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Old 11-23-2011, 12:01 PM   #41
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and I am more than just a bit squirrely about close-up contact with other people (aka the don't hug me person).
Not a problem Sarah, the mugger is usually not a hugger.
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Old 11-23-2011, 12:46 PM   #42
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I am considering it. But my employer may not allow it. Heck, some of the anti-bear sprays they sell locally look like fire extinguishers.
Which suggests an idea: Scan the label from a fire extinguisher, make a nice color copy at Kinkos, affix to anti-bear mace bottle. Surely no employer prohibits their employees from carrying a fire extinguisher under the seat?

For the train--Lots of people carry aerosols in their briefcase, a relabelling might work there, too. To the mugger: "How about a nice Binaca blast?"

The transit authorities might frown on this, however.
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Old 11-23-2011, 01:42 PM   #43
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You do not want to box or wrestle an attacker. YMMV, and those with actual experience in being attacked, versus MMA training, may have a different view, but the object is to disable the attack(er), then get the hell out. Gouge out their eyes, fracture their larynx, rip off their boys...
My preference would be to not be present when the bad stuff goes down, but I'll take a swift retreat over duking it out with somebody every time.

Anybody who has been in a fight since high school knows that if you want to win you need to bring your A game. You need to be in good physical condition, have the right mental attitude, some experience/training, and a little help doesn't hurt. In the real world, when survival is the goal rather than winning, if you can't avoid the fight in the first place, go past/through/over your attacker and run away.
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If you pull a knife or gun, you'd better use it immediately, or it'll be taken away from you, and used ON you.
Or as I heard it said once, "If you pull your pistol without the intent to use it, you best carry one made out of chocolate, because somebody is going to make you eat it."
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TV and movies heroes aside, a couple of karate chops can not be counted on to stop an attack. I've seen guys take a pool cue or beer bottle up side the head, and keep right on going.
There are guys who've been shot a couple of times who keep fighting, running and gunning.

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You must lead a far more interesting life than I do.
You just don't go to the right kind of bars!
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Old 11-23-2011, 04:06 PM   #44
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In the real world, when survival is the goal rather than winning, if you can't avoid the fight in the first place, go past/through/over your attacker and run away.
I don't know if this would work for guys, but screaming at about a billion decibels or louder seems to be extremely helpful for women when attacked by a stranger.

Don't ask me how I know. You may have noticed that I am alive, though. Anyway, I know for a fact that it can be very effective when completely overpowered, and might be worth trying as a last resort when every other tactic has failed.
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Old 11-23-2011, 04:28 PM   #45
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I don't know if this would work for guys, but screaming at about a billion decibels or louder seems to be extremely helpful for women when attacked by a stranger.

Don't ask me how I know. You may have noticed that I am alive, though. Anyway, I know for a fact that it can be very effective when completely overpowered, and might be worth trying as a last resort when every other tactic has failed.
I suspect the men of ER are much too macho for that and would rather take a beating
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Old 11-23-2011, 04:35 PM   #46
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I called the place in the location I will be travelling and talked to the instructor. Seemed like a reasonable person and he made it clear they separate out the MMA wannabes from the regular Joes and law enforcement types who just want to learn what to do to get away. He suggested a cup and mouth protector, so this is clearly a contact sport.
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Old 11-23-2011, 04:39 PM   #47
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You just don't go to the right kind of bars!
And neither do I, anymore...

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I don't know if this would work for guys, but screaming at about a billion decibels or louder seems to be extremely helpful for women when attacked by a stranger.
Better than being driven away, in your own car, to an abandoned country road...
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Old 11-23-2011, 05:38 PM   #48
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Better than being driven away, in your own car, to an abandoned country road...
I couldn't agree more... Much to my amazement, it seems to work like magic even if nobody else hears/responds to the scream.

