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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 10:39 AM   #141
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by TromboneAl
I've been hesitating to post this opinion, but just thought I'd bring it up.

The problem here is also partly a problem of overpopulation. When you've got 484,000 people packed into a below-sea-level city, you've got to expect that when a problem hits, the system collapses. A lot of urban crowding and suburban sprawl can just barely work when everything is running OK (that is, there are terrible traffic jams but people can get where they're going), but throw a monkey wrench in (storm, earthquake, evacuation), and you have a mess.

Overpopulation also caused much of the wetlands hurricane buffer to be lost.

OK, I'm off my soap box now.
One of the biggest problems I see with the overpopulation issue, especially in this country, is that everything near large population centers becomes very brittle. One major road lost and there's a huge bottle neck and then frustration and craziness in the 'bottlenecked' people.

Another factor is money, NOLA knew that they had a poor catastrophy response system and infrastructure, especially regarding their levies. They were short sighted. It's a poor area of the country, priorities such as street repair, etc. were overemphazised, compared to the major structural problems, Also, immediate food and water is more important than a house when you have neither.

The 'wise' government, those who should be able to see further into the future, should have responded properly to this infrastructure need because people in their daily lives in NO can't or won't. Our 'wise' government decided to spend money on an Alaskan bridge to nowhere.

We need a good government that understands priorities and acts on them accordingly--a higher power so to speak. We don't have that now and we didn't have much of one under Clinton either or Bush Sr., etc. I see a movement toward something not good here. And I am NOT saying Democrats are right.

But we can't move toward starving the gov't either and hoping free enterprise will pick up the peices. Free enterprise has a profit motive; they don't do things out of benevolence toward the people. We need a much better gov't than we have now or had under Clinton. Otherwise, the brittleness and lack of good priorities and proper choices will doom us to a sort of perpetual chaos--in our lifetimes. This is fertile ground for oligarchs and tyrants who profess simple solutions to our problems. We need to grow up and operate correctly and in a balanced fashion in our complex world of growing populations. The alternative is horrifying.

--Greg
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 10:47 AM   #142
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Re: Horrifying

On major news stories I like to check foreign media to see if there are other points of views. I think I agree with everything this guy says:

New Orleans crisis shames Americans: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4210674.stm

In this case I don't see a different point of view than what I've seen in aggregate from American news sources, this guy sums it up pretty well for the beeb.
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 11:56 AM   #143
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Re: Horrifying

I think some of the o so wise on this forum need to start running for public office. They obviously have the answers to all of these problems. Please save us!
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 01:42 PM   #144
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by mickj
I think some of the o so wise on this forum need to start running for public office.* They obviously have the answers to all of these problems.* Please save us!
JPatrick already offered to do so.
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 02:00 PM   #145
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marshac
JPatrick already offered to do so.*
Well I'll tell you this sports fans- - -If I were the mayor of NOLA, the outcome may have been the same as it is today, but I would have been able to show the world a pretty complete laundry list of items I would have tried to do in the prevention mode years ago and an equally long list of measures I would have taken when I knew Katrina was approaching.* Not only that, I would have shown you some muddy boots cause I damn sure would not have run to Baton Rouge and started whining for W. Again, the outcome may have been exactly the same, but the getting there would sure look different.

I didn't offer to run for office.* I'd rather just take over. Considering the lame job you voters have done lately (except for Marshac) you should welcome that.
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 02:50 PM   #146
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPatrick
I didn't offer to run for office. I'd rather just take over. Considering the lame job you voters have done lately (except for Marshac) you should welcome that.
I've posted this before, but I don't see why anyone in their right mind would run for public office. You need not only the skin of a rhinoceros and the ego of JG, but it would be best if you had no spouse or children for the press and public to abuse. No matter how much wealth, influence or power, it simply wouldn't be worth it.

JPatrick, you can assume the post of emperor any time you want it. But why on earth would you?

REW
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 03:04 PM   #147
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Re: Horrifying

Today's paper contained extensive coverage of the losses from Katrina and the evacuees' search for food and shelter. It also had coverage of the annual Parade of Homes. Sent the following to the editor. I know it means nothing in real terms, but it made me feel better:

The heart-wrenching photos and stories of the tragedy on
the Gulf Coast created quite a contrast to your Saturday article
"Big Dreams: Luxury, and lots of it found at Parade of Homes".

Thousands of families are not only without a home, but have
nothing but the clothes on their backs. Meanwhile while we are
building "...luxurious homes that range from 4,200 square feet
to almost 9,000 square feet. Prices swing from $1.2 million to
$2.6 million."

I couldn't help noting the irony...and feeling a sense of guilt
and shame.


REW
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 03:08 PM   #148
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Re: Horrifying

REW,

Good for you. That was the right thing to do. People can be such idiots.
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 04:04 PM   #149
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Re: Horrifying

[quote=JPatrick ]
[quote=TromboneAl*


So if every kid knows the problem, doesn't it seem like an adult somewhere would have found a solution?
[/quote]

Nope.
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 04:17 PM   #150
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by REWahoo!
I've posted this before, but I don't see why anyone in their right mind would run for public office.* You need not only the skin of a rhinoceros and the ego of JG, but it would be best if you had no spouse or children for the press and public to abuse.* No matter how much wealth, influence or power, it simply wouldn't be worth it.

