"How The Elderly Lose Their Rights" New Yorker article

[audreyh1]

I'm a little confused. Rudy and Rennie North hired April Parks to be their guardian, without their daughter, Belshe, even knowing? And what states allow this other than Florida and Nevada? Did the PA start the ball rolling to take them away? So the doctors are in on this? We have a living trust, does that protect us?

No, April Parks got herself appointed their guardian without them being involved or ever appearing before the court that appointed her.

 

[audreyh1]

What I can't understand is the "all or nothing"-ness of the process. One day you've slipped a few stitches as we all do in time, but are still enjoying life, with some help from in-home aides and such. The next, you are an unperson, whose life savings - and your very person itself - are now in thrall to a court-appointed guardian who can rip you off at will. Your social status is somewhat below that of Oliver Twist. Where are the shades of gray?

And the victim's assets are used to pay all the legal fees!!!!

 

[MichaelB]

We don't know all the details. At a minimum, though, there had to be a medical opinion, [-]and there should have been an advocate for the Norths.[/-] The court was a passive partner here, allowing this to take place without assuring itself that the affected couple was properly represented and the case against them was legitimate.

Edit to add - it looks like there is a process in Nevada to gain temporary guardianship without any participation of the intended victims. There does need to be after the fact notification, but it's not clear how that is enforced. Perfect for predators who learn to work the system.

 

[meierlde]

We don't know all the details. At a minimum, though, there had to be a medical opinion, [-]and there should have been an advocate for the Norths.[/-] The court was a passive partner here, allowing this to take place without assuring itself that the affected couple was properly represented and the case against them was legitimate.

Edit to add - it looks like there is a process in Nevada to gain temporary guardianship without any participation of the intended victims. There does need to be after the fact notification, but it's not clear how that is enforced. Perfect for predators who learn to work the system.

Reading the Nevada law it does say the ward needs to be notified, but it can be by just first class mail, so perhaps it was treated as junk mail.
Note that the law does indeed require a physicians opinion. (Another person to sue for malpractice if not justified)
Note that the ward must be notified by certified mail or personal service of the hearing. At the hearing the proposed ward must be told of his right to counsel and the counsel would be paid by the ward if there is money.

Apparently the law also allows no notice to a person under 14 if the parent is making the petition. It appears that only if a physician certifies the proposed ward is incapable of attending can the hearing be held without them.
Also the Nevada statute says that relatives are preferred guardians.
https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-159.html#NRS159Sec034

I suspect that the article avoids going into details because they regard this as going into the weeds, and not of interest to folks.

 

[audreyh1]

But it sounds like it was easy to have hearings without the potential ward present.

 

[meierlde]

I just checked Tx and its law provides for automatic appointment of an attorney for the proposed ward Here is a listing from a county in Tx of their proceedure "
Procedure for Filing Temporary Guardianship | Taylor County, TX - Official Website

Note the requirement for an attorney ad lietem to be apointed and that the attorney must interview the proposed ward before the main hearing.

 

[meierlde]

But it sounds like it was easy to have hearings without the potential ward present.

Of course we have seen lots of cases where the media don't give the details etc. Since the hearing had to be notified by certified mail or personal service either you have a big conspiracy or the reporter eliminated facts for the sake of the story.

This is from a Nevada lawers web page: https://www.shouselaw.com/nevada/family/guardianship#7

It states that a bond must be posted, and preference will be given to a close relative.
Then the guardian must place any bank accounts etc into a blocked account that
can only be accessed on court order
Further the guardian may not spend the wards money or sell real property without court approval.
So in Nv to fleece a ward it seems to take court approval.

 

[Dancfo]

What I can't understand is the "all or nothing"-ness of the process. One day you've slipped a few stitches as we all do in time, but are still enjoying life, with some help from in-home aides and such. The next, you are an unperson, whose life savings - and your very person itself - are now in thrall to a court-appointed guardian who can rip you off at will. Your social status is somewhat below that of Oliver Twist. Where are the shades of gray?

