Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Homeowners Losing Equity Lines
Old 02-23-2008, 09:28 AM   #1
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 116
Homeowners Losing Equity Lines

An article in today's Washington Post.

washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines

Homeowners Losing Equity Lines

As House Values Fall, Some Banks Withdraw Credit


In one brief phone call, Nancy Corazzi's lender yanked away what was left of the $95,000 home equity line of credit that she and her husband took out five months ago.

The lender informed her that her Howard County home had plummeted in value and the company did not want the risk that she would owe more than the house was worth.

"I got off the phone and I was shaking," said Corazzi, who was using the money to pay preschool tuition for her twins ."I was near tears. We needed this credit line to get us through some tough times.".....

Tough times?? Pay for preschool tuition?? Now I don't have kids so maybe I don't understand but how much preschool tuition costs. Maybe we need some federal scholarships to help pay for preschools, so this family doesn't need to tap their home equity. Amazing.
__________________

__________________
Gworker is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 02-23-2008, 09:38 AM   #2
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
FinanceDude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,484
Well, when my kid was in a preschool, I paid $1100 a month for their care, my wife worked and so did I...........

So it can be expensive..........
__________________

__________________
Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)


This Thread is USELESS without pics.........:)
FinanceDude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 09:43 AM   #3
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,119
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinanceDude View Post
Well, when my kid was in a preschool, I paid $1100 a month for their care, my wife worked and so did I...........

So it can be expensive..........
Have your wife stay home, then no preschool at 1100 a month. Need money do what many other men have done work a second or third job at night evenings weekends whenever so your wife can stay home.

Home equity lines of credit are some of the dumbest ways of spending money in america for the average joe. I want it now mentality, sorry but if you need to borrow from the equity in your home for extra purchases you have no business buying it since you cannot afford it.
__________________
newguy88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 11:51 AM   #4
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
thefed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,203
I use my equity lines as a reserve, as leverage, as temporary credit, etc.

IF my bank were to rescind these,I'd be bummed out too. I keep 25k in cash for just that reason....what if my HELOC's 'go away'....and I had no CASH...I'd be tapping retirement accts!! no thanks

I use these responsibly though...for instance I am now writing a $3k check from one to side a rental. The next 6months rent will go toward that balance. I also use them to transfer a few balances around to keep my ccard companies sending those 0% offers....

I also use them as 'revolving credit lines' for business expenses,which thiss pring might be $10k....but that10k will be paid off by june-july
__________________
thefed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 12:04 PM   #5
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
While I'm sympathetic towards those whose lives get temporarily shaken up by changes in the rules, personally I'm glad to see the terms of these loans become more conservative and the liquidity of value "locked up" in real estate be reduced.
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 12:58 PM   #6
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,119
Quote:
Originally Posted by thefed View Post
I use my equity lines as a reserve, as leverage, as temporary credit, etc.

IF my bank were to rescind these,I'd be bummed out too. I keep 25k in cash for just that reason....what if my HELOC's 'go away'....and I had no CASH...I'd be tapping retirement accts!! no thanks

I use these responsibly though...for instance I am now writing a $3k check from one to side a rental. The next 6months rent will go toward that balance. I also use them to transfer a few balances around to keep my ccard companies sending those 0% offers....

I also use them as 'revolving credit lines' for business expenses,which thiss pring might be $10k....but that10k will be paid off by june-july
That is just it, people like you are on point and use it wisely to move money to the needs of your corporation. too many use it to buy flat screen tvs, cars that are well over 30K and vacations because they say they deserve it.
__________________
newguy88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 04:24 PM   #7
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 2,951
Surprisingly, the lender is USAA and the loan is only ~6 month old. Howard County, MD recently topped the household income list, I think. Here is the real irony:

"Corazzi initially used her line to consolidate debt. She and her husband took out the credit line in October because they thought her job was in jeopardy.
It was. In December, her salaried position as a loan-processing manager at a local mortgage bank changed to a commission-only job. "
__________________
jazz4cash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 06:54 PM   #8
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,612
I would expect the lender to reimburse any and all fees the borrower may have paid to originate the loan.

