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need advice from people who have done a lot of crazy things in life
Old 10-07-2019, 11:58 AM   #1
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need advice from people who have done a lot of crazy things in life

Asking for a friend! Names changed to protect the innocent and/or guilty.

So my best friend, I'll call her Kristi, has asked for advice and I don't know exactly what to tell her.

She's not a bad person overall, but she made a mistake she feels bad about.
So I'm not here to judge her even though yes what she did was wrong, she knows that, but now it's done so the question is how to proceed.

She was friends 20 yrs ago with another friend, let's call him Matt. They and I and many other friends lived overseas working the same job, 20 years ago, so it's been a while since we hung out a lot, yet we all have a close friendship that will last a lifetime - even if we are apart many years.

When we are 80 yrs old we will still be friends, if we are still alive - that's the kind of bond we have due to our unique experiences (too long to get into here - but was some intense things that happened living in third world countries). We are all now in our late 40's, early 50's.

Many of us have not kept in close touch other than contacting briefly online, or rare meetings, due to the fact we all live in different areas.

So fast forward to a few weeks ago. One of our lifetime overseas friends dies unexpectedly, in an accident, and we all travel from all directions, to attend the funeral. Matt is now married with 2 young kids. Kristi never married and is happy that way, as she is a free spirit with lots of platonic friends - she dates now and then but never wanted to get married.

Matt and Kristi were never an item, they were all just part of the group that hung out overseas - that went through a lot of things overseas that bonded us all together as friends.

Everyone was younger and broke back then and often shared one hotel room - platonicly - to save cash - with some people even sleeping on the floor. Also camped out a lot, and visited topless resorts (toplesness was very accepted as the norm in the countries we were in) together - as friends only.

They (Kristi, Matt, and many other people who knew the deceased) all got drunk after the funeral, and reminisced, laughing over good old times and sharing stories.

The deceased was the type who would be happy to know people were partying at her funeral - she would not have wanted everyone to be sad. So we partied in honor of her. Most of us rarely drink anymore, but that night after the funeral we did.

So around midnight Kristi and Matt and everyone else was totally drunk. Kristi and Matt happened to be staying in the same hotel. Matt, who as mentioned is married, asks Kristi for a massage to help his back which he had surgery on and gets sore. Kristi does, and the next thing is they are having sex. Matt 100% initiated the sex but Kristi totally agreed and wanted it. Once he asked, she said yes.

She said they were both very drunk and both very passionate about it.

If Matt had not asked, Kristi never would have, because Kristi normally thinks it is wrong to have sex with a married man. Matt normally would not have asked - they had already spent many nights together as friends only, no sex, when travelling overseas, almost as if they were brother/sister.

But, he was drunk and stressed due to the funeral, and not thinking straight. So in the heat of the moment, after Matt asked, Kristi decided to go for it.
Kristi never even though of Matt in that way before, and has been dating someone else back home, yet not married or very serious about him.

So Matt said several times to Kristi, both before and after the illicit "deed" was done, he wants to keep in touch better - since they rarely did the past 20 yrs. They live on opposite sides of the country. They have a huge shared history with the past events overseas, and plan on meeting with other past overseas coworkers at least once a year for a gathering with all the spouses.

The funeral made everyone realize life is short and we all want to keep in better touch.

So Kristi wants to know, is there anything she should be saying to Matt to reassure him? Because Matt is very worried and does not want his wife to find out.

Yes they were wrong... - we all know it was not supposed to happen.

However, no one is perfect, it was a one time thing, and they want to preserve the friendship.

The other thing is Kristi started feeling more attached to Matt after the "deed".. But to cure this feeling of emotion for Matt she did not want to have, Kristi went out and found another guy, and has been dating him, so she got over her feelings and now is back to seeing Matt as a friend only.

Matt's wife has no idea - she does not care if he is friends with other women so long as they don't sleep together. She would be devastated to know, so Matt is keeping it a secret. Only he, Kristi and I know, and I won't tell anyone.

So Matt and Kristi want to keep being friends, due to the shared unique history they had 20 yrs ago overseas.

Both are platonic friends with other members of the opposite sex, messaging each other every 2-3 weeks to say hello and catch up on any news. Matt's wife is fine with that and trusts him completely. She had stayed home with the young kids they have together, while he traveled to go to the funeral and meet with all his old friends. She has no idea he would cheat. He does want to stay with her, and he loves her, he admits he messed up due to being "drunk and in the mood" but sees no point in upsetting her by letting her know.

Is there anything Kristi should be saying to Matt or just ignore it like it never happened?
Matt seems to be worried and Kristi wants to help Matt not have a mental breakdown. Matt is stressed about the whole thing, feels guilty.

But he does not want to stop talking to Kristi and they WILL see each other again at get-togethers in the future, so they can't just stop speaking - nor do they want to. They still like each other as friends, as they did before the drunk hookup.

Basically they opened a can of worms they shouldn't have, and want to pretend it never happened.
Is there anything Kristi can do or say to help Matt not be so stressed about it? Matt is a good guy overall. He does a lot of good in his job and community to help others. He is about to have a breakdown because he never thought he'd cheat and he feels bad.

Kristi feels bad too, they both feel bad. But still want to remain friends. And if they ignore each other at the get-togethers with friends, it will look suspicious, so it's better that they act like they are friends - not just cut each other off.

Normally if it were any other guy, I'd tell her to cut it off and never talk to him again. But that's not really possible due to the fact they have friends in common, and a unique shared history.

Is there anything helpful Kristi can say or do, to help Matt not have a breakdown? He has problems with stress in general.

Again, we all know this was wrong, we all know it was.
We are trying to do damage control here, it was a huge mistake but no one is perfect...any advice is appreciated.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:03 PM   #2
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Well, I'm thinking that if her savings are somewhere in the region of 25 - 50 times her expected expenditure in retirement, she's good to go.

Oh, sorry, wrong thread

To be honest, if I were in your shoes, I'd stay well out of it and let them sort it out. However, I am not and, judging your lengthy post, it seems as if that's not your intended approach. I wish them luck. That's a tricky situation.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:07 PM   #3
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At this point it’s a very bad idea for them to keep in touch. Sounds like his wife needs to accompany him on any more get togethers with old friends. She doesn’t need to say anything to him. He should feel guilty.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:08 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by workburnout View Post
...any advice is appreciated.

Sobriety might be a good starting place.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:10 PM   #5
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I had the feeling after counting the times mentioned that things are just platonic that something hanky panky is bound to happen. Just sayin' .
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:11 PM   #6
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the next thing is they are having sex. Matt 100% initiated the sex but Kristi totally agreed and wanted it. Once he asked, she said yes.
Not much of a surprise, given the buildup to this narrative.

Quote:
She said they were both very drunk and both very passionate about it.
"Very drunk" is very often the excuse used.

Quote:
because Kristi normally thinks it is wrong to have sex with a married man.
Apparently, not all that wrong though.

Quote:
But, he was drunk and stressed due to the funeral, and not thinking straight.
LOL! Sure.

Quote:
So Matt said several times to Kristi, both before and after the illicit "deed" was done, he wants to keep in touch better
That makes sense for a married man.

Quote:
So Kristi wants to know, is there anything she should be saying to Matt to reassure him? Because Matt is very worried and does not want his wife to find out.

Yes they were wrong... - we all know it was not supposed to happen.

However, no one is perfect, it was a one time thing, and they want to preserve the friendship.
There you go - no one is perfect! That makes everything good.

Let's keep in touch. And drink a lot. And if you are stressed, well, we know what worked last time.

Quote:
Matt's wife has no idea - she does not care if he is friends with other women so long as they don't sleep together. She would be devastated to know, so Matt is keeping it a secret. Only he, Kristi and I know, and I won't tell anyone.
Matt's wide has no idea that Matt is scum.

Quote:
Both are platonic friends with other members of the opposite sex
That's their story, and they are sticking to it.

Quote:
Is there anything Kristi should be saying to Matt or just ignore it like it never happened?
Kristi should say "goodbye" and then never meet Matt again. Neither can be trusted, apparently.

Quote:
Again, we all know this was wrong, we all know it was.
We are trying to do damage control here, it was a huge mistake but no one is perfect...any advice is appreciated.
You all know exactly what you should do. But apparently nobody actually wants to do it and you have all concocted great excuses - nobody is perfect, stress, drunk, want to be friends, yada, yada.

Pathetic.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:14 PM   #7
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The other question Kristi has is, should she keep contacting him now and then as they had been communicating (along with 10 other close friends) every few weeks or months before the incident, off and on the past 20 yrs. Typically, they would message each other to say hey how's it going - this was not a secret, wife has access to all his messages. It was totally platonic communication. If they now totally stop communicating, that will not be the norm, and might even raise suspicion. Kristi has met his wife in the past (briefly) and kids, just in a typical social setting, but they aren't close friends. But they get along. There was never any sexual tension between Kristi and Matt, it just was not that kind of relationship.
Yes I agree he should cut out alcohol. She rarely drinks, but she should be more careful as well. I blame both of them, even though he was the initiator, it takes two. But they both feel bad and want to know what to do, what's done is done.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:19 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Major Tom View Post
Well, I'm thinking that if her savings are somewhere in the region of 25 - 50 times her expected expenditure in retirement, she's good to go.

Oh, sorry, wrong thread

To be honest, if I were in your shoes, I'd stay well out of it and let them sort it out. However, I am not and, judging your lengthy post, it seems as if that's not your intended approach. I wish them luck. That's a tricky situation.
LOL - asking for a friend, not myself! But I get your drift MajorTom.

Money has nothing to do with it, all parties are doing well off financially.I figured this forum would have a lot of experienced people so maybe could get some pointers on the situation.

Yes, I think maybe it is best to stay out of it. In fact I am sure it is. However, they will see each other at future get togethers, due to mutual friends. So, may be best for Kristi to be cordial at those events, but just act like nothing ever happened.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:20 PM   #9
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I only made the money comment to be silly, but I think you knew that. It was my daft idea of a joke.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:20 PM   #10
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Post-Deed, Kristi has made additional errors:

1 - She told someone. You - at least, likely more. She needs to stop that immediately. Oh I know she swore you're the only one she told....pfft

2 - She thinks they can go back to being friends right away - nope, she needs to back away and they need to let things cool off for a while, a few months even.

Part 2 should be easy, a married man with two young kids doesn't have much time for single female friends, so they should only run into each other occasionally. No need to text and lol on every facebook post. If she protests on this point then there's more she's not telling you.

Oh, and I don't know anyone over 25, let alone 45, who doesn't know the real meaning of "can you give me a massage, my back hurts?" They both knew exactly what was coming next. It would be naive to entertain either of them further on this point.

No of course she can't "help Matt" with this. Neither can you. You can tell them both to grow up and move on and stop with the self pity, and the more they indulge in that nonsense, the greater the likelyhood his wife finds out, and his kids get to visit him only every other weekend.

And yeah, you should back away from this as well. If you are in this same close circle of friends, you are at least on friendly terms with the wife and know his kids too. No, you shouldn't tell her, but you should let Matt and Kristi know it's selfish of them to try to involve you in this.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:24 PM   #11
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At this point itís a very bad idea for them to keep in touch. Sounds like his wife needs to accompany him on any more get togethers with old friends. She doesnít need to say anything to him. He should feel guilty.
Yes she does need to accompany him. I was surprised she did not object to him going to the funeral alone because 20 years ago, wife is well aware, he actually used to date the deceased (this was long before he was married). She knew he was going to get together with a bunch of old friends, many who she met at past events near their house.

Neither Kristi or Matt is going to stop talking to the group of friends again - they will see each other again. They all go way back as friends - and none would ever think Kristi or Matt would hookup - it just is not in the realm of thinking that would happen. Both always were with other people - not interested in each other other than friends within the larger group of friends.

That being said, maybe Kristi cutting off all contact other than when she unavoidably sees him at the group get togethers is best.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:25 PM   #12
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It is well known that inebriation throws discipline to the wind, and it did so in this case... stuff happens.

I think the three of you should keep it secret... there is nothing good for any of you that will come out of letting cat out of the bag at this point... they should also keep their distance for 6 months to a year... after that amount of time it will be water under the dam and they should be able to go back to the way things were (sort of anyway).
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:32 PM   #13
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Post-Deed, Kristi has made additional errors:

1 - She told someone. You - at least, likely more. She needs to stop that immediately. Oh I know she swore you're the only one she told....pfft

2 - She thinks they can go back to being friends right away - nope, she needs to back away and they need to let things cool off for a while, a few months even.

Part 2 should be easy, a married man with two young kids doesn't have much time for single female friends, so they should only run into each other occasionally. No need to text and lol on every facebook post. If she protests on this point then there's more she's not telling you.

