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Old 01-15-2013, 03:28 PM   #41
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Personally I prefer the Academy Award acceptance speech George C. Scott made.
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Old 01-15-2013, 06:16 PM   #42
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Thank you for posting this. I agree with what you say, ziggy.

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Originally Posted by ziggy29
No more so than anyone should regularly go out of their way to be ornery, contrary and somewhat combative. Ideally, a "good community" should be both challenging *and* supportive as appropriate, and such challenge should come by challenging the ideas rather than by making the person who stated them feel like an idiot or a bad person.

Sure, it would be dull if people did nothing but agree with each other and sing Kumbaya. But it's also dysfunctional when some people seem interested in nothing but arguing.

People have every bit as much right to disagree with disagreeable postings as the person who was disagreeable has to be so. Disagreement is not censorship. Criticizing a critic is not censorship. So if you want to keep the "right" to criticize, you need to accept that others have the right to criticize you, not merely assert that they are trying to shut you up.
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Old 01-15-2013, 07:40 PM   #43
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I liked this movie a lot. I am interested in 20th C British History, and I even remember from childhood seeing the old Movie Tone reels about the abdicator and his duchess. It seemed such a bizarre story to me, a man who became King, but deserted his country at a time of its great need for leadership in favor of a woman who looked pretty much like my Grandmother. They always seemed so forlorn, traipsing from yacht to yacht, essentially homeless and completely without purpose.

Excellent insights into the character of King George 6th, both before and after his ascension to the throne. Briefly, to me at least, he seemed everything that his older brother was not, and a great royal partner for Churchill to get successfully through that war. Also it was clear that his skill in picking a mate was top drawer, as his wife Elizabeth could not have been better, for his needs, for his children, for British Royalty at a time when it had been made to look pretty bad, and eventually in her role as the King’s wife.

There is a Masterpiece Theater Upstairs Downstairs piece about this period that also gives a good look into the eventual king in the years leading up to the war.

Ha
But there is another version of events, i.e. that Edward the VIII was pushed out by Parliamentary leaders who did not accept his enthusiasm for Hitler. He made a very public visit to Hitler in 1937 after abdicating. After the fall of France, there were rumors that Edward was meeting with Nazis in Lisbon with a view toward effecting a restoration in the event that the Germans occupied the U.K. These were the reasons that Churchill rusticated Edward to the Bahamas for the duration of the war. The Duke spent his life golfing while the Duchess shopped. The epitome of the idle, useless, and possibly treasonous rich.

The character in the Upstairs Downstairs revival was not the future George VI, but a younger brother, the Duke of Kent, who was known as a flaming bisexual given to misbehaving in public. The male lead, named Hallam, becomes an equerry to the Duke of Kent in the last episode of the series. Evidently the writers were preparing a tragic ending for the Hallam character since the Duke of Kent died in a plane crash in Scotland during the war along with his equerry and several others.

The Duke of Kent was a lifelong friend of the Duke of Hamilton and was rumored to be present with the Duke of Hamilton at his house in Scotland on the night that Rudolf Hess crashed his plane a short distance away, possibly on his way to attempt to broker an armistice with the aristocrat, an old friend. The Duke of Hamilton was a leader of the pro-Nazi group of British aristocrats, quite possibly along with the Duke of Kent. The Duke of Hamilton was also the model for the pro-Nazi duke in Ishiguro's novel, "The Remains of the Day." The novel's theme is the waste of the butler's life in service to an aristocrat who is not worthy of such sacrifice.

All of which serves to remind me that this is the same class of people who inspired the guillotine, after all. I like a good costume drama as much as the next fellow, but I don't see it as any reason to abandon one's critical faculties, particularly for a genre as dubious as royalist propaganda.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:29 PM   #44
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WRT to Upstairs Donwstairs, looks like I had the wrong brother. The rest of what you say appears to be hearsay.

And I think you may have placed the guillotine on the wrong side of the Channel.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:43 PM   #45
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All of which serves to remind me that this is the same class of people who inspired the guillotine, after all. I like a good costume drama as much as the next fellow, but I don't see it as any reason to abandon one's critical faculties, particularly for a genre as dubious as royalist propaganda.
So I'm guessing you didn't watch the royal wedding, eh?
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:52 PM   #46
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Old 01-15-2013, 11:37 PM   #47
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RE: King's speech -
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I saw it more as a parallel of the reluctant monarch who never expected to be king and the reluctance of England to engage against Hitler. The drumbeat of the times carried the story. I did think the big picture was a bit abandoned at the end but perhaps it was more that the storylines merged. Probably good you chose not to see it.
Well, I was only relating what my friend described, I haven't seen it, so I don't know if I'd agree or not. And two people can come away with different impressions, or focus on different aspects of a film. At least the trailers seemed to focus on the speech impediment issue.

What I really like is when I see multiple ways to view the same film (or any art). But not so open-ended that it gets too vague.

-ERD50
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Old 01-20-2013, 11:07 PM   #48
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*** Well, it seems to me if someone starts a thread in a discussion forum, they should expect discussion. It should be no surprise that some people will see things differently. Life would be very boring otherwise.

Should we start an "Agree with Me" sub-forum? I've always felt one could start a blog for that and disable comments, or talk to a mirror.


may i agree with that?
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Old 01-20-2013, 11:12 PM   #49
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who was known as a flaming bisexual

ummmm - isn't that a bit uncalled for. I mean.. "flaming"??
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