Indicators of Wealth?

[NW-Bound]

Quote:

Originally Posted by audreyh1 Well, yeah. Foods easy to prepare at home I don't go out to eat. Usually because I do it better. But these aren't inexpensive foods and aren't going to be found on the menu at your average cheap eats or diner type place.

These expensive places I describe are in fancy locations and give you that ambience, such as a 5-star resort on a hill that looks down on Scottsdale. The food was just good, not impressive though. I guess I need to be rich to eat there more often.

The food I like and prepare myself may be difficult to find, not because they are expensive or even difficult to make, but because they are not mainstream.

[audreyh1]

If the food isn't quite good the ambience doesn't matter either, so I guess i require both.

And ambience doesn't mean a place has to be expensive or fancy, just interesting with maybe it's own unique points, as well as comfortable.

[Koolau]

Went back and reviewed OP's original list of criteria for being "wealthy." I realize I could do all of them, but I don't do any of them. Every once in a while I consider springing for first class for the long flight from Paradise to the midwest. If the difference between coach and FC were 2X instead of 3X, I would probably do it. But, I start thinking about all the things that extra money could purchase - not to mention what it would have taken (back in the day) to earn that much cash at my j*b. That sort of perspective kind of takes the fun out of too much splurging. I'm sure it's an attitude which has served me well getting to ER. Of course, that may mean that I die with money (maybe quite a bit) still on the table. If so, I don't have too many regrets - especially financially. Most regrets of that type are from mistakes I made in investing - not spending.

Still, as I look back, I see that I am MUCH more liberal with my spending than I used to be. There have been times in my financial life that I didn't feel like I could eat out whenever I wanted to. Now, I don't give eating out a second thought. But I do still make a choice between, say, Denny's and Outback. Oddly, I find so much more value in Denny's (taste, vs price) that I rarely spring for Outback. I'm almost as happy with Dennys $2, $4, $6, $8 menu as the steak menu at Outback. I can be quite happy with the $4 biscuits and sausage gravy, eggs and hash browns. If I buy a nice steak for $25 or $30 at Outback, I find myself critiquing the flavor, the size, the "cooking perfection", the tenderness, the service, the kids spilling milk at the next table, etc. At Denny's, I'm only concerned that they get the hash browns a dark golden brown - crispy (oh, and that the ketchup bottle is full.)

Short of winning the lotto (and you can't win if you don't play) I don't think I'll ever NOT think about the price of most things I purchase vs the "value." Something so engrained over the years is difficult to change. Naturally, YMMV.

[Ronnieboy]

Besides the pat answers of being wealthy (good health, the love of friends and family, etc). I think wealthy or well off is being able to afford what I want/need without having to over analyze the purchase. Some examples: I keep my home at 69-70 in the summer months (May to August) running the a/c 24/7 because it feels more comfortable and I can afford it. Having said that, it isn't something I do on May 1st, it is when the days are getting uncomfortably hot and the nights are 74+ all night. It is the same in the winter, I keep the heater at 71 because that is comfortable for me and the family. But we could bump to 80 if we wanted.
If I have to fly, which is rarely, I pay 'extra' for a direct flight and don't even entertain the thought of getting the less expensive flight that might have a plane change and layover because I can afford it and it is worth the convenience. I plan on flying 1st class when we retire for more room, but it won't be every month, it would be when we feel the need to travel.
I think going out to eat in general is kind of extravagant, I don't have a problem with going to Denny's, IHOP, or Sizzler. How can you mess up eggs, hash browns or bacon. DW does prefer IHOP's pancakes to Denny's though. I know what I am getting at Sizzler and don't order steak there, because it is usually a cheap cut of meat and chewy. If I want a better meal I will spring for a filet at Outback or better steakhouse. Ruth Chris'? - maybe, if their steak is that much better than Outback, etc. It is kind of relative, if we were eating at IHOP and similarly priced eateries then we would go out to eat a few times a week, 3 to 4. If we were eating at outback then it would be 1 or 2 times just because I know of the price differences. Sometimes I feel that Sizzler is within $10-15 of Outback then I would rather go to Outback

Can afford a decent middle of the road car, not the base model tinny feel of the cheaper Hyundai, KIA, or even Toyota yaris. Splurge for the solid feeling Tundra vs the Tacoma, have some upgrades that I can use. I don't have to get a Lexus RX because the Toyota Highlander is built on the same platform, etc. etc.

