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Old 03-27-2014, 01:33 PM   #101
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"Should I have a showdown with her, setting basic reasonable limits....or...there is nothing to be done.
Ah....There are 9 of us siblings, but I have this ominous feeling of being the one stuck with this situation."

Response to rhetorical question deleted
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:59 PM   #102
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Sit down with your spouse and agree on house rules so you can present a united front. She is behaving like an adolescent.

Frankly I think she will be such a difficult person even if abiding by house rules that she will poison the well, so to speak. To save your marriage you may need to move to a situation where her living with you isn't an option. That may mean selling your home. You really need to talk to a lawyer to determine what your rights and obligations are, she may be considered a tenant and you need to take legal action.
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Old 03-27-2014, 02:23 PM   #103
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Should I have a showdown with her, setting basic reasonable limits....or...there is nothing to be done.
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It is not that easy to have that talk.
It seems your sister does not agree, she found a way.

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Previously one of my sisters practically evicted her before her three month term was due.
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Always like this. But of course I left home 40 years ago. She was under my father's shadow. Got very embittered when she widowed in 1984.
If your mother has always been this way, what makes you think the future will be any different? Is trying to get her to change the most effective way to deal with this?

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Family reunion, mother included: the issue was thoroughly discussed. Bottom line: she doesn't want to be moved around. Anywhere. She is happy the way she is now. My siblings: "tough luck, sh** happens"
End of story. Thank you all.
Thatís easy for them to say. My siblings are like that, my in-laws are worse. You have to push back. If all this is happening in your house, donít you get the last word? Why not end of story when you say so?

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Our hopes lie in the summer break: she has her own summer cottages where she has always stayed for the season where some of my siblings spend time there. Come Fall some one else has to take up the problem.... And then and only then Ill be able to plead the same excuses that are being used by my siblings if she wants to return home!
Here you have what looks to be a viable option. Why give up on it? Instead of waiting for it to happen, make sure it does, because if you don't, surely one of your siblings will make sure it doesn't.
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Old 03-27-2014, 02:36 PM   #104
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Vicente, do you want us to pity you as a victim, or do you really want to address the problem? Because if you just want our sympathy, there is no point in continuing this thread.
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Old 03-27-2014, 02:52 PM   #105
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Vicente, do you want us to pity you as a victim, or do you really want to address the problem? Because if you just want our sympathy, there is no point in continuing this thread.
Gotcha! I stand corrected. My apologies.
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Old 03-27-2014, 03:05 PM   #106
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I'm sorry to be so blunt, but someone had to say it.
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Old 03-27-2014, 03:46 PM   #107
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I think your really need to push back on your siblings and tell them in no uncertain terms that you will not accept shouldering the burden of mom while they have no responsibilities or inconvenience.

I personally think you and your siblings need to figure out a living arrangement for you mom that is not with any of you as it appears that your mom is a difficult person to live with but at the same time provides a safe living environment where you can all do not need to worry about her.

My mom has long said that she does not want to live with any of us kids and be a burden. However, recently I needed to point out to her that if she live alone and we are not comfortable with her safety that our worrying about her is just a different form of burden.

While it is fine that she is happy with the status quo, the fact is that you and your DW are not, so some changes have to be made.
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Old 03-27-2014, 03:50 PM   #108
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Sometimes it is not all that easy to see the steps to solve to your own problem.

Family dynamics can be toxic and even people who are "take charge" types in their own circles of influence are at a loss at what to do when a parent problem like this one resides in the home.

Part of it may be that the adult child is trying to be a class act, or thinks s/he can "reason" with the parent and convince him or her to change.

Sometimes there is unrecognized cognitive decline in the parent - or the parent is just self-centered and not about to change (or a little of both.) Sometimes the cognitive decline cannot be diagnosed without extensive testing with a neuro-psychologist.

Some adult children need a little empathy while they screw up their courage to act. Some need a guided experience (a therapist) in order to "separate" the enmeshed relationship.