This is the difficult part of the process. You may not know you're loosing your marbles. As others have pointed out, a trustee can be very valuable in these cases. It doesn't hurt turning over the reigns before you're incapacitated. As also pointed out, who you name as a trustee is even more important. Although there are no guarantees, corporate trustees are regulated, are suit-adverse, and usually have deep pockets. If available, you may wish to share statements with children / beneficiaries. I know there are instances when you don't want to share, or don't have anyone to look over things, but the more eyes the more chance someone will speak up.

 

[audreyh1]

Of course we have seen lots of cases where the media don't give the details etc. Since the hearing had to be notified by certified mail or personal service either you have a big conspiracy or the reporter eliminated facts for the sake of the story.

This is from a Nevada lawers web page: https://www.shouselaw.com/nevada/family/guardianship#7

It states that a bond must be posted, and preference will be given to a close relative.
Then the guardian must place any bank accounts etc into a blocked account that
can only be accessed on court order
Further the guardian may not spend the wards money or sell real property without court approval.
So in Nv to fleece a ward it seems to take court approval.

There were several examples mentioned in the article.

Without realizing it, the Norths had become temporary wards of the court. Parks had filed an emergency ex-parte petition, which provides an exception to the rule that both parties must be notified of any argument before a judge. She had alleged that the Norths posed a “substantial risk for mismanagement of medications, financial loss and physical harm.” She submitted a brief letter from a physician’s assistant, whom Rennie had seen once, stating that “the patient’s husband can no longer effectively take care of the patient at home as his dementia is progressing.” She also submitted a letter from one of Rudy’s doctors, who described him as “confused and agitated.”

Rudy and Rennie had not undergone any cognitive assessments. They had never received a diagnosis of dementia.

In Nevada a wannabe guardian only had to file an "emergency" petition, and the victims are not notified.

Obviously she also got some documentation from health care providers, even though the victims had not gone through any cognitive assessments. How this was not considered a violation of HIPPA, I can't imagine.

No question the accommodating court was blind to the abuse.

 

[audreyh1]

More cases - it was "epidemic" in this particular county:

As Belshe spoke to more wards and their families, she began to realize that Lakeview Terrace was not the only place where wards were lodged, and that Parks was not the only guardian removing people from their homes for what appeared to be superficial reasons. Hundreds of cases followed the same pattern. It had become routine for guardians in Clark County to petition for temporary guardianship on an ex-parte basis. They told the court that they had to intervene immediately because the ward faced a medical emergency that was only vaguely described: he or she was demented or disoriented, and at risk of exploitation or abuse. The guardians attached a brief physician’s certificate that contained minimal details and often stated that the ward was too incapacitated to attend a court hearing. Debra Bookout, an attorney at the Legal Aid Center of Southern Nevada, told me, “When a hospital or rehab facility needs to free up a bed, or when the patient is not paying his bills, some doctors get sloppy, and they will sign anything.”

A recent study conducted by Hunter College found that a quarter of guardianship petitions in New York were brought by nursing homes and hospitals, sometimes as a means of collecting on overdue bills.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/10/09/how-the-elderly-lose-their-rights

 

[meierlde]

Since many of the states laws allow one to express a preference the question then becomes how to register this preference?

 

[Amethyst]

Your durable power of attorney seems like the place to start.

 

[misshathaway]

Something as innocent as the surveys that Drs offices are using with annual exams alarm me. " Do you ever feel sad" type questions should be a red flag to all of us. DW has a friend who was billed for extra charges for a follow up of these BS questions.

Even if you refuse, as I did last year, your dr asks you WHY you didn't fill out the survey, and if anything is on your mind. For that I was billed for a mental health assessment. Well, the insurance was.

This year I am going to refuse the survey and warn ahead of time that I don't want a mental health assessment. Such an intrusion and waste of money.

There is a reason for it. It's one of those best-practice measures that they do for federal aid. I looked it up last year.

 

[Sunset]

Even if you refuse, as I did last year, your dr asks you WHY you didn't fill out the survey, and if anything is on your mind. For that I was billed for a mental health assessment. Well, the insurance was.

This year I am going to refuse the survey and warn ahead of time that I don't want a mental health assessment. Such an intrusion and waste of money.

