Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
OTWQOTD: Roll Tubing to a point?
Old 11-12-2013, 08:45 AM   #1
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,971
OTWQOTD: Roll Tubing to a point?

If I wanted to roll one end of some stock small diameter tubing to a point, could I do it without costly specialized equipment? From what I've found with online search, it appears it requires costly equipment.

I'm talking thin wall tubing aluminum, brass or copper 1/8" to 1/2" in diameter, and for lack of a better description the end product would look much like a hollow knitting needle. I'm attempting to make my own splicing fids for anyone who's familiar.

Not seeking to find someone here to do it for me, but this is a resourceful group, so I thought I'd ask.

Off the Wall Question of the Day if you're wondering...
__________________

__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 11-12-2013, 08:54 AM   #2
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Little Trailer Down By The River
Posts: 172
Not sure how to do that in aluminum tube with home type equipment. If you have a friend who spins metal that might do it. As I suspect you know doing what you want to do is called roll forming. May I suggest turning the fids in hardwood on a normal woodturning lathe. Lots of turners around "Chicagoland". If you need a bunch, contact the "Chicago Woodturners" on the web and they will put you in touch with professionals. I don't want to go into business but can make one for you to see if you like. Let me know.
__________________

__________________
"Here's to them who would read,
Here's to them that would write.
There's none ever feared that the Truth would be heard,
But those whom the Truth would indict."

Robert Burns
poorcarver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:10 AM   #3
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,971
Quote:
Originally Posted by poorcarver View Post
Not sure how to do that in aluminum tube with home type equipment. If you have a friend who spins metal that might do it. As I suspect you know doing what you want to do is called roll forming. May I suggest turning the fids in hardwood on a normal woodturning lathe. Lots of turners around "Chicagoland". If you need a bunch, contact the "Chicago Woodturners" on the web and they will put you in touch with professionals. I don't want to go into business but can make one for you to see if you like. Let me know.
I have a good woodworking lathe, but they need to be hollow with thin walls. I probably have the terms wrong, but you're describing a fid or marlinspike, and I need a splicing fid like (see below).

I can buy a splicing fid kit for $70-80, but the material costs are probably less than $5. If I have to buy them I will, just like to be resourceful when I can.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 890021.jpg (14.5 KB, 130 views)
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:14 AM   #4
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 18,278
Had to look it up to see what they were. You might get more replies with some pictures. (edit, I see you have some now)

If I were to try to make one, I wouldn't roll the end at all. That looks far too difficult w/o the proper tools. I'd try a couple things:

1) Simply cut the end at a shallow angle, then file and sand the edges smooth. It looks like all you need is to have it be able to pierce the rope, I think it could be hollow and do that as well?

2) If it does need to be a solid point, do #1, then fill that point with epoxy, let that harden, then file and sand it smooth.

3) Cut the end at 90 degrees, insert a wood dowel, and form that to a point. Dowels can be formed to a point in a pencil sharpener, and brass/alum tube is easily filed. Maybe fill the joint between the wood dowel point and the tubing with epoxy, file and sand for a smooth transition.

They didn't look that expensive on-line, not sure this is worth the effort?

-ERD50
__________________
ERD50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:16 AM   #5
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Little Trailer Down By The River
Posts: 172
Got it, I was thinking regular fid. I suppose one could turn a wooden point with the proper hole in it and glue it to a piece of the metal stock but seems a big PIA. I watched Cyndy Drozia (not spelt correctly) turn far smaller finials but that was her not me.

If your lathe is on the heavy duty side, I would suppose you could roll the stock like folks who do metal spinning.

Otherwise out of ideas.
__________________
"Here's to them who would read,
Here's to them that would write.
There's none ever feared that the Truth would be heard,
But those whom the Truth would indict."

Robert Burns
poorcarver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:23 AM   #6
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 18,278
Check this video -



in the first 2 minutes, he shows a tube just cut at an angle, and he makes one like that of pvc for larger rope.

And looking how this guy uses them, I don't see why a hollow tube cut at an angle would not work?



-ERD50
__________________
ERD50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:25 AM   #7
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,880
If I understand how it functions correctly, I'd make the point separately, then attach it with solder or epoxy. You can solder aluminum with these rods: Aluminum Welding Rods - Pack of 8 Low Temperature Rods
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:32 AM   #8
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,971
Just adding a full tip to a hollow tube would probably be a better solution than me attempting roll forming. I'll have to think about that. Thanks...
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 09:46 AM   #9
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: seattle
Posts: 643
I'm looking at a couple of mechanical pencils on my desk. One uses 0.9mm lead, the other 0.7mm. in the discard jar are some old 0.5mm versions I can't seem to use without breaking leads.