It helps to see how others would handle things. I've heard of psychologists advising adult children to call the parent by his/her first name in order to get some equal footing.

Vincente, I hope you won't let yourself and your wife (and possibly your marriage) suffer too much longer. When you get her out of the house, I would not let her come back.

Kindest regards.
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Old 03-27-2014, 03:54 PM   #109
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Vicente, do you want us to pity you as a victim, or do you really want to address the problem? Because if you just want our sympathy, there is no point in continuing this thread.
Plenty of us need a place to just rant about something without hope of change, and I think it's okay to do that here. We don't have to respond. Although Vicente did ask for suggestions, so many of us including myself offered them, which I agree is a little annoying to have them dismissed.

Vicente's mother is 86--time will solve this problem.
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:00 PM   #110
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Plenty of us need a place to just rant about something without hope of change, and I think it's okay to do that here. We don't have to respond. Although Vicente did ask for suggestions, so many of us including myself offered them, which I agree is a little annoying to have them dismissed.

Vicente's mother is 86--time will solve this problem.

My mom is 94 and still lives by herself with some help 3 days a week (plus of course her kids).... still going good and we are hoping for 100 plus...


I would hate to think that Vincent has to wait 8 to 14 years for time to solve the problem...
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Old 03-28-2014, 06:02 AM   #111
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I would hate to think that Vincent has to wait 8 to 14 years for time to solve the problem...
I'm sure he hates to think so too.
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Old 03-28-2014, 06:24 AM   #112
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Following all your advice, I assure you that at Easter I'll force a solution in the family gathering. My marriage is at stake, never mind my wife's great patience and disposition. She doesn't deserve this. She is the newcomer of all the in-laws.
Sorry Meadbh, but so long as there are posts....
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Old 03-28-2014, 09:46 AM   #113
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Following all your advice, I assure you that at Easter I'll force a solution in the family gathering. My marriage is at stake, never mind my wife's great patience and disposition. She doesn't deserve this. She is the newcomer of all the in-laws.
Sorry Meadbh, but so long as there are posts....
Vicente, I am delighted to hear you plan to take some action. I hope your wife's patience (or your wife) does not run out till Sunday, April 20th. Please keep us posted.
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Old 03-28-2014, 10:51 AM   #114
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Pretty clear from thread that all family relationships are not the same. DW and I are in a situation that we have to address. Have had her mother living in our house (built addition) and it's at the point that we simply have to put her elsewhere. We found a very nice place that seems worlds above what we've seen before; AND they will accept Medicaid when her $ run out (should take about 6 months).

We both agree that the accommodations are nice, she likely would benefit from interacting with more than just us, and the care would actually be better; when she falls now it has taken up to 4-6 hours once or twice for us to find her.

I could go on an on about this; but what I wanted to add is that mapping out how to tell DW's unconnected oblivious brother, and then how to tell DW's mother that she's moving from an addition I built for her 8 years ago to an assisted living facility, and why, is highly complex and fraught with angst. Has to be done, it is the right thing to do, but will be really difficult for DW, and for me as well but not as much. It's all on hold for two weeks as DD is visiting with 4 grandkids; but I have visions of how we will script this out. Am anxious for end result (ability to travel) but not looking forward to all the interpersonal family interactions.
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:14 AM   #115
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Pretty clear from thread that all family relationships are not the same. DW and I are in a situation that we have to address. Have had her mother living in our house (built addition) and it's at the point that we simply have to put her elsewhere. We found a very nice place that seems worlds above what we've seen before; AND they will accept Medicaid when her $ run out (should take about 6 months).

We both agree that the accommodations are nice, she likely would benefit from interacting with more than just us, and the care would actually be better; when she falls now it has taken up to 4-6 hours once or twice for us to find her.