Haagan Daz, Ben and Jerry's or Tillamok for good ice cream. Going to the grocery store and just buying what I need to stock up the house without looking at prices or keeping a running total (like when we were poor college students). I always try the store brand because I like to save money, but if I don't like the Kroger gravy, I will spring for McCormick. I don't clip coupons, but I will take any discounts the store offers or what they send me in the mail due to my shopping habits.

I have noticed when talking to some co-workers about a new product I have tasted or used and sometimes they will ask, 'how much was it' (like a new salsa that I got at Costco) and I reply I don't know or didn't look, I will get comments like, "I wish I could not look at the price". That is wealth to me.

Then of course there is the ultra wealthy, to me that is more than two houses (which home should we stay at this month, Reginald?), multiple high end cars(Mercedes, bmw, Porsche) , own private jet, yacht, etc.

[rayinpenn]

I am enamored with spotting stealth wealth...

The weekday watch is likely a timex weekender that has interchangeable cloth bands.
The couple year old foreign cars in the driveway aren't flashy but are known for their durability
The job has something to do with technology or finance but details are somewhat sketchy. He or she seems to have been there forever.
The mortgage free home is maintained by the owner - the well worn John Deere appears once a week or so less in August.
They buy on sale and clip coupons
Other then utility bills and the standard coupon flyers they get little mail
They are not focused on things but on places and accomplishments

Were you to engage them in conversation at least one will know who warren Buffet, John Bogel, Dave Ramsey and Jamie Diamond are. They rarely discuss money with anyone other then themselves...


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forumh

[Dash man]

The wealthy that I notice are the ones that give large donations to a project or charity that helps their community, but don't seek the public recognition of what they've done.


Enjoying life!

[tps7742]

Quote:

Originally Posted by W2R Well gosh, I'm not rich. I wouldn't think twice at staying at a motel 6 or Super 8, and having dinner at Denny's or Sizzler that night, the next time we go through a hurricane evacuation. I think being rich is: (1) Not feeling the need to constantly compare one's lifestyle and spending choices with the lifestyles and spending choices of friends and acquaintances (2) Awakening to find one is sincerely, thoroughly happy each morning and staying that way pretty much all day long (3) Not having to worry about the future, where the next meal is coming from or where to sleep each night (4) Thinking of things and experiences that would brighten one's life in the future, and being able to afford those things and experiences. (5) Feeling that one has ENOUGH. Eradicating that crazy-making hoarding/consumerist drive for once and for all.

I have not made it reading this thread completely yet but I very much agree with your comments above. Just enjoying life and being able to RE is a blessing in itself.

[pb4uski]

Here is one indicator... I'm planning a trip to a friend's retirement party... choice is a 6 hour drive, 7 hour bus, 8 hour train or 1 hour flight and flying is in the lead. That said, it is only ~$80 more than the bus and ~$100 more than the train.

[RunningBum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4uski Here is one indicator... I'm planning a trip to a friend's retirement party... choice is a 6 hour drive, 7 hour bus, 8 hour train or 1 hour flight and flying is in the lead. That said, it is only ~$80 more than the bus and ~$100 more than the train.

Very little to do with money, but I'm sure your times are off. The 6 hour drive is door-to-door, right? The one hour flight is terminal to terminal. Add 1-2 hours for arriving early enough to get through parking, possible shuttle, ticketing and security. Add your drive to the airport, with some buffer because if you're delayed the plane won't wait for you. Upon arrival, add time to shuffle off the plane, walk out of the airport, perhaps wait at baggage claim, the wait at the car rental counter, perhaps a shuttle to the cars, and your drive to your final destination.

