Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 07-04-2009, 10:49 AM   #21
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
What's the difference between grass fed beef and beef where the final step of fattening at the feed lot is omitted? The beef raising process I'm familar with here in the Midwest is that calves are put on pasture (cheap) until a certain age and then sent to a feedlot to fatten until slaughter. If you simply omit the feed lot stage and leave them on pasture until slaughter, would that qualify as "grass fed?" If so, that should make grass fed cheaper, not more expensive.
__________________

__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 07-04-2009, 10:56 AM   #22
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
What's the difference between grass fed beef and beef where the final step of fattening at the feed lot is omitted? The beef raising process I'm familar with here in the Midwest is that calves are put on pasture (cheap) until a certain age and then sent to a feedlot to fatten until slaughter. If you simply omit the feed lot stage and leave them on pasture until slaughter, would that qualify as "grass fed?" If so, that should make grass fed cheaper, not more expensive.
Two reasons why that is not so- one is that the rancher can't turn over his money as fast if he must fatten on grass- the steers are older when they make it to market; and 2, it is a specialty distribution channel that cost more.

Ha
__________________

__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2009, 11:22 AM   #23
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
............ and 2, it is a specialty distribution channel that cost more.
Not to be a cynic, but I think your second explanation has more bearing than the first. And I'm sure the marketed expression "grass fed" comes into play........

Don't get me wrong, I think consuming leaner meat is a good idea. It's just that I detect a bit of fad marketing going on with the term "grass fed."

With ethanol production competing with cattle feeding for corn, it will be interesting to see how costs/prices behave over the years to come.
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2009, 02:07 PM   #24
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,257
Al,

That's similar to the way we cook ground elk meat (elk meat has very little fat). We grate Asiago Cheese. Very tasty.
__________________
tmm99 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2009, 05:38 PM   #25
Moderator Emeritus
Khan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pine Island, Florida
Posts: 6,868
Send a message via AIM to Khan
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
What's the difference between grass fed beef and beef where the final step of fattening at the feed lot is omitted? The beef raising process I'm familar with here in the Midwest is that calves are put on pasture (cheap) until a certain age and then sent to a feedlot to fatten until slaughter. If you simply omit the feed lot stage and leave them on pasture until slaughter, would that qualify as "grass fed?" If so, that should make grass fed cheaper, not more expensive.
It is more difficult to make grass fed beef not end up tough and stringy.
__________________
"Knowin' no one nowhere's gonna miss us when we're gone..."
Khan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2009, 10:24 PM   #26
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
Not to be a cynic, but I think your second explanation has more bearing than the first. And I'm sure the marketed expression "grass fed" comes into play........
Well, this is a very competitive market. Obviously if "grass fed"is popular, that means demand and therefore prices are higher.

I used to trade corn and live cattle and feeder cattle, so I studied those relationships pretty thoroughly, and basically although the feed costs may be higher for corn, the working capital cost is quite a bit higher if the rancher is going to market fat cattle straight off grass. When I was a kid, lots of southern farmers marketed straight off grass. But they usually sold a much lighter animal. They called it "baby beef". I think typically a slaughter ready animal maybe weighed only 750 to 800 #. The steaks were smaller. I am sure their reason was that there were no local feedlots, and to get a full weight slaughter animal it would take a lot more time. Also the beef being older would be less tender.

I think almost anyone would prefer a high quality corn finished steak if he were going to cut it thick, and grill it on the barbie.

As far as health, I think if you dont eat much meat, it couldn't matter much. If you eat a lot of it, then one has to depend on his own reading of the literature about O-6 and O-3. Ruminants do some fat conversion in the gut, how much I don't know. For me, I like this hamburger better because it is cleaner and I am willing to pay a little more for that and for what I think is a healthier PUFA ratio. But I don't pay up for grass fed steaks, I really don't enjoy them as much. But I also don't much like the crappy meat from places like Safeway anyway.

Not always but usually I buy a medium quality steak, cut it again to a 3/8 to 1/2" thickness and fry it fast in a very hot iron skillet. I usually fry up some onion and mushroom and maybe hot pepper to go with it. If I were doing grass fed I would also do this, but likely cover it and simmer for another 1/2 hour or so.

Anyway, I just posted the OP not to convert anyone, but to tell people who do want it where they can find it relatively cheaply and conveniently.

