Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Naysayers
Old 12-06-2015, 03:40 AM   #1
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,977
Naysayers

Quote:
Any time you look into whether or not you should try doing something, especially something bold or daring, there is going to be someone who says you can't.

They are the "naysayers," and they are abundant. If we had listened to them, we would have missed out on the greatest experience of our lives. The naysayer comes in one of three types:

First, there are those who want to do what your attempting --- have considered it, dreamed of it, even casually thrown it out as a potential "someday" or retirement plan. But they never will. Deep in their hearts they know it, and they use "can't" as an excuse for themselves and a deterrent to others, all efforts pointing toward the grand goal of making themselves feel better. Not that there's anything wrong with preferring security, confirm, known entities, and a general lack of danger in your life; there isn't, but it us wrong to pretend to be a free-spirited adventurer and then disdain those who are.

Other naysayers have done what you're attempting, but, in doing so, expended far more resources and feel superior for it. No one who's justified (to themselves, their family, their friends) spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on living a dream wants to know that someone else could achieve a similar goal spending, say, ten thousand. Nor does someone who waited his or her whole life to embark on an adventure want to admit that two twenty somethings with nominal experience can just quit their decent jobs, go gallivanting around on an old boat full of cheap wine and ramen, and the regain decent jobs afterward. It just ain't that easy, dammit!

Finally there are the naysayers who truly believe certain goals can't be achieved, that they're simply too unsafe or even impossible. Their concern is perhaps more philanthropic --- they just don't want to see a couple of quixotic young lovers die at sea.

Whatever their reasons, these people are all saying, "can't," "don't," "stop," "no."
A lesson many learn too late. From a very entertaining read:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 41pr9iw-kZL._SX331_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg (27.8 KB, 63 views)
__________________

__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 12-06-2015, 07:01 AM   #2
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
pb4uski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Vermont & Sarasota, FL
Posts: 16,446
Reminds me of some Robert Kennedy quotes:

Quote:
One-fifth of the people are against everything all the time.
Quote:
Only those who dare to fail greatly can ever achieve greatly.
Quote:
Some men see things as they are and say, why; I dream things that never were and say, why not? (paraphrasing George Bernard Shaw)
__________________

__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.
pb4uski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 08:06 AM   #3
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,318
I have this saying on my desk."The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it."
__________________
splitwdw is offline   Reply With Quote
TR Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 08:48 AM   #4
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Souschef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Santa Paula
Posts: 1,188
TR Quote

One of mmy favorites:
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.
__________________
Souschef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 09:18 AM   #5
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,982
The modern reference for "naysayers" is "haters". At least we use that term in the gym for those that mock our attempts to improve ourselves physically.
__________________
Doing things today that others won't, to do things tomorrow that others can't. Of course I'm referring to workouts, not robbing banks.
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 09:47 AM   #6
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 488
One of the top 5 biggest regrets older people having is doing what is "expected", not what they want to do.

I've always dreamed big, bucked the status quo, and I'm much happier for it.. the only time I wasn't happy was when I got lost and started living the "status quo". Good thing I got smacked out of that and FIRED.
__________________
karen1972 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 10:02 AM   #7
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,905
I can honestly say that when I went for my main education and financial goals in life, there was not one single person on the face of this earth who believed I could reach my goals except for ME. Not my parents, not my friends, not my family, not my spouse, not anybody. I expect that many of us here probably had that same experience.

You can't let others decide what you can and can't do. They will always say "nay", but it's not fair to yourself to let them make that decision and put limitations on your life. Be obstinate, go for your dreams with all the drive that you have in you, and win. Show them what you're made of.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 10:52 AM   #8
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Lsbcal's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: west coast, hi there!
Posts: 5,686
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R View Post
I can honestly say that when I went for my main education and financial goals in life, there was not one single person on the face of this earth who believed I could reach my goals except for ME. Not my parents, not my friends, not my family, not my spouse, not anybody. I expect that many of us here probably had that same experience.
....
I'm glad you (and others here) did accomplish what you wanted to do even without the emotional support of people close to you.

I don't think I had such a negative experience with my goal setting. Most people were supportive I think. I tend to get a kick out of being outside the pack and sometimes I feel more of an observer then anything else. So maybe I have fewer "opportunities" to hear naysayers. Sometimes people will express an alternate view which should be considered. If an alternate (perhaps negative) view sticks in one's mind then it should be taken into consideration just for the sake of completeness.
__________________
Lsbcal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 02:28 PM   #9
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,977
Great quotes and references guys, thanks. That's the spirit - exactly!
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 04:39 PM   #10
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 13,283
Well, I will be a naysayer......

Some of the way people do what they want is not any way I wish to live... When I was young, I met someone who was living a vagabond lifestyle... he was a ski instructor and waiter... he did not have a home... he usually lived in a dorm or hostel... most of his life was committed to the pursuit of skiing.... (I hate skiing, so really something I did not want to do)....

I also read about people who live cheaply who go dumpster diving... something that does not interest me at all....


I would love to see what happens to these people when they are in the 50s to 80s.... what kind of life are they living.....