You may be very close to your 6 hours by now. And in your own car you're on your own schedule, not the airlines, so you can probably be even more time efficient by arriving and leaving when you need/want to, not when the flight happens to be. Plus you add in the cost of a rental car and airport parking.

Driving virtually always wins for me in this length of trip, unless I'm going to a huge city where parking is an issue and public transportation is good and a car is a hassle. But I like driving, certainly over flying.

I've justified some pretty long drives especially compared to flights with long layovers.

[Danmar]

Obviously these things are pretty personal and will reflect the tastes and preferences of the person. Just like spending in general.

For me it would include most importantly, generally having a very high degree of control over our lives.

Things we don't spend on because they seem too expensive or lack comparative value would include private jets, yacht over 50ft, Ferraris , Hermes Birkin bags, Kiton sports jackets,

[Car-Guy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by clobber I know there are all kinds of definitions for being wealthy. Things like being in the top 1% (or .01%), or having a certain net worth, or income level. Personally, I like the link to having "no financial constraints on activities." So, what are some specific activities that might indicate a person is wealthy? . What are some of your indicators?

Financially speaking....... People who worry about not being able to spend most of their money before they die. Or, people who need to work at giving their money away, while they are alive.

[Danmar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by haha Girlfriend much better looking than ones self. If your girlfriend is better looking than you, you likely have something, and it may be wealth. Ha

Good one, and often true. My DW is a real looker but when we got together, I had a negative net worth. Must have been something else......

[ponyboy]

I would say the biggest indicator would be not checking what things cost anymore...you just simply buy them. At that point everything is essentially free. You just go somewhere...pick it up...swipe a card and let your accountants deal with paying the bill. The $ amount of things no longer has meaning.

[Car-Guy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponyboy I would say the biggest indicator would be not checking what things cost anymore...you just simply buy them. At that point everything is essentially free. You just go somewhere...pick it up...swipe a card and let your accountants deal with paying the bill. The $ amount of things no longer has meaning.

By that definition, I've been rich for a good number of years now. Maybe a persons definition of rich changes as his/her wealth increases...

[Taxman59]

Quote:

Originally Posted by daylatedollarshort We decided our price point for good food is about $10 a meal per person. We can get tasty Thai, Vietnamese or Indian lunch specials for that price and have never found anything we felt was tastier or healthier. I had the chance to get some discount tickets to a foodie event in the city last year with chefs from Michelin starred restaurants. The event was a lot of fun and in a skyscraper with pretty views. But we realized the food we thought was best were the Asian dishes and we can get those close to home and without paying much.

Last night I took DW and another couple out to celebrate our 30th anniversary. I "budgeted*" $400 for the meal (Flemmings Steakhouse, not cheap). Total price BEFORE tip was $425! That is an indicator of wealth!!


* I do some tax returns, and hold the cash for expenditures which are not in our budget. The returns are easy and I enjoy it, so the $$ is worth it.

[ShokWaveRider]

We think that simply having ones primary home fully paid for, being able to buy anything we need or want without budgeting for it, and getting a good nights sleep, is wealth in itself.


Are there luxuries that we "may" lust after but do not buy? Yes, BUT sometimes the fact you can go out an buy almost anything you want without worrying is a great thing.


Eg. I have been a life long sports/exotic car enthusiast and have owned my fair share. However, I now relish the fact that I can afford to pay Cash for that Aston Vantage V12 if I really wanted to, and not affect our financial stability. That is as good as owning it, if not better.

[daylatedollarshort]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taxman59 Total price BEFORE tip was $425! That is an indicator of wealth!!

I think that is an indicator of your spending choices and food preferences, not necessarily your wealth.

[NW-Bound]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Koolau ...Short of winning the lotto (and you can't win if you don't play) I don't think I'll ever NOT think about the price of most things I purchase vs the "value."...

I think one would have to be in the rank of billionaires before he stops thinking about prices of most things. Maybe, maybe not. I believe Buffett has a fractional jet ownership, but does not own a jet outright.

Hence, I can never think of myself as "wealthy" in this materialistic sense.

[Big_Hitter]

almost all rich people I know have really nice shoes

[Pilot2013]

I think easy to spot here: