implications of owning a GM car

Well I used to own a 95 Buick Riviera that is on the list. The car did 'throw a rod' and caused me to spend a couple grand or more on it. I just chalked it up to the high miles on the car (~140k) but maybe it was the mysterious coolant leak.

I'll never know.

Now I won't be able to sleep all night wondering

The Horror, The Horror...
 
Idiot media people, they can't get anything even the slightest bit "technical" right.

It's not an intake manifold gasket. An intake manifold gasket fits between the intake manifold, and the cylinder head. On a V6/V8 engine, there will be two, one for each head. The intake manifold gaskets are fine.

On the 3800 V6, the real issues are:

1) The three nuts that hold the Throttle Body onto the UPPER (plastic) Intake. These can loosen with time, allowing the TB to Upper Intake gasket to fail. There is a coolant passage through the Upper Intake to/from the TB. If this gasket fails, it can allow coolant to enter the Upper Intake, and be ingested.
There is a recall for this.

2) EGR erosion of the Upper (plastic) Intake. The routing of EGR is through the aluminum lower intake manifold, up into the upper intake. In some cases, the hot EGR gasses have eroded through the plastic wall of the upper intake, just beyond the top of the pressed-in tube that protrudes from the lower intake. If enough erosion occurs, it can erode through into one or both of the coolant passages I mentioned above.
I've dropped out of the loop as to whether there is now a recall for this or not, as we changed out the upper intake for a new improved aftermarket one ourselves. As it turned out, the original upper intake with 80k+ miles on it showed absolutely no erosion. And this is in a hot climate. But at least we have peace of mind now.
 
I've been hearing that scare for years, but it's not the 3800 V-6 you have to worry about. It's the older Chevy 3.1/3.4 V-6es, which nowadays are just about phased out. The Equinox/Torrent use them, but I think that's it. With these engines, it's not the gaskets, but the actual plastic intake manifold that goes bad. Vehicles that used these engines include the older GM minivans (Montana, Venture, etc), the '03 and earlier Malibu, Buick Century, Pontiac Grand Am/Olds Alero, and cheaper versions of the Grand Prix and Impala.

I think most intake manifolds these days are plastic, in order to save weight, but there was some kind of flaw in the 3.1/3.4 units. This engine is derived from the old 2.8 that first saw the light of day in the Chevy Citation, Celebrity, and its ilk, but back then I think they probably used aluminum, or maybe even iron, for the intake. I knew two people with Cavalier Z-24s that blew head gaskets though, so I'm sure that engine had its problems. Hey, it was the 80's though, so what cars didn't have problems? :D

Today, the 3.1/3.4 has been massaged into the 3.5/3.9, which is used in the newer Impala, Malibu, G6, and the minivans. It's been massively overhauled though, so I don't think it has those intake manifold problems. Or, if it does, maybe the engine's just too new for them to show up en masse?

As for the 3800, it's a Buick design, dating back to 1961. It's a bit past its prime, but is a good, sturdy, compact, durable engine. Now from 1975-84 the 3.8 was pretty junky, because the block was too weak, it had lubrication problems, and a nylon/mesh timing gear that tended to fail early, but it got a new block for 1985 that eliminated most of its problems.
 
Andre1969 said:
I've been hearing that scare for years, but it's not the 3800 V-6 you have to worry about... 
Click to expand...

I'll have to disagree with you, there, Andre.  Our '98 Bonnie has a 3800 and it's been through two intake gaskets in its 140k miles.  I have to stay very vigilant of the coolant level to make sure the engine isn't feeding it to the bearings. :(  From my research and questions on the Bonneville forum, it's been quite the achilles heel of the motor.  I think our engine is the Series II, and apart from the gasket issue(s), in my opionion it's a tremendous motor and has been put into millions of GM rides.  A friend of ours works at the plant that builds the motor, and its scheduled to be killed/phased out.... can't remember when.
 
i had a 95 3.8L bonneville that threw a rod.....

and my mom had a 2000 malibu....hers was def the itnake gaskets
 
Wow, I didn't realize that it was that wide-spread on the 3800. I had heard of a few cases of the 3800 getting it, but by and large I was under the impression that it was the Chevy 3.1/3.4 that mainly had that affliction.

My Dad has an '03 Regal with the 3800. I guess I'd better tell him to keep an eye on the coolant level! :eek: Guess that's good advice with ANY car these days, though. Once upon a time you could let a car overheat, and about the worst that would usually happen is you got stranded, let it cool off, and then put some water in it and went home. Nowadays with all the aluminum and plastic, well, it gets a bit more exciting!
 
Andre1969 said:
Wow, I didn't realize that it was that wide-spread on the 3800... 
Click to expand...

I'm no expert on the how rampant the problem is, but I do know it exists. Sometimes you read something and it's gets blown out of proportion. It's certainly someting to be aware of. I do wish GM would have done something about it. I think its a great motor, and it's had a LONG run over the years.
 
Well, I guess I am one of the unlucky ones....

Even previous to this I had a 87 Firebird Formula 350... the intake maniforld gasket went out twice in the 15 years I had the car.. I knew it was a piece of junk, but it was fun to drive... and it was an aluminum intake...

NOW, I have a 95 Monte Carlo with the 3.4!!! It is not on the list, but I do not trust that I have a good one and everybody else is a problem..
 
I had a friend who worked at a chevy dealer...he said they made a lot of money replacing GM V6's from the 80's and 90's...
 
One thing that irritates me about GM, and I guess Ford and Chrysler too, is that it just seems like they'll fight with you every step of the way if you have something go bad. Like these plastic intake manifolds. I've heard horror stories about how when they fail, under warranty, they still try to place the blame on the consumer for neglect/abuse.

My Mom & stepdad have a 1999 Altima. Totally unimpressive little car. Ugly and odd looking, and kinda cheap feeling, and this was BEFORE the French bailed out Nissan and started cost cutting! One thing I'll give them, though, is that when the tranny died on that car, at 35,000 miles, and under warranty, the dealer replaced it with no fuss or fighting whatsoever.

And in the long run, it's proven to be a good little car. I think is has about 200,000 miles on it now, and never had any more tranny problems since then. Actually, I don't think anything else has gone wrong with it, other than normal maintenance stuff like batteries, belts, hoses, tires, spark plugs, etc.

My best friend is looking into getting a new vehicle in about a month. He'd had it narrowed down to a Chevy Equinox or a Nissan Xterra. The Equinox IMO is actually a capable, likeable vehicle, but I'm just a little leery because of that 3.4 and the short warranty period. At least with the Nissan, while they might cut corners on interior trim and fit/finish details, their drivelines these days are supposed to be bulletproof. Plus, I think the powertrain is warrantied for something like 5 years/60,000 miles.
 
Andre1969 said:
My Mom & stepdad have a 1999 Altima. Totally unimpressive little car. Ugly and odd looking, and kinda cheap feeling, and this was BEFORE the French bailed out Nissan and started cost cutting! One thing I'll give them, though, is that when the tranny died on that car, at 35,000 miles, and under warranty, the dealer replaced it with no fuss or fighting whatsoever.
Click to expand...

I've had good luck with Nissan during the warranty period, and in one case after the warranty period. DW's car had its airbag warning light go on at 37k miles (1k after the warranty). Took it into the dealer and they said the "airbag computer" had gone bad, $800 on a car that costs about $13k new. I complained a little bit about it being just past warranty and the guy said he'll check with Nissan and they ended up replacing it free of charge. The dealer also seemed to proactively replace stuff that I didn't even notice on my own Nissan, probably because they get it reimbursed by Nissan anyways.
 
WanderALot said:
I've had good luck with Nissan during the warranty period, and in one case after the warranty period.  DW's car had its airbag warning light go on at 37k miles (1k after the warranty).   Took it into the dealer and they said the "airbag computer" had gone bad,  $800 on a car that costs about $13k new.  I complained a little bit about it being just past warranty and the guy said he'll check with Nissan and they ended up replacing it free of charge.   The dealer also seemed to proactively replace stuff that I didn't even notice on my own Nissan, probably because they get it reimbursed by Nissan anyways.
Click to expand...

I am not sure... so do not take it for gospel, but I think they are supposed to warrenty the 'safety devices' (airbag) for 100,000 miles or something like that... maybe someone in the know can tell us.
 
Wish I'd read that a couple of years ago before I got hit with one of those gasket repairs on my Pontiac :( Come to think of it, that's probably why my Olds kept needing coolant....
 
Andre1969 said:
My Mom & stepdad have a 1999 Altima. Totally unimpressive little car. Ugly and odd looking, and kinda cheap feeling, and this was BEFORE the French bailed out Nissan and started cost cutting! One thing I'll give them, though, is that when the tranny died on that car, at 35,000 miles, and under warranty, the dealer replaced it with no fuss or fighting whatsoever.

And in the long run, it's proven to be a good little car. I think is has about 200,000 miles on it now, and never had any more tranny problems since then. Actually, I don't think anything else has gone wrong with it, other than normal maintenance stuff like batteries, belts, hoses, tires, spark plugs, etc.
Click to expand...
No complaints here. We bought a used '97 Altima and it's surprisingly peppy. One starter motor and a little rattle from the manual transmission, but the rattle eventually went away by itself...
 
VoyT said:
  Wish I'd read that a couple of years ago before  I got hit with one of those gasket repairs on my Pontiac  :(  Come to think of it, that's probably why my Olds kept needing coolant....
Click to expand...

VoyT, get your oil tested to see if there's coolant in it. That would be bad. You could spin a bearing with coolant in your oil. Bad/expensive stuff when that happens.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom