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Old 05-06-2014, 11:48 PM   #41
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I worked patrol in the early 80's when mobile data terminals were just being introduced (I never had one). We could check people for wants or warrants either via telephone or radio, but that took time and we only did that if the person was a suspect but not going to jail (we always checked prisoners using fingerprints and computers per policy as part of the booking process). But my personal policy was to check everyone whose name made it's way onto the pages of my notebook. I usually did that at the end of the shift using a terminal at the substation. If I was training a probationary that was his/her chore each night.

If the contact with someone was as a suspect, I always got their DL or ID. Often suspects didn't have ID on them, and in those cases I would use my own judgement on letting them give me their information, or loading them up and taking them downtown to check their prints.

If the person was a non-suspect, but they were going to be mentioned in an investigation as a complainant or witness, I usually asked for their DL or ID because it was required in our offense report format.

In situations like in the OP's case, in which no report is going to be filed because no crime occurred, I would still record his name in my notebook because I was dispatched to the residence on official business. Every good cop is going to make a note of the details of when he got the call, where he went, who he talked to, and what he did. And like I said before, if your name went in my notebook, you got checked sooner or later.

I think the deputy was telling it like it was when he said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by davemartin88 View Post
...it would be easier to run my information through several databases that exist to make sure I wasn't wanted or otherwise needed for questioning by using the license. They could do it without it but just a bit more work for them.
It's nothing personal, it's just routine record keeping and due diligence. It's part of what the police get paid to do, and what people expect them to do. Just remember, if you call the cops you have invited the scrutiny of a nosy person with a lot of authority to take an official interest in you.
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Old 05-07-2014, 07:34 AM   #42
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Prior to being allowed to vote yesterday and was asked for my DL. No big deal.
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Old 05-07-2014, 10:59 AM   #43
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Was that so they could run you through the criminal database, lol?
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Old 05-07-2014, 12:25 PM   #44
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I guess I don't mind having to identify myself -- in just about any situation.

It would even be OK with me if gas pumps had systems that checked to see if your car is insured before allowing you to fill the tank.
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Old 05-07-2014, 12:52 PM   #45
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9 years ago, one night while I was sleeping, my window glass shattered with a loud noise. I thought someone shut a bullet at my house. I called 911. Two cops came to investigate and saw no holes in my screen outside the window glass. They decided it was probably a passing vehicle that hit a small rock bouncing off my window without penetrating.

They asked for my DL and wrote a detail report to me. I can see all my personal data on my copy. I did not hesitate showing them my DL.
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Old 06-09-2014, 01:35 AM   #46
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I am retired LE in a bigger city. It is easier just to get the info off of the DL. However, I wouldn't pressure someone to go get his license. It is a noise complaint, not a homicide. On minor calls with no further investigation, there won't even be a police report (depending on jurisdiction). In that case I would be surprised if they ran your name (but some places have nothing better to do). If the case warranted a police report, I could see why they would want to verify your ID. But, you are the complaintant. You are under no obligation to provide ID.

But as with most things, it is the approach that counts.

By the way, around here, firing off rounds are a big thing. Those bullets have to land somewhere. I've see strays land in kids heads. I would want to know who is firing off those rounds, where they are firing off those rounds and why. Shots fired are not just a routine noise complaint.
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Old 06-09-2014, 11:32 AM   #47
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In the circumstances described by the OP I would not give my drivers license to an officer. The complainant is under no obligation to supply an ID. I am concerned that we are surrendering our Constitutional freedoms much too easily.
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Old 06-09-2014, 01:37 PM   #48
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The complainant is under no obligation to supply an ID. I am concerned that we are surrendering our Constitutional freedoms much too easily.
Yes, now you're guilty of "obstruction" or "refusing to obey".... And don't "reach for your waistband" to hitch up your pants unless you want to get shot.
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Old 06-10-2014, 06:50 AM   #49
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When I asked what would happen if I didn't supply my ID, the deputy said they would run my information anyway the harder way and as part of their report, I would be noted as "uncooperative" so other deputies would be aware of this in the future. I responded that this sounded like a threat and he explained, "no, it's a promise". At that point, I went inside, got my DL and asked them to take the information and to please leave. Another cruiser showed up while I was inside. As they were leaving, I told the deputy that I was sorry for the way this had gone and that I hadn't intended to get them mad, his reply was, "but you did, didn't you". I went inside at that point.

During the earlier discussion, it was also explained to me that when I had made my call to them in the first place, I had "invited" them to come on to my property. Since they were there, they were obligated to check me out as well as I would be surprised how many times they had done this and found out that the person calling had outstanding warrants. He further mentioned that people would rightfully be complaining if they hadn't checked me out and I later turned out to be a serious criminal that ended up not being caught when they had the chance. I told them I didn't think it made sense that I was being investigated just because I had called their office but they were obviously seeing this situation differently.

