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Old 01-14-2015, 05:32 PM   #1021
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Seattle is without a doubt the best team right now, but the best team doesn't always win. NFL teams are very evenly matched and a lot of games come down to one silly turnover or momentum caused by any number of things that cant be predicted ahead of time. Does anyone really think the Giants were the best team in the league when they won the Super Bowl a few years ago?

So to say that its hard to see a scenario where in which GB wins is a bit of a stretch. GB is a damned good team. If Rodgers' can loosen his leg up and be able to move to avoid Seattle's pass rush, GB could easily win. If Wilson sprains an ankle, GB can easily win. If Seattle turns the ball over more then GB, GB can easily win.

St.Louis finished 6-10 but they beat BOTH of last year's Super Bowl teams (Denver and Seattle) while playing with a backup QB. Strange things happen in football.

Now if they both play their absolute best football, Seattle will win but that rarely happens.
Another unpredictable but fun thing about the game of football is that the ball is shaped funny. So it often bounces in an unpredictable way. And just one odd bounce and the resulting play can sometimes be the difference between a win and a loss--particularly in a close game.

Go Hawks!
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Old 01-14-2015, 05:34 PM   #1022
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I'll go with GB and the Colts, with the Packers winning the SB. Totally emotional picks. But as Utrecht says, strange things.
+1. This is what i'm hoping for. I really want the Packers to win but i'll be content with any game other than NE vs Seattle in the SB.
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Old 01-14-2015, 06:07 PM   #1023
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+1. This is what i'm hoping for. I really want the Packers to win but i'll be content with any game other than NE vs Seattle in the SB.
I agree, last week Belichick and Brady showed their class and sportmanship with those legal plays. The sooner they get beat the better. Tom will have time to read something about karma! Anybody but NE, GB being my favorite to take the Lombardi Trophy!

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Old 01-14-2015, 06:34 PM   #1024
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Even a hobbled Rodgers has me sufficiently nervous.
If Rodgers is still hobbled (and I'd be shocked if he isn't), maybe GB will focus on ball control, running with Lacy and Starks, and then pick their moments with the passing game. I think GB kinda did that at times against Dallas until the 4th Qtr where it was "suck it up" time and Rodgers hobbled and passed with success
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Old 01-14-2015, 08:04 PM   #1025
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I agree, last week Belichick and Brady showed their class and sportmanship with those legal plays. The sooner they get beat the better. Tom will have time to read something about karma! Anybody but NE, GB being my favorite to take the Lombardi Trophy!

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It seems to me that John Harbaugh was the one whining about plays that the league confirmed were perfectly legal. He just got out coached by BB....

And hopefully Tom will be preparing for his 6th trip to the SB.
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Old 01-14-2015, 10:54 PM   #1026
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It seems to me that John Harbaugh was the one whining about plays that the league confirmed were perfectly legal. He just got out coached by BB....

And hopefully Tom will be preparing for his 6th trip to the SB.
I agree, I couldn't possibly understand what was shady about those plays. Gadget/trick plays, flea flickers, whatever gets the win. I only get mad when I see late/dirty hits. These guys get damaged enough from the legal stuff. Signed, crying Broncos fan.
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Old 01-14-2015, 11:06 PM   #1027
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Harbaugh's complaint wasn't with the Patriots, it was with the officiating. The rules are complicated and not worth describing but it has to do with covered and uncovered lineman and uniform numbers. The defense has the right to substitution based on the offense. Officials were declaring the changes to defense but in Harbaughs estimation not given them time to adjust the personal for it.


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Old 01-14-2015, 11:28 PM   #1028
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Harbaugh's complaint wasn't with the Patriots, it was with the officiating. The rules are complicated and not worth describing but it has to do with covered and uncovered lineman and uniform numbers. The defense has the right to substitution based on the offense. Officials were declaring the changes to defense but in Harbaughs estimation not given them time to adjust the personal for it.


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Good info, I was referring to MRGs complaint of Tom and Bill B. being unsportsmanlike, I just didn't see what they did wrong. Just seemed like crafty play.
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Old 01-15-2015, 06:22 AM   #1029
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Good info, I was referring to MRGs complaint of Tom and Bill B. being unsportsmanlike, I just didn't see what they did wrong. Just seemed like crafty play.
Mulligan you are correct, the rule is complex and JH didn't think the refs were giving them the time to react.

laurence I never said unsportsmanlike. I said sportmanship. I also said they were legal plays.

I was just giving my reasons why an AFC fan is choosing anybody but NE. It's just an opinion, didn't know I'd have to justify it.

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Old 01-15-2015, 06:49 AM   #1030
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Mulligan you are correct, the rule is complex and JH didn't think the refs were giving them the time to react.
According the rules, they don't have to. Belichick is legendary for this sort of thing, finding any legal (some would also say illegal as well) loophole or unintended consequence of the rules to gain an advantage. (He certainly is within the rules to do this, but I do think it's one of the reasons why almost everyone who isn't a Pats fan despises them.)

In this case I don't think it's "sporting" to quietly make these reporting of normally ineligibles being eligible, and vice versa, without giving the defense time to make adjustments or substitutions in response. That said, it *is* legal and if the league has a problem with that, the Competition Committee would have to look at changing the dynamics of this sort of thing. (For example, when an offense does this, the official can delay marking the ball ready for play for [say] 5-10 seconds to allow defenses to react and adjust. But right now the rules do not require it.)

But absent that, it was all legal. It's a classic example of Belichick pushing the envelope, testing the boundaries of what is legal, and not caring about sportsmanship -- but he is paid to win, not to make friends.

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Good info, I was referring to MRGs complaint of Tom and Bill B. being unsportsmanlike, I just didn't see what they did wrong. Just seemed like crafty play.
To me, Brady's post-game comments and dig about "they need to study the rulebook" was unnecessary, and IMO he should have kept the moral high ground by refusing to comment if that was the only rejoinder he could come up with at the time.
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Old 01-15-2015, 07:26 AM   #1031
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Harbaugh's complaint wasn't with the Patriots, it was with the officiating. The rules are complicated and not worth describing but it has to do with covered and uncovered lineman and uniform numbers. The defense has the right to substitution based on the offense. Officials were declaring the changes to defense but in Harbaughs estimation not given them time to adjust the personal for it.


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His whining was directed against the Patriots by calling it a "deception" and was saying that Brady was rushing to the line to snap the ball as a form of that deception. Brady's comment at the press conference about studying the rule book was in response to Harbaugh's comment.

The Ineligible/eligible plays were called three times and from the time the ref. announced it until the ball was snapped there were 7, 10 and 9 seconds. Harbaugh should have been ready and when wasn't he should have called a timeout to align his defense appropriately.
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Old 01-15-2015, 08:04 AM   #1032
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You can make all the excuses for N.E. that you want to, but as Ziggy said, just about everyone who isn't a Pats fan, despises them. There's a reason for it.

Belichick stretches every rules as far as possible and doesn't care if other people find his tactics deceptive or not. He doesn't care about the spirit of the game. He has even been caught blatantly cheating at least once. Brady is (was) a great QB but he's the biggest baby in the NFL. He cries any time anyone touches him and he constantly gets roughing the passer calls that other QB's don't get.
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Old 01-15-2015, 08:13 AM   #1033
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You can make all the excuses for N.E. that you want to, but as Ziggy said, just about everyone who isn't a Pats fan, despises them. There's a reason for it.

Belichick stretches every rules as far as possible and doesn't care if other people find his tactics deceptive or not. He doesn't care about the spirit of the game. He has even been caught blatantly cheating at least once. Brady is (was) a great QB but he's the biggest baby in the NFL. He cries any time anyone touches him and he constantly gets roughing the passer calls that other QB's don't get.
The name of the game is to win within the rules that's what he gets paid to do. Brady and Belichick are the most successful Coach/QB in the last 15 years. There are no other coach or QB I would rather have.