There is a reason for it. It's one of those best-practice measures that they do for federal aid. I looked it up last year.

Hopefully they don't note on your file: "aggressive and uncooperative, with paranoid tendencies, uninterested in taking care of health issues"

 

[misshathaway]

Hopefully they don't note on your file: "aggressive and uncooperative, with paranoid tendencies, uninterested in taking care of health issues"

I know! I thought about that as I was writing it. Also not sure if you can refuse part of an annual checkup and still have it qualify as a checkup, which is covered in full. Maybe better not to stand out.

This guardianship abuse article rises on my fear meter even above natural disasters, nuclear annihilation, terrorism, and domestic government upheaval. It is a wakeup call to figure it out beforehand.

 

[Amethyst]

For one thing, it is a heck of a lot more likely to happen to us than 3 out of your 4 other listed fears (natural disasters probably affect more people than involuntary guardianship does).

This guardianship abuse article rises on my fear meter even above natural disasters, nuclear annihilation, terrorism, and domestic government upheaval. .

 

[Amethyst]

Those mental health questionnaires are a required part of a routine physical. We just fill out those forms so we sound normal. (Which we more or less are). I think those questionnaires do a service in that they remind you to think about your mental state, and whether you are happy with it.

Meanwhile, it is a shame on our society that admitting to, and seeking help for mental health issues is seen as a stigma - even among those who should be helping us! Particularly if you are old.

Even if you refuse, as I did last year, your dr asks you WHY you didn't fill out the survey, and if anything is on your mind. For that I was billed for a mental health assessment. Well, the insurance was.

This year I am going to refuse the survey and warn ahead of time that I don't want a mental health assessment. Such an intrusion and waste of money.

There is a reason for it. It's one of those best-practice measures that they do for federal aid. I looked it up last year.

 

[misshathaway]

More info on how to protect yourself

This is an article that has a lot of practical info.

How to Protect yourself from accidentally being pulled into the guardianship gulag

Does anybody here have experience with the group Village to Village?

 

[Rianne]

NPR recently interviewed Rachel Aviv (article's author), Julie Belshi (the daughter) and Rudy North, plus some above board Guardians that are familiar with the fraud going on. Seems Nevada is part of the problem being a huge retirement state. FL is bad as well. Various attorney's called into the program and cited the strict rules in states like Illinois where it's very difficult to achieve state guardianship. Many hoops to go through.

Part of the problem, as they said, are the doctors that go with the program regarding guardianship. If the fraud is rebuked by one Dr. they go to another and find the Dr. willing to play the game. And of course, the judge of choice is the one who could give a sh_t and just rules because he recognizes the attorneys and the guardians as friends and colleagues.

It's a scary scam and thousands of elderly have been put in horrific situations, by the law. One woman that was profiled in the interview had $700K and lived alone completely sane and caring just fine for herself. A doctor said he felt she was not eating properly. The situation deteriorated from there and the woman ended up in state care and the $$, who knows?

Thank you Rachel Aviv, for bringing this nightmare to light. The press is on it.

The takeaway was get a living will and a trustee you trust. Many folks do not have that convenience.

 

[donheff]

This is an article that has a lot of practical info.

How to Protect yourself from accidentally being pulled into the guardianship gulag

Does anybody here have experience with the group Village to Village?

I have been a member of the Capitol Hill Village (CHV) since its inception. Villages are nonprofits dedicated to helping their members age in place in their communities. We have trained volunteer patient advocates who help aging members thru a variety of issues that come up as they age. Still, I wasn’t aware of this guardianship problem and will have to inquire with the executive director about how we are addressing it. CHV is a member of the Village to Village Network that you inquired about. V to V is an umbrella organization that helps people form "Villages."

 

[athena53]

This is an article that has a lot of practical info.

How to Protect yourself from accidentally being pulled into the guardianship gulag

Does anybody here have experience with the group Village to Village?

Thanks- scary article but a lot of good information in it. I've been dragging my feet on getting my documents updated since DH died, although all of them clearly spelled out alternatives if DH predeceased me. This is a topic I'll definitely bring up with the lawyer.