JPatrick, you can assume the post of emperor any time you want it.* But why on earth would you?* *

REW
I think I could handle being absolute ruler, or maybe not................
wouldn't want it to be too much work . That aside, I agree that I
do not really understand why people run for elected office. To me it
looks like nothing but grief. I guess someone has to do it, but I
would never have, even if I was younger and had the energy.
I really believe that your ego would have to be huge (either that
or you are just stupid). Hey.....................an epiphany.............
maybe a huge ego plus stupidity is an effective politician's
"Stew". Yep, I think I am onto something here............

JG
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 04:36 PM   #151
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by REWahoo!
Today's paper contained extensive coverage of the losses from Katrina and the evacuees' search for food and shelter.* It also had coverage of the annual Parade of Homes.* Sent the following to the editor.* I know it means nothing in real terms, but it made me feel better:

The heart-wrenching photos and stories of the tragedy on
the Gulf Coast created quite a contrast to your Saturday article
"Big Dreams: Luxury, and lots of it found at Parade of Homes".

Thousands of families are not only without a home, but have
nothing but the clothes on their backs.* Meanwhile while we are
building "...luxurious homes that range from 4,200 square feet
to almost 9,000 square feet.* Prices swing from $1.2 million to
$2.6 million."

I couldn't help noting the irony...and feeling a sense of guilt
and shame.*


REW
It appears that almost everyone on the planet is more "sensitive"
than I am. I am certain most of you will agree. I know both of my
wives (former and current) would

Life is capricious in the extreme. Uncounted numbers die and/or are
maimed daily. Anyway, I see the irony but feel no "guilt and shame" .
It is what it is. Just deal with it.

JG
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 05:06 PM   #152
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRGALT2U

It is what it is. Just deal with it.

JG
Now I remember what we were missing in your absence, JG. Nice to have you back to put things in perspective for us.

REW
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 05:10 PM   #153
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRGALT2U
I think I could handle being absolute ruler, or maybe not...........
Well if you're not ready for the top spot maybe you'd like to be the Police Chief of NOLA. *
However, I warn you, there will be no reverse gears on your cruisers
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 05:11 PM   #154
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
The problem here is also partly a problem of overpopulation. *When you've got 484,000 people packed into a below-sea-level city, you've got to expect that when a problem hits, the system collapses. *A lot of urban crowding and suburban sprawl can just barely work when everything is running OK (that is, there are terrible traffic jams but people can get where they're going), but throw a monkey wrench in (storm, earthquake, evacuation), and you have a mess.
I'm sympathetic to your view, TromboneAl, but I also remember visiting The Netherlands earlier this year. *That country is over 50% below sea level AND is one of the most crowded nations on earth.

No, they don't get hurricanes, but they DO live right next to the North Sea, whose storms are the stuff of legend.

The difference between their successful system and that of New Orleans may well be a matter of national will. *

Caroline
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 05:17 PM   #155
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Re: Horrifying

Marshac, I think you posted something yesterday suggesting this:

Carnival Sending Three Ships for Refugees

ORLANDO, Fla. - Three Carnival Cruise Lines ships have been pressed into service by the government to provide shelter for as many as 7,000 hurricane victims

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050903/...ival_ships_hk3

REW
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 05:17 PM   #156
 
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Re: Horrifying

I wonder if "The Buck Stops Here" paperweight is still on the desk in the oval office.
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 06:19 PM   #157
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caroline
I'm sympathetic to your view, TromboneAl, but I also remember visiting The Netherlands earlier this year. *That country is over 50% below sea level AND is one of the most crowded nations on earth.

No, they don't get hurricanes, but they DO live right next to the North Sea, whose storms are the stuff of legend.

The difference between their successful system and that of New Orleans may well be a matter of national will. *

Caroline
One big diffrerence is that in Holland, everybody is in the same bowl together. And of course the native Dutch who created a country out of the seabed are obviously a cut above the ordinary.

Ha
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-03-2005, 06:49 PM   #158
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by REWahoo!
Now I remember what we were missing in your absence, JG.* * *Nice to have you back to put things in perspective for us.

REW
You're welcome.

JG
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-04-2005, 11:14 AM   #159
 
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Re: Horrifying

(cough, cough)* Actually I did make it on the ballot, statewide, once upon a time.* This was not particularly noteworthy except for the fact that the sitting President at the time sued to keep me off.* He was unsuccessful;* as was I, ultimately.* For puzzler fans:* I am now in my 24th year of continuous federal civil service.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mickj
I think some of the o so wise on this forum need to start running for public office.* They obviously have the answers to all of these problems.*
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Re: Horrifying
Old 09-04-2005, 11:41 AM   #160
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Re: Horrifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaHa
obviously a cut above the ordinary.
Or a cut below as it were
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