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2009, 07:08 AM   #27
Moderator
Sarah in SC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 13,456
Thanks, Ha!
Good information for sure. And I had no idea of the background for your interest.
Your recipe for pan frying does sound good.
__________________
“One day your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it's worth watching.”
Gerard Arthur Way

Sarah in SC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2009, 09:09 AM   #28
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
As far as health, I think if you dont eat much meat, it couldn't matter much.
Agree with ya there Ha.......

We like beef a lot, but seldom consume it more than once a week or so. For those kind of quantities, it hasn't seemed worthwhile to search out "healthier" varieties other than trying to stick with lean cuts. For example, now that summer is here and we use the grill a lot I'm buying 90% - 95% lean ground sirloin for hamburgers. Throw in a pork meal, a chicken meal, a couple of fish meals and a couple of meatless meals and there's the week with only one beef serving........

Speaking of fish....... We fish as a hobby, love to eat fish and therefore fish is served frequently at our house. When we returned from our first trip to northern Minnesota in early June and I was loading the freezer I saw we still had more leftover fish from autumn, 2008 than I thought. So....... not likely that we'll be doing much beef for a while. But when we do, I'll try some "grass fed" ground beef vs. corn fed ground sirloin and see what I think.

I'll also go check what "grass fed" really means. I think there must be more to it than just keeping the animals on pasture all the way to slaughter skipping the feedlot stage. Maybe the pasture is managed such as grazing them on alphafa instead of random grasses or something like that........
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2009, 10:24 AM   #29
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Here is one look at what "grass fed"may be.

Grassfed Basics - Eat Wild

Remember the old west cattle drives? Those cattle were on their way to slaughter, not to feedlots. Also, pasture fed is probably a better term. Rarely is a pasture just grass species, but will usually also include various clovers, etc.

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 05:10 PM   #30
Recycles dryer sheets
guest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 148
I grew up on a farm in the PNW. We always raised our own beef. They started in the pasture and ate what cows eat. The final two or three weeks they were put in the barn and grain fed until the day of the kill. Gave them a touch of marbling but nothing over the top.

I still buy beef that is handled the same way from a local farmer and find the beef is quite a bit better than what you can get at Albertsons or the like....but you have to buy it a "half" at a time.
__________________
guest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 05:22 PM   #31
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Pittsburgh, PA suburbs
Posts: 1,769
Growing up, when we had steak at home, it was usually round steak, sliced thin and pounded by my Dad to tenderize it. He then fried it up in a cast iron skillet with onions, garlic, tomatoes and hot peppers. It was delicious and one steak fed a family of four. When I cook for myself these days, I like to make pot roasts and stews and soups and just use meat sparingly. I get a lot of veggies in my diet and this method makes great leftovers when I come home from w*rk.
__________________
WhoDaresWins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 06:03 PM   #32
Moderator Emeritus
Khan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pine Island, Florida
Posts: 6,868
Send a message via AIM to Khan
I grew up on farms. Most beef was from over-the-hill milk cows. Tough and tasty.

A 10 year old cow has to be sliced thin.
__________________
"Knowin' no one nowhere's gonna miss us when we're gone..."
Khan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 06:10 PM   #33
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Thanks for your reference URL ha. Here's one that's not from the "grass fed" industry.

Is grass-fed beef better?

It's only a summary and Consumer Reports wants you to subscribe to read the whole thing. But, based on the summry, there may be some benefits to grass-fed beef for the frequent beef consumer.

I was surprised that when I googled "grass fed" almost all the references were industry related. That is, url's of providers, industry associations and marketing groups, distributors and that sort of thing. Really hard to find out what the standards for calling beef "grass fed" are, how growers meet the requirements, etc. Reminds me of the marketing term "organic" when it first started being used.
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 06:13 PM   #34
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khan View Post
I grew up on farms. Most beef was from over-the-hill milk cows. Tough and tasty.

A 10 year old cow has to be sliced thin.
Yep. I was going to mention that but didn't want to destroy the image of a handsome Black Angus steer in the minds of most when they bite into that burger....... But, sure 'nuff, most hamburger comes from culled milk cows, bulls, etc.
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 08:19 PM   #35
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
Thanks for your reference URL ha. Here's one that's not from the "grass fed" industry.

Is grass-fed beef better?

It's only a summary and Consumer Reports wants you to subscribe to read the whole thing. But, based on the summry, there may be some benefits to grass-fed beef for the frequent beef consumer.

