LED floods in kitchen, need more warm light

[Lsbcal]

I recently bought some LED flood bulbs to replace the incandescent flood bulbs in the kitchen (older canned light fixtures). These have a color temperature of 2700. But they appear "cooler" (more towards blue) then the incandescents. DW and I wanted more warmth. So I wound up mixing the LED and incandescent floods. Not as perfect a solution as I would like, one bank of 4 went from 260 watts down to 150 watts now.

Apparently the "warmist" (orange like) is color temperature 2700. 2700 appears to be the lower limit for LED's right now. Higher numbers get you "cooler" (more towards blue). This link explains things: Color Temperature

Are there any other tricks to get to all LED's and keep more of that orange/yellow incandescent light?

[Texas Proud]

Funny, but my DW likes the whiter look of the LEDs than the incandescent bulbs...

I do not know if yours dim, but they do not dim at the same level... so be aware of that....

I have not seen any that are yellowish...

[REWahoo]

Several years back I replaced the 10 incandescent floods in the kitchen ceiling can fixtures with CFL bulbs. The color temp was fine but DW hated them due to the delay in coming up to full brightness. The obvious solution was to go to LED floods but DW is also not a fan of the "too white" color, so I mixed the two (6 LED and left 4 of the CFL). She's happy which means so am I.

[M Paquette]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lsbcal Are there any other tricks to get to all LED's and keep more of that orange/yellow incandescent light?

Put CTO (Color Temperature Orange) gels on the higher color temperature lights. These are available in a variety of strengths, with the lightest 1/4 CTO gel doing pretty much what you want.

http://www.amazon.com/Lee-Orange-Cor.../dp/B0000AQJ7C

You may need to fabricate mounting rings or brackets to get these attached. We used an even lighter 81A filter in resin to correct 2 specialty 3000K lights to match 2700K lights installed in the rest of the room.

[ERD50]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Proud Funny, but my DW likes the whiter look of the LEDs than the incandescent bulbs... I do not know if yours dim, but they do not dim at the same level... so be aware of that.... I have not seen any that are yellowish...

And if you have a mix of LED and filament bulbs on a dimmer, the difference becomes even more noticeable - the LEDS stay 'white', while the filaments get more and more amber-ish as they dim.

I had to mix them on the same circuit - even though the LEDS I bought are dimmable, and the dimmer is rated for LED/CFL, they fluctuated in brightness - randomly. Adding in a filament bulb on that circuit seemed to damp out the circuit enough to avoid that problem.

-ERD50

[Lsbcal]

Our LEDs + incandescents seem to get along well but I'll have to watch for weird fluctuations. The LEDs have around a 1 second delay before lighting up. At least I can tell which ones are LEDs from this. We have old dimmer switches but in the kitchen they are usually at 100%.

Regarding the color perception, it's a taste kind of thing I think. Also in some environments the light might appear warmer. I have one LED 2700 over my desk computer and it feels more warm to me. I even swapped this one out with the kitchen one to check and it is similar. In our hallway, the LED flood (2700) is very noticeably colder.

[Texas Proud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ERD50 And if you have a mix of LED and filament bulbs on a dimmer, the difference becomes even more noticeable - the LEDS stay 'white', while the filaments get more and more amber-ish as they dim. I had to mix them on the same circuit - even though the LEDS I bought are dimmable, and the dimmer is rated for LED/CFL, they fluctuated in brightness - randomly. Adding in a filament bulb on that circuit seemed to damp out the circuit enough to avoid that problem. -ERD50

Yes, I had one light in and when dimmed it was still brighter than the regular....


NOW, however, I put in all 4 lights as LEDs and NO DIMMING!!!

They do not say they are dimmable, but I read that all LEDs can dim... now I am reading that is not the case.... will work with mixing to get what I want.... but DW will not like some white and some yellow, or some dimmer than others...

Now, the ones I put in the kitchen (BR40) dim... a total of 4 on the circuit...

Just what I do not want to deal with....

[6miths]

We got used to the change quite quickly although it may have been in part due to the fact that in the daytime we don't have any lights on in the kitchen because there are two large skylights.

[Theseus]

Same experience with CFL's being replace by LED's - not having to wait for them to reach full lighting is golden. Can't say as I ever had any issue with the warmth/color of the lighting, as it was a big improvement over the yellowish CFL IMHO. The ones I have installed are 2700K.

[Lsbcal]

My guess on the LED color is that it depends on what color your surfaces are. In our case the floors are hardwood and somewhat yellow. The dining table is teak and somewhat orange-red. Lighting those surfaces with cooler light can make them somewhat gray I think i.e. mixing of complementary colors.