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Old 01-15-2015, 08:24 AM   #1034
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His whining was directed against the Patriots by calling it a "deception" and was saying that Brady was rushing to the line to snap the ball as a form of that deception. Brady's comment at the press conference about studying the rule book was in response to Harbaugh's comment.

The Ineligible/eligible plays were called three times and from the time the ref. announced it until the ball was snapped there were 7, 10 and 9 seconds. Harbaugh should have been ready and when wasn't he should have called a timeout to align his defense appropriately.

That part may be true and I certainly do not have favorites with either team. I didn't fully explain myself earlier. I was referring to the following day he clarified himself about "his beef" with the situation. As his first initial rants were along the lines you suggested. Maybe he slept on it and decided his first comments made him sound like he didn't know the rules and was implying "cheating to win".


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Old 01-15-2015, 08:35 AM   #1035
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The name of the game is to win within the rules that what he gets paid to do. Brady and Belichick are the most successful Coach/QB in the last 15 years. There are no other coach or QB I would rather have.

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That's fine. We are just explaining why everyone else hates the Pats.
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Old 01-15-2015, 09:54 AM   #1036
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I've been a Patriot fan since first following pro football and long before I spent a few years in Boston. Steve Grogan was the QB and he and those teams were fun to watch (at least I thought so). I think Chuck Fairbanks was the coach when I got to MA.

Still a fan and wish them good luck in their remaining game(s).
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Old 01-15-2015, 10:50 AM   #1037
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The name of the game is to win within the rules that's what he gets paid to do. Brady and Belichick are the most successful Coach/QB in the last 15 years. There are no other coach or QB I would rather have.

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I don't have a problem with what he did in that last game. It was legal it was announced and the Ravens didn't react to it. Now it will be interesting to see what the Colts do when/if they come out with a similar formation. But I don't see how it's different from the Fumblerusky or any other "trick" plays that get run from time to time

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That's fine. We are just explaining why everyone else hates the Pats.
That's not why I hate the Pats...I pretty much dislike any team out of the Boston area. It comes from my intense dislike for the Bruins . I was ok with the Red Sox when they were perpetual losers but not so much any more
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Old 01-15-2015, 10:56 AM   #1038
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That's fine. We are just explaining why everyone else hates the Pats.
And my point is as long as their fan base and their employers are happy with their results they are doing their job. They don't care whether you like them or not.

BTW they are the second most valued team in the NFL according to Forbes so apparently someone values their accomplishments.

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Old 01-15-2015, 11:21 AM   #1039
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To the larger point of video-cam gate and other alleged abuses, yes, definitely scummy. I think that history is coloring the reaction to this latest "controversy". I've seen every team rush up to the line to snap the ball while the defense has 12 men on the field to get the penalty. No one complains about "not having time to react" there. Just because the Pats were the first to think of a new gimmick doesn't condemn them. "Belly-Check" certainly is unlikable, no doubt (unless you are a Pats fan).
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Old 01-15-2015, 11:54 AM   #1040
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To the larger point of video-cam gate and other alleged abuses, yes, definitely scummy. I think that history is coloring the reaction to this latest "controversy". I've seen every team rush up to the line to snap the ball while the defense has 12 men on the field to get the penalty. No one complains about "not having time to react" there. Just because the Pats were the first to think of a new gimmick doesn't condemn them. "Belly-Check" certainly is unlikable, no doubt (unless you are a Pats fan).
He does not have a likeable personality for sure and I can see why the non Pats fans don't like him but the objective person has to admit that he is a no nonsense guy that gets the most out of his players. His football IQ is second to none and his results speak for themselves. I'll bet that most of these haters, though they won't admit it, would love to have him coach their team.
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