I was surprised that when I googled "grass fed" almost all the references were industry related. That is, url's of providers, industry associations and marketing groups, distributors and that sort of thing. Really hard to find out what the standards for calling beef "grass fed" are, how growers meet the requirements, etc. Reminds me of the marketing term "organic" when it first started being used.
I don't think there are hard standards. But if I visit a farm, meet Mr and Mrs farmer, see the cattle out in the field and pick my meat up from a local cut and wrap butcher/processor, I'm OK with it.

Also, there are many farmers/ranchers listed right in Washington off that page; read some of their descriptions and see what you think. By one definition there are only grass fed cattle, because those cows and calves wandering around Utah and Wyoming sure are not eating lollipops while they are prepared to head off and stand for a while in a huge pile of manure in a feedlot, eating various identified and unidentified items liberally laced with antibiotics. But then there shouldn't be any trust issues; one knows it is this way and no one is saying any different.

Some time head on down to Oklahoma and see if you can stand to be within 5 miles of the feedlot towns.

Someone else above mentioned raising or buying beef which has been finished with a few weeks of corn on the farm . That is what most of the farmers sold when I lived up in the country. I am not sure how much the fat composition is altered by this, likely not much, though a little more fat will almost certainly be put on. The main advantage of this method is that instead of wandering around the field trying to get your steer to put his head down and catch I nice .22 slug between an eye and an ear, you just take him a yummy bucket of corn and wait until he trustingly puts his head down to have a meal. Then you cross tie him during his dinner for a few days to get him used to restraint and then POP! or for the real pros the sledge to the noggin.

More to the point of this thread, today I went to pick up some more beef from TJ's, and their computer said "cannot order". So as far as Tj's is concerned this might already be a moot issue.

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2009, 10:15 AM   #36
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 920
Last year I was in SE France on business. Went to a nice restaurant and ordered the steak, and some guy then came out from the back with the cow's birth/death certificate for my approval. This cow was number so-and-so and had had two veals (he used the word veals instead of calves much to amusement) and I could see when it was killed and thus how long aged etc. Truly bizarre.

They then proceeded to ruin it by slicing it too thin and (I assume) pan frying it in butter. It came out looking like something I'd get at Dennys.
__________________
tuixiu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2009, 10:17 AM   #37
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 920
Have any of you tried that Japanese massaged cow thingy? It's prohibitively expensive for me, but I've seen pictures of how marbled it is (their sirloin looks like the large edge of a ribeye) and wonder if it's worth anything near that price.
__________________
tuixiu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 12:52 PM   #38
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,543
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
What's the difference between grass fed beef and beef where the final step of fattening at the feed lot is omitted? The beef raising process I'm familar with here in the Midwest is that calves are put on pasture (cheap) until a certain age and then sent to a feedlot to fatten until slaughter. If you simply omit the feed lot stage and leave them on pasture until slaughter, would that qualify as "grass fed?" If so, that should make grass fed cheaper, not more expensive.
there are no real standards for the term. Mark Bittman had a blog entry about it a few months ago.

Big difference is that almost all supermarket beef is kept in tiny cages and fed some industrial produced feed topped off with growth hormones and antibiotics. Natural, organic and grass fed the cows are free to roam around and eat more of their natural diet which is grass. only reason cows are fed corn is that it used to be very cheap and since it's almost all sugar it's a cheap way to fatten up the cow
__________________
al_bundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 06:59 PM   #39
Moderator Emeritus
Khan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pine Island, Florida
Posts: 6,868
Send a message via AIM to Khan
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
there are no real standards for the term. Mark Bittman had a blog entry about it a few months ago.

Big difference is that almost all supermarket beef is kept in tiny cages and fed some industrial produced feed topped off with growth hormones and antibiotics. Natural, organic and grass fed the cows are free to roam around and eat more of their natural diet which is grass. only reason cows are fed corn is that it used to be very cheap and since it's almost all sugar it's a cheap way to fatten up the cow
Corn (& other grain) are not part of a cow's evolved diet. Grain/feeding lots makes them sick.
__________________

__________________
"Knowin' no one nowhere's gonna miss us when we're gone..."
Khan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Meat Thermometer Too Slow TromboneAl Other topics 32 09-06-2009 10:38 AM
meat in fridge tuixiu Other topics 38 04-07-2009 07:21 AM
Meat smokers? cute fuzzy bunny Other topics 27 06-08-2008 10:26 AM
Meat in life's sandwich Brat Other topics 13 08-27-2007 04:49 PM
Okay...Let's Get To The Meat... Tommy_Dolitte Young Dreamers 22 07-26-2004 12:37 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:54 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.