Oh, and I don't know anyone over 25, let alone 45, who doesn't know the real meaning of "can you give me a massage, my back hurts?" They both knew exactly what was coming next. It would be naive to entertain either of them further on this point.

No of course she can't "help Matt" with this. Neither can you. You can tell them both to grow up and move on and stop with the self pity, and the more they indulge in that nonsense, the greater the likelyhood his wife finds out, and his kids get to visit him only every other weekend.

And yeah, you should back away from this as well. If you are in this same close circle of friends, you are at least on friendly terms with the wife and know his kids too. No, you shouldn't tell her, but you should let Matt and Kristi know it's selfish of them to try to involve you in this.
Yes she knew what it meant with the massage. She admits it, she blames the fact she was very drunk but she knew what she was doing. They both did. You are right. Kristi and he agreed not to tell anyone and he knows she will tell me but I won't tell.

She has totally gotten off Facebook due to this - at least for now. She did not delete her account but she never goes on there.
She did tell him she's getting off for a while and they have not texted or been in contact in a few days. Maybe I should tell her wait a few weeks, or months, before contacting him again to say hi as she always has now and then - throughout the past 20 yrs, along with all the other friends (male and female) in that particular group of friends.
To tell her never contact him ever again seems extreme, since they were good friends before, but I agree waiting a long time is best.

Yes I know the wife and kids though we are not close. But we all have hung out together in large groups of get-togethers with old friends. On the surface he is very attentive to his kids and family - and tries to be a good dad. He does love his family. At least he loves his kids. He acts like he loves his wife but what is going on there I can't be sure - I never ask as it's not my business and I really don't care.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:37 PM   #14
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It is well known that inebriation throws discipline to the wind, and it did so in this case... stuff happens.

I think the three of you should keep it secret... there is nothing good for any of you that will come out of letting cat out of the bag at this point... they should also keep their distance for 6 months to a year... after that amount of time it will be water under the dam and they should be able to go back to the way things were (sort of anyway).
Well they knew what they were doing, alcohol or not, but either way the result is the same - it happened.

So that was a huge question - would waiting a week to contact be long enough - and my thought was no.

Personally, I have 3 friends on FB I slept with 20-25 yrs ago, in my crazier youthful days and we chat now and then on FB but there is 0 between us - it is not an issue. Now, none of us cheated - none were married at the time, so maybe it's different. None of us are in close contact now, but we don't totally ignore each other just because of what happened 25 yrs ago. It was so long ago. We never hang out though, we aren't even in the same circle of friends anymore other than on FB.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:39 PM   #15
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I only made the money comment to be silly, but I think you knew that. It was my daft idea of a joke.
I get it. It was funny and made me laugh. Not always conveyed over a computer.

It cracked me up laughing actually.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:40 PM   #16
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"The Big Chill"?
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:47 PM   #17
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Not much of a surprise, given the buildup to this narrative.


"Very drunk" is very often the excuse used.


Apparently, not all that wrong though.


LOL! Sure.


That makes sense for a married man.


There you go - no one is perfect! That makes everything good.

Let's keep in touch. And drink a lot. And if you are stressed, well, we know what worked last time.

Matt's wide has no idea that Matt is scum.


That's their story, and they are sticking to it.


Kristi should say "goodbye" and then never meet Matt again. Neither can be trusted, apparently.


You all know exactly what you should do. But apparently nobody actually wants to do it and you have all concocted great excuses - nobody is perfect, stress, drunk, want to be friends, yada, yada.

Pathetic.
Matt is a whore dog and she's a homewrecker. They deserve each other. And now you want to play Dr. Phil with those two sleaze bags? Just keep rationalizing their abhorrent behavior. When it all likely unfolds in plain sight, you'll be just fine.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:53 PM   #18
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"The Big Chill"?
Yes - But doesn't the analogy break down if nobody winds up pregnant after the get together?
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:59 PM   #19
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Totally a bad idea to get involved in other people’s affairs.
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Old 10-07-2019, 01:03 PM   #20
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Matt is a whore dog and she's a homewrecker. They deserve each other. And now you want to play Dr. Phil with those two sleaze bags? Just keep rationalizing their abhorrent behavior. When it all likely unfolds in plain sight, you'll be just fine.
It will be interesting if anything becomes of it, I mean if he leaves his wife or not. I do not see her ever getting married to him and she already has plans to go on a blind date with another guy a friend wanted her to meet.

But you never know, I guess anything could happen.
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