Still, preschool "tuition"? Gotta get that three-year-old ready for Harvard. Good grief.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 07:08 PM   #9
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,764
Going to be some hard lessons earned er learned.
__________________
Notmuchlonger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 07:30 PM   #10
Full time employment: Posting here.
Retire Soon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 655
Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy888 View Post
I want it now mentality, sorry but if you need to borrow from the equity in your home for extra purchases you have no business buying it since you cannot afford it.
Point is well made. Americans no longer seem to grasp the concept of deferred gratification. It's too bad this had to happen. Maybe this will change with the bursting of the real estate bubble.
__________________
Retire Soon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 07:42 PM   #11
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
growing_older's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,608
With both parents working, they have the kids in some kind of daycare and often daycare for 4 year olds just calls itself "preschool" so without more info it's hard to know much about whether that's reasonable or not. I did think it interesting that their lifestyle fully consumes all their income (and maybe plus a little bit) so that when her income dropped they turned to spending down equity. Also, given her line of work she might have anticipated that house prices could be falling. In any event they appear to be living paycheck to paycheck so any employment change puts them in financial danger, yet still live in a half a million dollar house, fully fully mortgaged. They don't seem like helpless victims of their plight, but more like avid consumers who prefer not to LBYM and instead leveraged to the max. If things don't go well, there is a downside to that plan.
__________________
growing_older is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 10:38 PM   #12
Full time employment: Posting here.
UncleHoney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Columbus
Posts: 769
Quote:
Originally Posted by growing_older View Post
If things don't go well, there is a downside to that plan.
Years ago my old boss had a few sayings for all us young sprouts starting out.

#1 Everything is all right as long as everything is all right.

#2 You don't know what you don't know.

From an old penny pinching miser.
__________________
UncleHoney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 11:12 PM   #13
Moderator Emeritus
laurence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 5,234
Second the comments on the preschool title just being a daycare. Our daycare was $100 a day for the two girls. Fortunately, DW only goes into the office once every other week and consults mostly from home. We just ended our business with her completely.
__________________
laurence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 11:40 PM   #14
Full time employment: Posting here.
UncleHoney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Columbus
Posts: 769
Quote:
Originally Posted by laurencewill View Post
Second the comments on the preschool title just being a daycare. Our daycare was $100 a day for the two girls.
Wow, at a thousand a week for two, that lady in the article should set up a "preschool" at home and watch her kids and a few others.
__________________
UncleHoney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2008, 11:42 PM   #15
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
FinanceDude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,484
Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy888 View Post
Have your wife stay home, then no preschool at 1100 a month. Need money do what many other men have done work a second or third job at night evenings weekends whenever so your wife can stay home.
Do you have any kids? Because your response sounds like a guy who never had any kids...........

BTW, I never took out a HELOC to pay for that care, we just paid for it ourselves............
__________________
Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)


This Thread is USELESS without pics.........:)
FinanceDude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2008, 04:05 AM   #16
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
The loss of overinflated value in the home is a shock for many of us. No one likes the paper loss. Those spending the value of the overinflated paper were headed for trouble anyway. We all see how people that are upside-down want to walk away... using the rationale of: It makes business sense!

This is not an article about kids or parenting. It is about financial responsibility and living within one's means.

Shocking isn't it. This woman works in finance and has little common sense regarding personal finance.

I do not feel sorry for her. It was stupid. Now if she said something like. DH or child has a severe health problem and it caught us by surprise (extreme unexpected expense)... I would have some sympathy.

How is it that some manage to live within their means and others do not? Some people have to learn the lesson the hard way. Welcome to reality lady!
__________________
chinaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2008, 06:55 AM   #17
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,119
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinanceDude View Post
Do you have any kids? Because your response sounds like a guy who never had any kids...........

BTW, I never took out a HELOC to pay for that care, we just paid for it ourselves............
Raised two a daughter now a Pediatrician MD and a son with a PHD in Chemistry Now a prof at a Southern University.

I worked nights weekends, evenings. Coached three different seasons while teaching, taught summer school, taught at summer camps, threw garbage off a garbage truck one summer. Did what I had to do to pay the bills.

The best thing about the kids was they went to a public high school in NJ and get this did well and seemed to learn something even with the well bad teachers everyone says are teaching in american public schools. Then went to get this a Public State College and were able to pay tuition and living expenses without going into any undergraduate debt. Yes we paid some and they both worked. Oh this was in the mid 1990s so it still cost a bit. Then the son got into a PHD program in Chemistry at Columbia that PAID his entire 5 years of Grad school and paid him 23K per year for the 5 years with health insurance to be a teaching and research assistant. So his Ivy League degree was FREE.

Daughter took out Loans for most of her Medical school Tuition we paid her 4 year living expenses.

I know of so many parents that say oh my son or daughter wants to go to a private college and say well we will pay the 25K tuition with a loan against the house! Then get into 100K of debt for undergraduate school and now with the lose of equity well payback really is a bit&H!

It can be done. Give your kids credit and teach them resposiblity. Try and have their mothers stay at home when they are young it helps.

Just my two cents though.
__________________
newguy88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2008, 08:37 AM   #18
Recycles dryer sheets
amy5708's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 53
Tuition is an expense like any other. Should someone use a HELOC for their utility or car payments?

If they are, then they need to re-examine their day-to-day expenses. Sounds like someone is living beyond their means....

I don't think anyone should have a HELOC for emergencies; too easy to tap into for every little hiccup. I prefer Dave Ramsey's approach for emergency funds. We have 3 months income in a MMA.

Of course, I used to be a sub-prime lender (*gasp) before there was such a term, many moons ago. I've seen too many people use their HELOC's for "emergencies" like weddings, cars, and vacations. Then get into big trouble.
__________________
amy5708 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2008, 08:41 AM   #19
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,612
Quote:
Originally Posted by amy5708 View Post
Tuition is an expense like any other. Should someone use a HELOC for their utility or car payments?
I think the only good use for a HELOC is to fund cost-effective home improvements. At least there, the amount you spend is likely tied to an increase in resale value, so your equity might not drop from using the loan. For example, $30,000 spent on a new kitchen may well increase the value by close to $30,000 or possibly more depending on the improvements and the local market.

It scares me when people use a HELOC to consolidate other debts, especially if they haven't already changed their spending habits. Swapping unsecured debt for debt secured by your house CAN be a good move if one has acquired the financial discipline to pay it down aggressively and not overspend or get back into more debt, but too many people think it's a "good idea" before they can be confident they won't repeat their past mistake...possibly losing their home in the process.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2008, 10:39 AM   #20
Moderator Emeritus
laurence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 5,234
Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleHoney View Post
Wow, at a thousand a week for two, that lady in the article should set up a "preschool" at home and watch her kids and a few others.

Sorry for the confusion, $50 a day per, so $100 total. Olivia's Godmother/DW's best friend lives 4 houses away, has 3 young kids who play with mine all the time, and she needed some extra $$. Switching to her was a no-brainer once we found out she was more than willing.

I think people need to take responsibility for their own actions, but at the same time, there is something criminal about how HELOC's are sold to people. "Unlock that equity in your home!" "You deserve it!" as if it's a special bank account with free money rather than a secured loan.
__________________

__________________
laurence is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
"Two lines in the signature" doesn't equal two lines. Nords Forum Admin 4 02-09-2008 06:20 PM
Health Insurance / Picket Lines CuppaJoe Health and Early Retirement 2 09-26-2007 03:40 PM
Taking your will across state lines Olav23 FIRE and Money 4 04-18-2007 10:08 AM
banks and credit lines, so0000 sneaky mathjak107 FIRE and Money 4 10-13-2006 06:21 AM
Soup Lines Ahead? Bill Gross Speaks haha FIRE and Money 45 09-05-2006 07:19 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:44 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.