And yes, DFW_M5, you're probably right that the "Men of ER" (I am envisioning a beefcake calendar) probably would be too macho to scream. On the other hand, when in a life-or-death battle, in desperation people will sometimes do something a little out of character to survive.
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Old 11-23-2011, 06:55 PM   #49
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I am considering it. But my employer may not allow it.
Sorry, but that's just too bizarre for me to even contemplate.
Unless you have been SPECIFICALLY forbidden to do something, you need to do whatever you think is appropriate.
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Old 11-23-2011, 06:58 PM   #50
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Sorry, but that's just too bizarre for me to even contemplate.
Unless you have been SPECIFICALLY forbidden to do something, you need to do whatever you think is appropriate.
I am specifically forbidden from bringing anything even resembling a weapon onto the premises.
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Old 11-23-2011, 07:22 PM   #51
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How about pens, keychains, flashlights....

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Self defense is serious business, and sometimes even the smallest most discrete weapon can do severe damage to your attacker. Such is the case with the kubaton. The kubotan looks like an ordinary keychain, but in fact, it is a machined aluminum protection device. Kubotans are great for jabbing, pressure points, key slashing and eye gouging. Whatever it takes to ward off the attacker. They are inexpensive and virtually indestructible. Kubotans are great for men as well as women.
Kubatons - Batons - J & L Self Defense Products

(I don't have any experience with this company)
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Old 11-23-2011, 07:40 PM   #52
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How about pens, keychains, flashlights....



Kubatons - Batons - J & L Self Defense Products

(I don't have any experience with this company)
I had a flight two weeks after 9/11. I chose to keep a mechanical pencil in my shirt pocket, in case I had to stick it in some hijackers eye or something...

Just so happened that there were several military personnel on that flight; I was never so glad...

Heck, if you're Jason Bourne, all you need is an ink pen, and a rolled-up magazine...
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Old 11-23-2011, 08:16 PM   #53
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WTF Don't tease us like this Brewer, what's going on? In our collective vast and varied experience we may have better approaches than MA training. And, of course, there is a modicum of plain old morbid curiosity.
I agree, I have no idea what we are talking about. Let's lift the veil.

And how is it that a boss is allowed to search vehicles?
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Old 11-23-2011, 08:31 PM   #54
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And how is it that a boss is allowed to search vehicles?
His property, his rules. Like the sign on the pole says: All vehicles entering this property are subject to search." Some employers put it in the contract as a condition of employment, too. Heck, if they can make you pee in a bottle, they can sure search your car.
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Old 11-23-2011, 09:28 PM   #55
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His property, his rules. Like the sign on the pole says: All vehicles entering this property are subject to search." Some employers put it in the contract as a condition of employment, too. Heck, if they can make you pee in a bottle, they can sure search your car.
Exactly. Plus I don't drive to work so there is no car to search. The building is highly secure for a good reason.
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Old 11-24-2011, 09:27 AM   #56
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I don't know if this would work for guys, but screaming at about a billion decibels or louder seems to be extremely helpful for women when attacked by a stranger.
I know for a fact that it can be very effective when completely overpowered, and might be worth trying as a last resort when every other tactic has failed.
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I suspect the men of ER are much too macho for that and would rather take a beating
In taekwondo that's known as a "kihap"...
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Old 11-24-2011, 09:35 AM   #57
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And yes, DFW_M5, you're probably right that the "Men of ER" (I am envisioning a beefcake calendar) probably would be too macho to scream. On the other hand, when in a life-or-death battle, in desperation people will sometimes do something a little out of character to survive.
The other limitation with screaming is there has to be someone nearby to hear you and also willing to get involved and while the screaming tactic may work, a whistle may be better.
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Old 11-24-2011, 09:37 AM   #58
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His property, his rules. Like the sign on the pole says: All vehicles entering this property are subject to search." Some employers put it in the contract as a condition of employment, too. Heck, if they can make you pee in a bottle, they can sure search your car.
So, I'm guessing they don't search it when you're not there. Do they say "OK, Al, let's go search your car now?"
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Old 11-24-2011, 09:43 AM   #59
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In taekwondo that's known as a "kihap"...
I don't need training to run away screaming...

Is peeing your pants also part of the strategy?
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Old 11-24-2011, 10:01 AM   #60
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Is peeing your pants also part of the strategy?
I'm sorry, there are some advanced black-belt techniques that I just haven't made the time to learn yet...
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