I thought so....

[Pete]

Well I never stopped believing. I have about 1 and 1/2 million miles on Toyota's and have never had a single problem. I just got back from Vegas and got 39.16 mpg at 80 mph (don't tell anyone) in my Corolla.

Mark Levin (NHTSA report on Toyota problems)

Quote:

Mark Levin laments the fact that this National Highway and Transportation Safety Administration conclusion will be ignored by the same media that didn't miss a chance to sensationalize the rash of allegations.-pj

[ziggy29]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete I just got back from Vegas and got 39.16 mpg at 80 mph (don't tell anyone) in my Corolla.

Drive the stretch between east of El Paso to just west of Kerrville in Texas on I-10 and you can tell everyone, since that's the speed limit there...

[Zathras]

Yeah, bad or 'sensational' news gets the ratings

[ziggy29]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zathras Yeah, bad or 'sensational' news gets the ratings

Yep. Can you imagine a headline saying something like "173,281 commercial U.S. airliners have landed safely since the last crash with fatalities"?

[aaronc879]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ziggy29 Drive the stretch between east of El Paso to just west of Kerrville in Texas on I-10 and you can tell everyone, since that's the speed limit there...

Is there a minimum speed? Can you drive 60-65 to conserve gas as long as you stay in the right lane?

[ziggy29]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronc879 Is there a minimum speed? Can you drive 60-65 to conserve gas as long as you stay in the right lane?

There might be a minimum, but I'm sure 60-65 is above it as long as you stay in the right lane.

[Koolau]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Well I never stopped believing. I have about 1 and 1/2 million miles on Toyota's and have never had a single problem. I just got back from Vegas and got 39.16 mpg at 80 mph (don't tell anyone) in my Corolla. Mark Levin

I wish I could have made a bet with someone about this. My assumption from the beginning was that Toyota would eventually be vindicated (even if never completely). This happened to Audi many years ago and IIRC, the same conclusion was ultimately reached. Driver error, with perhaps a fraction of a percent of fault to design flaws (e.g., floor mats or gas pedal too close to brake or similar).

I could see how the occasional driver might punch through his garage if his accelerator got stuck (or more likely, he hit the gas instead of the brake). But on the open road, any normally functioning braking system will overcome the highest powered engine - every time. If you doubt this, try it the next time you rent a "bumper car" from Avis. Heh, heh, back in the '60s, the "poor man's" line-lock was to step on the brake, floor the gas and release at the green. But don't tell my dad.

[Meadbh]

Am I the only person who thinks it's an amazing / suspicious coincidence that the Toyota troubles began about the same time that the indigenous North American auto industry was in deep financial trouble?

I have no doubt that there were some faulty Toyotas. But I wonder if the opportunity was taken and manipulated.

Propaganda has happened before. Remember WMDs?

[donheff]

If I remember correctly, one of the runaway guys rode for miles, phoning for help. He said he was braking to fight the acceleration the whole way but no evidence of braking on a disk examination, no attempt to turn off the ignition, no attempt to take the transmission out of gear. That jerk got a lot of attention before his claim crumbled. He caused $millions in damages but probably got off Scott free.

[Nodak]

The exact same thing happened to Audi in, I think, the 80s. 60 Minutes did a long segment on the supposed problem. When NHTSA reached the driver error conclusion none of the news media could be bothered with reporting it to anywhere near the extent they covered what they thought was a manufacturing problem.

[travelover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meadbh Am I the only person who thinks it's an amazing / suspicious coincidence that the Toyota troubles began about the same time that the indigenous North American auto industry was in deep financial trouble? I have no doubt that there were some faulty Toyotas. But I wonder if the opportunity was taken and manipulated. Propaganda has happened before. Remember WMDs?

I have it on reliable information that laid off US auto workers were sent out to stick bubble gum under the gas pedals of Toyotas to create this concern, all in a misguided effort to try to make North American cars look good in comparison. The US government, now co-owner of said companies, was no doubt complicit in this campaign. These same laid off workers have been stuffing the ballot boxes at JD Power to make US auto's quality look favorable. We were hoping you wouldn't catch on, but alas, you nailed it!

[Pete]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meadbh Am I the only person who thinks it's an amazing / suspicious coincidence that the Toyota troubles began about the same time that the indigenous North American auto industry was in deep financial trouble? I have no doubt that there were some faulty Toyotas. But I wonder if the opportunity was taken and manipulated. Propaganda has happened before. Remember WMDs?

I love a good conspiracy, and even though they are 99.9% unproven I like to consider them as possibilities because they stretch my reasoning powers and imagination. I judge these things on their ability to help me predict the future.
Don't know how a Toyota conspiracy would help me predict the future, but conspiracies of the past helped me to see WMD coming a mile away.

[JOHNNIE36]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meadbh Am I the only person who thinks it's an amazing / suspicious coincidence that the Toyota troubles began about the same time that the indigenous North American auto industry was in deep financial trouble? I have no doubt that there were some faulty Toyotas. But I wonder if the opportunity was taken and manipulated. Propaganda has happened before. Remember WMDs?

Are you kidding m? Consumers Report has had a love relationship with the Japanese automakers for a long time. Do you see them praising the US automakers? You must be joking.

[thefed]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Well I never stopped believing. I have about 1 and 1/2 million miles on Toyota's and have never had a single problem. I just got back from Vegas and got 39.16 mpg at 80 mph (don't tell anyone) in my Corolla. Mark Levin (NHTSA report on Toyota problems)

what year? just got rid of a 95 avalon with 200k and i thought that was good!

[Pete]

Quote:

Originally Posted by thefed what year? just got rid of a 95 avalon with 200k and i thought that was good!

I guess I was a bit unclear here. It was a total of 1 and 1/2 million miles on 7 different cars. The mpg on my Corolla was just a "woo hoo" cause I just got back from my trip. I got 58 mpg, hypermiling on a trip to Texas in my Echo. Sorry, I guess I'm just a cheerleader for Toyota.

[BigNick]

We had a similar story in France about 4 years ago. A guy got flashed by a speed camera going 110mph and claimed that the cruise control on his Renault had gone rogue and forced him to accelerate. Cue outraged articles in the press, by any journalist who had ever had a large garage bill, about how modern cars are all full of flaky, expensive electronics (never mind that they need most of that to be able to meet emissions requirements, as campaigned for by the same journalists) and how their dad use to fix his car with duct tape. Only later, after several other morons who crashed their various models of Renault claimed that the cruise control - which typically had no components in common with the model in the original case - was to blame, did we discover that the guy in the original case had just returned from a 3-year license suspension for drunk-driving and excess speed. But by then Renault had taken a sales hit, their CEO had been up in front of a commission of inquiry, etc etc.

In a similar case a few years before in the UK, a truck driver called the police because his manual throttle (sort of poor man's cruise) was stuck, on the busiest highway in the country. Cue 40 minutes of dramatic helicopter footage. Again, only later did we find out that the driver was undergoing psychiatric treatment for an attention-seeking disorder...

The Audi case alluded to above was the worst, though. A woman ran over her kid in her garage. When paramedics arrived, she was distraught. Then her lawyer arrived and within a few minutes, she was angry. It was Audi's fault. The car had leapt forward on its own. "60 Minutes" even showed an Audi leaping forward on its own (although they didn't show you the hole they'd drilled in the transmission to insert the compressed air). It went to court and finally the woman's case collapsed. I think she got probation or something for wasting everyone's time. It cost $100 million+ of VW/Audi's money and she didn't get her kid back. But on a brighter note, Congress passed a law saying we have to press the brake pedal before we can start our automatic transmission cars, although they didn't say that we have to keep our feet on the brake while putting it into Drive.

This latest case just continues the saga. I'd already seen someone pointing out that almost all of the Toyota cases involved drivers over 65 (sorry, non-early retirees, but we don't become better drivers as we get older). If this report is correct, there's only been one non-driver related incident, and that was caused by faulty fitting of floor mats, which isn't really Toyota's fault (OK, they should maybe have trained the dealer's people better).

[W2R]

I have no more qualms about driving a Toyota this year than last year, and apparently others are feeling the same:

June Auto Sales: Toyota - Yahoo! News

My Venza which I purchased last January is an absolute joy to drive. After ten years driving my old Solara, I love having all that cargo space as well as the new luxuries that have become commonplace in modern cars, too.

[FIREd]

I bought my first Toyota ever in January and I am very happy with it.

[BigNick]

I was about to buy a Toyota two months ago. In the end I went for the comparable model from Hyundai, but I had no issues with Toyota's quality.

[kumquat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Well I never stopped believing. I have about 1 and 1/2 million miles on Toyota's and have never had a single problem. I just got back from Vegas and got 39.16 mpg at 80 mph (don't tell anyone) in my Corolla. Mark Levin (NHTSA report on Toyota problems)

I've never owned a Toyota and didn't believe it either. After all, how could it have been my fault, gimme someone to sue.