I talked about this event with some long timers in the area and they thought it was out of character for the officer/department involved so will leave it at that. I was a bit surprised when they even showed up and said as much when they pulled in. This may have bothered them and when I wasn't immediately forthcoming with all the information they were asking for about me rather than what I had called about, I had become the issue.

This deputy had what looked to be another, younger officer with him so maybe it was a training event for them to deal with "uncooperative" citizens. In the future, I won't bother to to call them again for anything short of a serious event. My original call had been to ask if the department was aware of any new, commercial ranges that had opened in my area, didn't realize the call had been considered a complaint that would prompt a visit.

Senin, I'm in a very rural area where shots aren't uncommon, I called this time because there were thousands of rounds being fired. I've since found out that some people from the northern Virginia area bought some property and set up a range to use on weekends. I think the newness is wearing off and along with the leaves coming in to deaden the sound, we're not hearing as much shooting. Usually a lot of rounds but only for an hour or two at a time- some weekends have been shooting free.

Already learned to live with it and one good side effect, one of our dogs that is very scared of gunfire, is less bothered now. Won't walk when he hears it but doesn't skulk to the basement inside anymore.

Thanks to all that commented, I think the tones/responses used by the deputies could have been better but doesn't look like any long term ill will and maybe it had been a long day for them. With luck, I'll have no reason to deal with anyone from LE going forward. This only presents one side of the situation and maybe the deputy had other reasons to be more concerned about my responses than I thought was warranted or there was another trigger/observation that made him feel threatened by my lack of instant obedience.
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Old 06-10-2014, 07:26 AM   #50
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There are rude people in every profession. The deputy was more or less correct in what he was doing, but was rude and handled the explanation of why he was doing it badly.
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Old 06-10-2014, 07:51 AM   #51
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Wow that's interesting. A question that turns into an invitation. Must vary by area/state. I recall the only time I called the sheriff's office out here, asking about the neighbors illegal late night fireworks display. The dispatch would not send anyone out unless I was willing to file a complaint.

I'm glad you dog is a little less gun shy. Thats what got me upset, those fireworks were scaring our outdoor dog. I would go with your plan as well.
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Old 06-13-2014, 01:17 AM   #52
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There are rude people in every profession. The deputy was more or less correct in what he was doing, but was rude and handled the explanation of why he was doing it badly.
Agree 100%.

From the OP's description of events, the deputy sounds inexperienced, immature, or a combination of the two. Most cops learn that being confrontational is stupid and just gets you into a fight. Those always involve paperwork, personal risk, a dirty uniform, maybe a couple scratches, and often a complaint that generates a ton more paperwork and the risk of discipline. You learn how to talk people into all sorts of things they would never do if you demanded it.

But the deputy was absolutely right about one thing. When you invite the police to come into your life, you get the whole effect. They don't put on blinders and just worry about the problem you called about, they're going to be professionally observant and curious - it is what they are expected to do.

Cops are mostly great people, most of my friends are cops or retired cops. But when it comes to inviting law enforcement into my life in their official capacity - I avoid it like the plague. Stealing a line from Forest Gump, calling 911 is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're going to get. You will probably get a professional, but you might get a disaster wearing a badge. I don't take that risk lightly.
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Old 06-13-2014, 05:00 PM   #53
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30 years in LE. Not unusual for the Deputy to ask for DL to get your information, verify your DL matches you and run a routine check, but he was being very overbearing to treat you in the way you report he did. If I were you I would talk with an administrator in his agency to see if they have such a policy. The agency might not want their employees acting this way and making their citizens feel the way he made he feel.
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Old 06-13-2014, 05:50 PM   #54
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Behavior such as he described would definitely have earned anyone where I worked at least a chat with a Lt. or Captain. These are not friendly chats.
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Old 06-14-2014, 08:40 AM   #55
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I've been thinking about this and have decided that my point of view might be a bit skewed. I spent almost all my life living in a community of less than 1500 people and it would have been an insult for a local cop to ask to see an ID unless he was writing up a ticket. Everyone knew everyone in a town like that.
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Old 06-21-2014, 04:54 AM   #56
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I am urban. You are rural. So, the shots fired and the way local LE handle things may be different.

Yeah, I would ask to speak to the chief, or the captain, or whoever is in the chain.

You are just a concerned citizen interested in the safety of the community. You did not invite the cop into your home when you made that phone call.

It was handles badly.

Ofcourse, without any oversight, the local sheriff might be as bad as this cop.
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