So, sure, you can do things that people say you cannot.... but IMO, it is more of a lifestyle issue as opposed to nobody can do it issue....
__________________
Texas Proud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 04:56 PM   #11
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Major Tom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SF East Bay
Posts: 3,129
W2R - yours is a truly inspirational tale. It must have been tough enough to not have your family or friends on board, but to have a non-supportive spouse on top of all that must have been very challenging.

Good for you - you prevailed!
__________________
ER, for all intents and purposes. Part-time income <5% of annual expenditure.
Major Tom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 05:15 PM   #12
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,905
Quote:
Originally Posted by Major Tom View Post
W2R - yours is a truly inspirational tale. It must have been tough enough to not have your family or friends on board, but to have a non-supportive spouse on top of all that must have been very challenging.

Good for you - you prevailed!
Thank you! I wished it could have been different. I am glad that I didn't let it stop me.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 05:32 PM   #13
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Lsbcal's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: west coast, hi there!
Posts: 5,686
I'm getting the feeling on this thread that people are interpreting the OT in very different ways. This is not necessarily bad but I'd be interested to hear from Midpack on why he personally felt this book was important.

There was an episode in Mad Men which dealt with the Madison Avenue guys collision with the 1970's flower children. I remember Roger's daughter went off to a commune and he and his wife visited it to try to turn their daughter around -- it was fascinating, partly comic, and partly ugly. Actually a lot of that series dealt with lifestyle choices and naysayers.

In the end of Mad Men, Don Draper found himself at a California retreat, possibly the Esalen Institute in Big Sur? He found his next path there and it was an amusing end to the series.
__________________
Lsbcal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 05:35 PM   #14
Full time employment: Posting here.
CaliforniaMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: San Diego
Posts: 846
Well I am guessing those on this forum are the ones that took the risks and came out on top. There are plenty of people who ignored the "naysayers" who should not have ignored them, and have ended up at the bottom of the heap. They are probably not posting here. I have one good friend since college, he took risks, should have become wealthy, but he didn't. Now he tells me he will have to work until he dies. I agree much of the nay saying comes down to jealously, but some may be just prudence. You place your bets and spin the wheel.
__________________
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily,
Life is but a dream.
CaliforniaMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 05:58 PM   #15
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Midwest
Posts: 1,571
Dare to do stuff? Pish-posh. My answer to these people is always: "So what? Are you the First one? The only one? The best one? Seems like you're nothing special after all."

And then they get defensive and start with that "Oh yeah. well at least I *did something.*" stuff. Like someone said, it's a lifestyle issue.

Wanting to do something is not an achievement.
Having the opportunity to do it is not an achievement.
Deciding to do that thing instead of an infinite number of other things is not an achievement.
Having it work out well instead of disastrously is not an achievement.
Having it work out tragically instead of successfully might be due to you screwing up but it might not be. In any case you will likely be regarded a screw-up and unsuccessful, and derided with "should have kept you day job." and things of that nature.

No, people talking of their boldness and daring and achievements are just walking around with their hands out looking for something.
__________________
razztazz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 06:06 PM   #16
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
audreyh1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rio Grande Valley
Posts: 16,484
For some reason, where I grew up kids put each other down all the time, so I learned to ignore them early.
__________________
Well, I thought I was retired. But it seems that now I'm working as a travel agent instead!
audreyh1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 06:25 PM   #17
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Major Tom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SF East Bay
Posts: 3,129
Quote:
Originally Posted by razztazz View Post
Dare to do stuff? Pish-posh. My answer to these people is always: "So what? Are you the First one? The only one? The best one? Seems like you're nothing special after all."
Most of us are not doing anything truly unique, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't do it. Every time I do something that I haven't done before, it adds to my personal skillset, and gives me a sense of achievement.

I may be reading your comments in a way they weren't intended, but they come across to me as a strong discouragement for a person to try anything at all, unless it has not been achieved or tried by any other human being, living or dead.

Please tell me you're not the Debbie Downer I think you might be.
Attached Images
File Type: png debbie-downer.png (659.7 KB, 16 views)
__________________
ER, for all intents and purposes. Part-time income <5% of annual expenditure.
Major Tom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 06:52 PM   #18
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Ed_The_Gypsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: the City of Subdued Excitement
Posts: 5,293
Since I left work, DW seems to be rather negative with respect to new adventures such as long-term residences in interesting places. Bummer.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Early Retirement Forum mobile app
__________________
my bumpersticker:
"I am not in a hurry.
I am retired.
And I don't care how big your truck is."
Ed_The_Gypsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 06:57 PM   #19
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,977
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lsbcal View Post
I'm getting the feeling on this thread that people are interpreting the OT in very different ways. This is not necessarily bad but I'd be interested to hear from Midpack on why he personally felt this book was important.
While it is/was meaningful to me, my reasons aren't important - everyone is going to interpret it for themselves, including the naysayers...
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 08:59 PM   #20
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Western Canada
Posts: 393
WADR, why do other's opinions matter?
__________________

__________________
I'm not crazy. Honest, the judge had me tested.
Rick_Head is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:10 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.