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NASA Study on Antarctic Ice
Old 11-07-2015, 11:05 AM   #1
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NASA Study on Antarctic Ice

This recent study by NASA suggests that Antarctica is actually gaining ice vs losing ice as espoused by various climate change theories that suggest it is melting due to global warming. I have not read the full paper, but here is a link to the abstract:

Mass gains of the Antarctic ice sheet exceed losses: ingentaconnect Fast Track Article
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Old 11-07-2015, 12:21 PM   #2
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I have not read the full paper either, but I have read up in some detail.

One of the interesting things I've read - this seems to mean that if they can't attribute the measured rise in sea levels to this ice melt, then it is coming from someplace or at some level that they do not understand.

There are still so many unknowns in all of this.

Also, I don't have a link at hand, and I need to run, but I also read that some amazing (to me) amount of the rise in sea level is actually do to humans pumping water out of the ground, and this enters the waterways, and/or enters the atmosphere through evaporation (crop irrigation?). IIRC, it was something like 40%. Seems unbelievable, but this was a reputable sounding study that has not been challenged, AFAIK.

OK, found a link:

http://www.nature.com/news/source-fo...l-rise-1.10676

Quote:
It now seems that the effects of human water use on land could fill that gap. A team of researchers reports in Nature Geoscience that land-based water storage could account for 0.77 millimetres per year, or 42%, of the observed sea-level rise between 1961 and 2003.
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Old 11-08-2015, 06:55 AM   #3
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I didn't read his particular link but I read an article elsewhere about the NASA findings that explained that the increases on one side of Antarctica are the result of the accumulations of unusually heavy snowfalls from long ago. Those deep piles are compressing to form new ice while the increasing global temps are causing older sections to break off into the sea.
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Old 11-08-2015, 09:45 AM   #4
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A climate change "skeptic" on Facebook posted something about there being more ice than ever, pointing to this study. Of course, the study said no such thing...
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Old 11-08-2015, 01:16 PM   #5
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No, but it did say that there is much more new ice forming than sea ice we are losing.
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Old 11-08-2015, 01:27 PM   #6
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As much as I would like to respond to this, I know that this could turn toxic-political in about 20 seconds so I will refrain.
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Old 11-08-2015, 09:04 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Winemaker View Post
No, but it did say that there is much more new ice forming than sea ice we are losing.
But was that global net sea ice? Or just Antarctica?

It's tough to find clear info, there is bias on each side, and the calculations are not simple, and involve many assumptions. A little guestimating one way or the other can throw things from the plus to minus column in some cases.

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Old 11-08-2015, 11:43 PM   #8
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ICEcalc predicts a 4% SICR (safe ice cube rate) to sustain my retirement cocktail hour.

However the ice bubble in Antartica could produce a 2 hour cocktail hour.... cause its different this time.
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Old 11-09-2015, 01:07 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50 View Post
I have not read the full paper either, but I have read up in some detail.

One of the interesting things I've read - this seems to mean that if they can't attribute the measured rise in sea levels to this ice melt, then it is coming from someplace or at some level that they do not understand.

There are still so many unknowns in all of this.

Also, I don't have a link at hand, and I need to run, but I also read that some amazing (to me) amount of the rise in sea level is actually do to humans pumping water out of the ground, and this enters the waterways, and/or enters the atmosphere through evaporation (crop irrigation?). IIRC, it was something like 40%. Seems unbelievable, but this was a reputable sounding study that has not been challenged, AFAIK.

OK, found a link:

Source found for missing water in sea-level rise : Nature News & Comment



-ERD50

It is late, so I will not look it up.... but I remember reading about the largest fresh water lake being in Russia.... and that it is just a fraction of what it was many years ago.... there are pics of boats on dry land with no water within 20 or so miles... (since this is from memory, I can be wrong)....
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Old 11-09-2015, 09:08 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winemaker View Post
No, but it did say that there is much more new ice forming than sea ice we are losing.
Depends, I suppose, on how you define "much more", but the study was about Antarctica only. It didn't include Arctic or glacial ice.

Quote:
Mass changes of the Antarctic ice sheet impact sea-level rise as climate changes, but recent rates have been uncertain. Ice, Cloud and land Elevation Satellite (ICESat) data (200308) show mass gains from snow accumulation exceeded discharge losses by 82  25 Gt a1, reducing global sea-level rise by 0.23 mm a1. European Remote-sensing Satellite (ERS) data (19922001) give a similar gain of 112  61 Gt a1. Gains of 136 Gt a1 in East Antarctica (EA) and 72 Gt a1 in four drainage systems (WA2) in West Antarctic (WA) exceed losses of 97 Gt a1 from three coastal drainage systems (WA1) and 29 Gt a1 from the Antarctic Peninsula (AP).
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Old 11-09-2015, 11:22 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Texas Proud View Post
It is late, so I will not look it up.... but I remember reading about the largest fresh water lake being in Russia.... and that it is just a fraction of what it was many years ago.... there are pics of boats on dry land with no water within 20 or so miles... (since this is from memory, I can be wrong)....
Here you go:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Urmia

Quote:
At its full size, it was the largest lake in the Middle East and the sixth largest saltwater lake on earth with a surface area of approximately 5,200 km (2,000 mile), 140 km (87 mi) length, 55 km (34 mi) width, and 16 m (52 ft) depth.[5] The lake has shrunk to 10% of its former size due to damming of the rivers that flow into it and pumping of groundwater from the area.[6]

....

By virtue of its high salinity, the lake no longer sustains any fish species.
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Old 11-09-2015, 11:40 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by 34rlsa View Post
ICEcalc predicts a 4% SICR (safe ice cube rate) to sustain my retirement cocktail hour.

However the ice bubble in Antartica could produce a 2 hour cocktail hour.... cause its different this time.
This made me chuckle.
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Old 11-09-2015, 11:51 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by ERD50 View Post


I guess this is more common than I thought.... and I was wrong on the country....

BEFORE-AND-AFTER PHOTOS: Vast Aral Sea Vanishing


From 2006 through 2009, Central Asia's vast Aral Sea dramatically retreated, with its eastern section losing about 80 percent of its water in just four years
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Old 11-09-2015, 12:08 PM   #14
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I guess this is more common than I thought.... and I was wrong on the country....

BEFORE-AND-AFTER PHOTOS: Vast Aral Sea Vanishing


From 2006 through 2009, Central Asia's vast Aral Sea dramatically retreated, with its eastern section losing about 80 percent of its water in just four years
Actually, I think your link to the Aral Sea is the one I was thinking of too, but the link I provided came up first in my search, and seemed to match. "Aral Sea" sounds more familiar to me than "Lake Urmia" - so yes, sounds like there are a number of them (including the Salton in CA).

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