I could go on an on about this; but what I wanted to add is that mapping out how to tell DW's unconnected oblivious brother, and then how to tell DW's mother that she's moving from an addition I built for her 8 years ago to an assisted living facility, and why, is highly complex and fraught with angst. Has to be done, it is the right thing to do, but will be really difficult for DW, and for me as well but not as much. It's all on hold for two weeks as DD is visiting with 4 grandkids; but I have visions of how we will script this out. Am anxious for end result (ability to travel) but not looking forward to all the interpersonal family interactions.
If you can finesse this so your MIL feels it is her decision, it might help. My MIL never got over feeling like she was forced into a nursing home after several stroke-related falls in her home requiring hospitalization. She actually thought she should have the same kind of care her parents received 50 years earlier in a small town--one of the many teenaged grandchildren spending every night at her house for a couple of years, then several years of a live-in housekeeper/caretaker from the country, then finally a nursing home at the very end only when constant medical attention was needed.

PS: I didn't mean to be insensitive earlier re time will solve the problem of Vicente's mother. At 86 (and a smoker), she might soon have some medical conditions occur that will require more care than she can receive at Vicente's home.
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:47 AM   #116
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PS: I didn't mean to be insensitive earlier re time will solve the problem of Vicente's mother. At 86 (and a smoker), she might soon have some medical conditions occur that will require more care than she can receive at Vicente's home.
At 86, she has already beaten the odds (see below). While you are probably correct, in the absence of any specific health problems she could live for many more years. My mother was a lifelong smoker and lived to almost 92 despite having had severe vascular disease requiring major surgery at age 80.

Average life expectancy for women in Spain is 85 years (compared to 81 years in the US).

http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/countries/spain/
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:57 AM   #117
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PS: I didn't mean to be insensitive earlier re time will solve the problem of Vicente's mother. At 86 (and a smoker), she might soon have some medical conditions occur that will require more care than she can receive at Vicente's home.
Yeah, in back of my mind I wonder how much longer MIL can hang on, but she is like a cat with nine lives. Has survived colon cancer (surgery), non Hodgkins Lymphoma, and host of orthopedic and neurologic issues. She's just one frail needy 88 yo woman. As DW says, she has no heart or cancer issues, this could go on a long time. I scan the obits occasionally and am horrified at some of the ladies' longevity as well as the men who are younger than me!

As to making it her idea, hard to see that unfolding. One of the big issues is that she does not see herself anywhere near the condition she is. Of course, the constant care she needs that DW freely gives isn't a factor...to her.

The place we're looking at has private care (non-Medicaid) at $3,400 a month. Lemme see...she's been here 8 years so who owes us the ~$300,000? Or at least would either she or her son say ...."Thanks!" That would mean a lot actually.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:12 PM   #118
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As to making it her idea, hard to see that unfolding. One of the big issues is that she does not see herself anywhere near the condition she is. Of course, the constant care she needs that DW freely gives isn't a factor...to her.
Denial is not just a river in Egypt. Have you and DW considered getting a social worker or care coordinator involved? This has to be causing stress, especially for DW. At the very least, respite seems to be warranted.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:24 PM   #119
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Average life expectancy for women in Spain is 85 years (compared to 81 years in the US).
And they smoke more and consume far more saturated fat. Go figure.

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Have you and DW considered getting a social worker or care coordinator involved? This has to be causing stress, especially for DW. At the very least, respite seems to be warranted.
This is a very good idea. A care coordinator can inspect the home settings, interview the people involved and make a reasoned judgement and recommendation for care that can help with MIL and also keep uncooperative siblings at bay.

A physician can also add value to this process. A neurologist to assess the cognitive functions and a psychiatrist to help deal with anxiety issues arising from the illness and family debate.
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Old 03-28-2014, 01:23 PM   #120
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And they smoke more and consume far more saturated fat. Go figure.
They have fewer infant mortalities, homicides, vehicular accidents and way less stress and an overall higher quality of life. They don't have to worry about their children as much because the odds of their children getting kidnapped or murdered is remote indeed. In most places their children can play unsupervised and they can leave their doors open. That's true just about anywhere in Western Europe.
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