Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Mars ETF?
Old 05-01-2016, 06:16 PM   #1
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,904
Mars ETF?

Those of us retiring rather early (mid 40s, but some here are in their 30s) might one day have a little bit of money invested in Mars (not the candy).

If Musk meets his goal of landing humans on Mars in 2025, I will be 55 and still years away from even early SS. By age 62 perhaps there are several companies doing various projects on or toward Mars.

I may eventually be able to buy shares in a Mars ETF before I am 70. Amazing as that sounds now.
__________________

__________________
Fermion is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 05-01-2016, 06:38 PM   #2
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Gone4Good's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,381
One can certainly hope.

Although it's hard to see the commercial viability of a Mars investment. Musk is making an altruistic investment in the continuation of humanity; figuring a multi-planetary species has better chances of avoiding extinction. That's a noble and worthwhile goal. But I don't quite understand how anyone makes a buck off of it, including Musk.
__________________

__________________
Retired early, traveling perpetually.
Gone4Good is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 12:04 AM   #3
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Cocoa Beach
Posts: 406
Maybe the money isn't actually made off of the "commercial viability of a Mars investment" but the associated technologies etc. that are developed to make it actually possible and such?
Were the Moon landings commercially viable? Doubtful, but there has been significant money made off of the technologies that were developed to make them possible.
And yes I realize that they were government sponsored activities, but the resultant technologies and engineering capabilities have created financial benefits long after the actual related space programs ended.
Asteroid mining may (?) become commercially viable at some point, but the ability to actually do it will be standing on the shoulders of previous space programs.
Who/What/When to invest in is a more complicated question I would imagine.
__________________
Lucantes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 12:29 PM   #4
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,206
I can't think of any technology or resource that makes Mars a good location.

Maybe in relation to the asteroid belt? There are a few initiatives aiming at mining those already, they're privately held though.
__________________
Totoro is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 01:13 PM   #5
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,904
Well, if you establish a decent habitat on Mars and Earth gets Shoemaker-Levied, then any amount of money investment was worth it.
__________________
Fermion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 02:31 PM   #6
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,206
For sure.

Interesting is: how do you make a profit out of it before that day?

Tourism maybe. And government.

[Edit] Insurance and emergency shelter type of companies I guess. Buy a house on Mars, escape judgment day on Earth.
__________________
Totoro is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 02:42 PM   #7
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,904
Baring the discovery of a Martian mineral that cures cancer, I am guessing it will be tourism and a rich person playground.

But hey, that is the way these things start. Tesla did not start up by trying to make a $20,000 car. They made something rich people wanted.
__________________
Fermion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 02:43 PM   #8
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,616
Better to invest in something worthwhile like Biotech because at least it has a purpose.
__________________
LOL! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 02:57 PM   #9
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fermion View Post
Well, if you establish a decent habitat on Mars and Earth gets Shoemaker-Levied, then any amount of money investment was worth it.
Wouldn't it just be a whole lot easier to put a colony up in LEO and recolonize Earth after the big one. Unless we take a hit way bigger than Chicxulub I suspect that even post-impact Earth would be a lot more benign environment than Mars.

I read plenty of Heinlein as a kid and I'm happy to see Elon the "visionary" spend his billions on his interplanetary dream, but practically colonization of Mars doesn't make much sense for a variety of reasons.
__________________
stepford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 03:47 PM   #10
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Gone4Good's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucantes View Post
Maybe the money isn't actually made off of the "commercial viability of a Mars investment" but the associated technologies etc. that are developed to make it actually possible and such?
Sure someone can make a buck on Mars if someone else is willing to lose many more bucks first.

The moon landings are a perfect example. There never was a commercial reason to land on the moon. It was entirely driven by nationalistic, cold-war, inter-government politics and rivalries.

It turns out that the Apollo project did generate a lot of worthwhile spin-off technologies. But no company would ever plan a trip to the moon on the off chance we'll discover Tang in the process. No company but SpaceX, I guess.

Even there you have to think his ultimate goal is to goose NASA or other governments into another space race with SpaceX acting as the lead contractor.
__________________
Retired early, traveling perpetually.
Gone4Good is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 10:11 PM   #11
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
What's there on Mars? The temperature ranges from -225F to 60F, and there's nothing to burn to keep warm. Oh wait, there's no oxygen to burn anything with, as the atmosphere is 95% CO2, and is 100x less dense than the earth's.

It takes 6 months to get there, and once you are there there's no rocket to take you back.

So, you endure a 6 month trip, and die a painful suffocating cold death once you get there. How fun! I say let Musk go first. I will be watching his selfie video. I have no interest in reality shows on TV, but this one I will watch.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 10:56 PM   #12
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Cocoa Beach
Posts: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gone4Good View Post
Sure someone can make a buck on Mars if someone else is willing to lose many more bucks first.
The moon landings are a perfect example. There never was a commercial reason to land on the moon. It was entirely driven by nationalistic, cold-war, inter-government politics and rivalries.
It turns out that the Apollo project did generate a lot of worthwhile spin-off technologies. But no company would ever plan a trip to the moon on the off chance we'll discover Tang in the process. No company but SpaceX, I guess.
Even there you have to think his ultimate goal is to goose NASA or other governments into another space race with SpaceX acting as the lead contractor.
Someone already has decided to "lose many more bucks first" right (NASA, ESA, Musk etc.)? So the investments are already planned or are underway. Technology is already being pursued to make it feasible, monies are already allocated for some.
Why a certain space related goal was, or is to be, accomplished becomes less of an issue once it is actually accomplished. I don't care supposedly why we went to the moon, I am just glad that we did. I think the collective "we" gained much more than we lost, or invested or even wasted.
Now what financially was gained by the entire moon program, and all the related technologies and engineering that had to be developed in order to accomplish it, versus what was actually spent I do not know. But it feels that we gained way more than we actually put in, IMHO (no, I have no source to site for this except my internal "truthiness" ).
I want us to continue to do difficult things, I want us to continue to stretch the boundaries of what we can achieve in every area. Sometimes for purely selfish reasons, sometimes just because we can, sometimes because we should.
I would very much like to be 95 years old sitting on my dock watching a rocket launch from Kennedy knowing that there were people on it going on some great new adventure or expedition....or even just going to do a routine maintenance activity on a lunar mine....it all works for me.
__________________
Lucantes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2016, 07:57 AM   #13
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Gone4Good's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucantes View Post
Why a certain space related goal was, or is to be, accomplished becomes less of an issue once it is actually accomplished.
Perhaps. But for any capitalist to invest in a project they need to have a reasonable expectation that they'll make a profit from the project. There is no such reasonable expectation of a profit by colonizing mars.

If you think that profits will come by inventing all the ancillary technologies needed for a mars mission then the more direct way of earning those profits is to invest in those technologies directly. No mars landing required.

The only way someone profits from a mars mission is if the government decides to go and spends a lot of tax payer dollars making it happen.
__________________
Retired early, traveling perpetually.
Gone4Good is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2016, 09:52 AM   #14
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,206
Billionaires might take the place of government.
__________________
Totoro is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2016, 11:01 AM   #15
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,357
I find Starshot more compelling than Mars colonization.
__________________
GrayHare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2016, 11:09 AM   #16
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,495
Why stop there? If you're going to speculate with your money, why not go for broke?

Rise of the robots is sparking an investment boom ‚Äč - FT.com
__________________
Options is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2016, 11:10 AM   #17
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
HFWR's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lawn chair in Texas
Posts: 12,964
IMHO, to make spending time on the moon, or Mars, worthwhile, numerous missions would be required, to put infrastructure in place. Well, containers of stuff to be assembled into infrastructure. Particularly as it pertains to Mars, just transporting humans there to plant a flag and collect a few rocks, while certainly interesting, seems both dangerous and expensive, when the primary reward is bragging rights...
__________________
Have Funds, Will Retire

...not doing anything of true substance...
HFWR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2016, 02:01 PM   #18
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
Again, Mars is cold, dry, and has no oxygen. It lost its atmosphere for several reasons, and what is left is 95% CO2. What is there to colonize with? It's ridiculous.

Even if humans can build some bubble structures up there to contain the air and to grow food (not possible currently with rockets unless someone invents anti-gravity machines for transportation), the same effort can be used to colonize Antarctica, or the Sahara desert a lot cheaper, by 1000 times or perhaps 1 million times.

Totally absurd! People watch too many science fiction movies and tend to believe the cr*p.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2016, 02:38 PM   #19
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,206
Help me out, why isn't food growing on Mars possible with current technology?
__________________
Totoro is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2016, 04:45 PM   #20
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
It's not just food growing, but to bring equipment and supply up there for initial sustenance involves huge costs. They do not know how to build dwellings for people on Mars, let alone building huge greenhouses for planting.

The problem is not really technology, but rather at what cost and why? Before thinking about how we can build a huge bubble for dwelling, create air for breathing, having enough power to generate warmth, get water to drink and to plant up on Mars, we should be talking about desalination to get fresh water for much of the world, keeping people in the cold climate warm in the winter, having cheap air conditioning for people in hot climate, etc...

Why are people dreaming about the big "pie in the sky" project, when they have not solved much easier problems here on earth? Even in California which is a rich region on earth, people cringe at the cost of desalinating water to help in the drought. And while people are shivering on earth in the winter, what makes them think they can warm themselves up on Mars, where temperature drops to -100F (-63C)?
__________________

__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How to Get to Mars omni550 Other topics 10 09-17-2012 03:47 AM
Mars landing how cool is this! newguy88 Other topics 16 05-29-2008 06:56 PM
Would you delay ER to work on Mars? Warthog Other topics 3 02-19-2007 12:28 PM
Surface water on Mars? mickeyd Other topics 6 12-06-2006 06:20 PM
Mars needs women!, I mean... brewer12345 Other topics 5 10-15-2005 09:47 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:40 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.