. Now other GOP staff have confirmed to the Post that Palmer did meet with Fordham and, in fact, confronted Foley about the allegations in a meeting way before the November 2005 date that Hastert and company say was the first they knew of any of this. If the Post article has legs this will quickly become a scandal about a coverup. The GOP mouthpieces are already on CNN trying to spin this as just "a staffer" problem -- implying that some staffers that didn't know their place may have innappropriately taken things on themselves. But Palmer is a big deal, described by the Post as "more powerful than all but a few House members... Members know he speaks for Hastert." This isn't just some low level rogue staffer. If he goes, Hastert goes. __________________ Every man is, or hopes to be, an Idler. -- Samuel Johnson

10-08-2006, 09:12 AM	#115
Zathras Full time employment: Posting here. Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 619	Re: Hastert should resign? Agreed 100%. I would go so far as saying that the cover up is almost always a bigger issue than the issue being covered up. Most people I know are more concerned about the Rep leaderships role in a cover-up than the poor judgement of a Rep from a state half way across the country from us. Clinton never would have been indicted if he had not tried to cover up his games with Monica. Any republican that had anything to do with anything that even looks like a coverup should have retired. Not only would their posesion of the house not been in dire straights, they could have turned it into a strength for the election. __________________ "We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children. (Ancient Indian Proverb)"

10-10-2006, 09:56 AM	#116
REWahoo Administrator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 11,606	Re: Hastert should resign? "Let's bring our boys home...from Congress!" - Robin Williams __________________ [Closed for renovation]

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