[NW-Bound]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lsbcal I recently bought some LED flood bulbs to replace the incandescent flood bulbs in the kitchen (older canned light fixtures). These have a color temperature of 2700. But they appear "cooler" (more towards blue) then the incandescents. DW and I wanted more warmth. So I wound up mixing the LED and incandescent floods. Not as perfect a solution as I would like, one bank of 4 went from 260 watts down to 150 watts now. Apparently the "warmist" (orange like) is color temperature 2700. 2700 appears to be the lower limit for LED's right now. Higher numbers get you "cooler" (more towards blue). This link explains things: Color Temperature Are there any other tricks to get to all LED's and keep more of that orange/yellow incandescent light?

According to a Web page by Philips, warm white is 2200-2700K, soft white is 2700K, bright white is 3000K, cool white is 4000K, and daylight is 5000K.

I like 2700K myself, and happy with the few LEDs that I have. I still have a lot of CFLs, and they are yellowish compared to the LEDs. I bought some CFLs in flood-bulb housing and have not installed them yet to see what color they give. Perhaps you can use the right CFLs and not incandescent.

PS. I have a fixture with 2 halogen bulbs mixed with an Ikea LED. I cannot tell the difference between them. On the other hand, all my CFLs are yellowish relative to incandescents.

[AllDone]

Different brands have slightly different colors at the same rating. I have Cree bulbs and Philips bulbs and prefer the Cree spots. I like the Philips A-type bulbs, though.

[Lsbcal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NW-Bound According to a Web page by Philips, warm white is 2200-2700K, soft white is 2700K, bright white is 3000K, cool white is 4000K, and daylight is 5000K. I like 2700K myself, and happy with the few LEDs that I have. I still have a lot of CFLs, and they are yellowish compared to the LEDs. I bought some CFLs in flood-bulb housing and have not installed them yet to see what color they give. Perhaps you can use the right CFLs and not incandescent. PS. I have a fixture with 2 halogen bulbs mixed with an Ikea LED. I cannot tell the difference between them. On the other hand, all my CFLs are yellowish relative to incandescents.

I found on Amazon a Phillips LED. One question on it was answered by stating that the 2700 is seen at full brightness and the 2200 is when it is dimmed quite a way down.

I'll probably just stay with my LED/incandescent mix. Maybe technology will improve and another choice will come up. I'm not fond of throwing good stuff out if the improvement factor means very little in energy reduction. It's fun to consider this stuff a little but don't want to become a fanatic especially with the energy crisis abating for the present. The LED floods I bought were less then $5 each on sale.

[BradC]

It's fascinating to me how much the color temperature matters for different applications. We recently swapped out the spotlights in our master bedroom closet to 5000K "daylight" LED bulbs. The light feels a little harsh, but I can finally tell my navy slacks from the black ones before I leave the house.

[Lsbcal]

Apparently CRI is a key factor in getting correct color. I'm returning my last purchase (CRI=82) and getting some CRI=93 floods. They are a little more expensive but not by much. Who wants to live with a compromise for 20 years. No jokes about your spouse please.

For some more info see: https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/vie...88055#p2788055

[eytonxav]

I wonder if these color temperatures are uniform across all manufacturers; for example is a 2700 Phillips the same as a 2700 GE in terms of how warm it looks?

[Walt34]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lsbcal My guess on the LED color is that it depends on what color your surfaces are.

It most certainly does. As the light bounces around the room it picks up the overall color of the surfaces it reflects from. So even with the identical bulbs a blue room is going to have a "cooler" look to it than one with yellow, orange or red.

[Lsbcal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFW_M5 I wonder if these color temperatures are uniform across all manufacturers; for example is a 2700 Phillips the same as a 2700 GE in terms of how warm it looks?

Look up CRI + see my link above. Color temp is not the whole story as I first thought.

Here is what I've just put in a purchase for:
Amazon, LED Flood

[NW-Bound]

LED's are getting so cheap, the other day I saw at Lowe's a special deal of 4 bulbs for $10. These are only 40W-equivalent, but still.

I have too many CFLs stocked, that it will take a long time to use them up. The small 40W-equivalent CFLs start out with decent brightness compared to their full output, but the 100W-equivalents take forever, perhaps close to 2 minutes.

[eytonxav]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lsbcal Look up CRI + see my link above. Color temp is not the whole story as I first thought. Here is what I've just put in a purchase for: Amazon, LED Flood

Thanks, I did not know about CRI, but even with that, are there differences in color temp and CRI between manufacturers that reflect the same specs? In other words, may be it is not a good idea to mix brands, just in case.