The metal sleeve that the lead emerges from could be soldered or glued into the end of a small diameter brass tube if you are skilled at soldering.
__________________
bld999 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 10:07 AM   #10
Full time employment: Posting here.
bjorn2bwild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Western US
Posts: 690
Tapering metal tubing would not be practical without specialized equipment.
Even then it is a difficult operation.
Think fork blade in a set of bicycle frame tubes. When drawning the tube to a smaller diameter the wall thickness increases. There are many steps and specialized dies involved with manipulating the tubing to end up with a consistent wall thickness.
__________________
How's it going to end..............
bjorn2bwild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 11:18 AM   #11
Recycles dryer sheets
Avalon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by Midpack View Post
If I wanted to roll one end of some stock small diameter tubing to a point, could I do it without costly specialized equipment? From what I've found with online search, it appears it requires costly equipment.
Do you have a chuck for your wood lathe? Meaning something like a 3 (or 4) jaw chuck on a conventional metal cutting lathe.
__________________

...open up your mind and see like me...
Avalon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 11:37 AM   #12
Full time employment: Posting here.
bjorn2bwild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Western US
Posts: 690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Midpack View Post
Just adding a full tip to a hollow tube would probably be a better solution than me attempting roll forming. I'll have to think about that. Thanks...
Yes, if the tip can be a tapered solid, then the easy solution is to machine a tip from solid stock to fit the inside diameter of the tubing.
__________________
How's it going to end..............
bjorn2bwild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 01:24 PM   #13
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,971
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjorn2bwild View Post
Yes, if the tip can be a tapered solid, then the easy solution is to machine a tip from solid stock to fit the inside diameter of the tubing.
Thanks. I am sure you're right. And I've abandoned rolling a tip based on your earlier post. I was guessing it wouldn't be practically possible for an amateur (me) with no real tools, but I needed someone with experience to confirm.
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 01:35 PM   #14
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
imoldernu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Peru
Posts: 4,616
Like... a drop of gorilla glue, force a dowel, clip and sand?
__________________
Today is the oldest you've ever been, and the youngest you'll ever be again. - Eleanor Roosevelt
imoldernu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 02:11 PM   #15
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,971
Quote:
Originally Posted by imoldernu View Post
Like... a drop of gorilla glue, force a dowel, clip and sand?
Might work though I'm a little leery of using a wood tip. The fid MUST be perfectly smooth to work in this application. Anything but the tiniest rough spot or "splinter" could result in snagging individual filaments, making the fid unusable for splicing. I'm going to experiment with what I've learned thus far...
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 02:26 PM   #16
Full time employment: Posting here.
bjorn2bwild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Western US
Posts: 690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Midpack View Post
Thanks. I am sure you're right. And I've abandoned rolling a tip based on your earlier post. I was guessing it wouldn't be practically possible for an amateur (me) with no real tools, but I needed someone with experience to confirm.
Machining a smooth, tapered tip from solid stock the same OD and with a shoulder to fit the ID of the target tubing would be routine if you have access to a metal turning lathe.
On a wood turning lathe equipped with a 3-jaw chuck it could be managed with a file and some patience.
__________________
How's it going to end..............
bjorn2bwild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 02:33 PM   #17
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjorn2bwild View Post
Machining a smooth, tapered tip from solid stock the same OD and with a shoulder to fit the ID of the target tubing would be routine if you have access to a metal turning lathe.
On a wood turning lathe equipped with a 3-jaw chuck it could be managed with a file and some patience.
Seems like a good excuse to get a metal lathe. Don't forget to use your 25% off coupon.

Mini Lathe - 7" x 10" Precision Mini Lathe
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 02:59 PM   #18
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
pb4uski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Vermont & Sarasota, FL
Posts: 16,424
Quote:
Originally Posted by Midpack View Post
Just adding a full tip to a hollow tube would probably be a better solution than me attempting roll forming. I'll have to think about that. Thanks...
Could you improvise one from a knitting needle of the appropriate size?
__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.
pb4uski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 03:11 PM   #19
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,971
Quote:
Originally Posted by pb4uski View Post
Could you improvise one from a knitting needle of the appropriate size?
That's one of the options I'm considering since DW has dozens. I tried to use one of her old knitting needles with tape for rope splicing this weekend. It worked but it really doesn't provide the results I was looking for. I've already located hollow straight tubing in various metals and diameters.
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 03:27 PM   #20
Full time employment: Posting here.
bjorn2bwild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Western US
Posts: 690
In the interest of carity (pedantics), bringing straight walled tubing to a closed or rounded end is called doming and is a simpler and easier process than tapering. A clever machinist could craft a mandrel and spinning tools to accomplish this task.
__________________

__________________
How's it going to end..............
bjorn2bwild is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:08 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.