Poll: Curmudgeons - Nature or Nurture?

[HFWR]

Now, if you believe your own BS, and you're happy...whats the problem?

The United States of America?

 

[NW-Bound]

When I reread my earlier post , I realized that I might have given the impression that I was an easy-going guy. No, far from it, I was born a cranky kid.

I have learned to be more relaxed as I age. About saying positive things that I do not mean, no, I don't do that. I just learn to refrain from saying negative things, when it would make no difference if I do. Why bother?

And get off my lawn, damn it!

Oops, I only have xericape around the house now.

Still, get off my damn gravel!

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

The United States of America?

That was too easy. I promise I'll make it harder next time.

 

[Amethyst]

I just don't think the world is full of idiots and morons. I've been around people from all walks of life and some other cultures than the U.S. From what I've seen, most people perceive what's to their advantage very quickly; they just don't always do it, if it involves too much effort and self-denial.

As for "curmudgeons," I see 2 types:

• The elderly whose bodies and senses are failing, and who react fearfully by lashing out at "kids who laugh too noisily" and whatnot. I see them as like elderly dogs who never used to snap and bite, but start to do so because their aches, pains, and failing senses create fear.
• Mostly middle-aged folks, who were "weaned on a pickle" as bbbami puts it; always considered being nice too much effort, but put in that effort as long as they felt driven to find mates and jobs. Once mating and working are no longer so important, the veil is dropped and the true grouch shows through.

While on the subject: I don't consider someone a curmudgeon simply because they are quick to point out flaws. Sometimes these are just extra-critical, extra-perceptive people, who really fill a need. You need somebody capable and willing to point out that spot you missed while painting, or that funny smell in the house that only house buyers would ever mention. Or that potentially costly flaw in the "Great New Plan" to transform the workplace.


Amethyst

I voted #1.

....it is difficult to live in this world full of idiots and morons.

 

[haha]

As for "curmudgeons," I see 2 types:

• Mostly middle-aged folks, who were "weaned on a pickle" as bbbami puts it; always considered being nice too much effort, but put in that effort as long as they felt driven to find mates and jobs. Once mating and working are no longer so important, the veil is dropped and the true grouch shows through.Amethyst

This is true, and funny. Horney people tend to be very nice to anyone that they think might alleviate that problem for them.
They can still shoot themselves in the foot by being clueless, but I don't think that make them curmudgeons, only to some degree socially tone deaf.

Ha

 

[HFWR]

In defense of curmudgeonry:

Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. - Douglas Adams

Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please. - Mark Twain

I don't like food that's too carefully arranged; it makes me think that the chef is spending too much time arranging and not enough time cooking. If I wanted a picture I'd buy a painting. - Andy Rooney

The American Dream, the American Dream, the American Dream. Politicians keep saying it. What is it, for God’s sake? Apparently it’s twenty grand on the Visa, upside down on the mortgage on a shoddily built oversize McMansion in a remote sterile suburb where you don’t know your neighbors, living paycheck to paycheck, no savings, forty-five minute commute to a job you hate with gas prices rising. If that’s a dream, better to stay awake. - Fred Reed

 

[MichaelB]

It is not so easy to define what a curmudgeon is. An older person but not an angry person, more like difficult and cantankerous, impatient and grumpy. A self-proclaimed realist in a world of idiots and morons. So, also somewhat self-centered and pretentious. The links, along with some of the comments, highlight one aspect – a curmudgeon looks to the past for inspiration and seems less able to understand and deal with the present.

Weaned on a pickle could be a cause, but that wouldn’t make the past a thing to admire – perhaps just the opposite. Curmudgeons are mostly older people, so this could be due to aging. Aches and pains, a sense of little time left, maybe even a little cognitive decline.

From the poll we seem to be pretty evenly split. Many self-proclaimed curmudgeons here. We are also Briggs-Meyers “I”s. Could there be a relationship between the two? Are introverts more likely to become curmudgeons?

 

[NW-Bound]

From the poll we seem to be pretty evenly split. Many self-proclaimed curmudgeons here. We are also Briggs-Meyers “I”s. Could there be a relationship between the two? Are introverts more likely to become curmudgeons?

My mother is an extrovert, yet I find it more and more difficult to converse with her. Yes, I believe she has turned into a curmudgeon.

I think introverts tend to self-examine, and would recognize "curmudgeonness" in themselves. Whether they want to do anything about it is another story.

And by the way, Merriam-Webster says "Curmudgeon: crusty, ill-tempered, and usually old man."

I have seen plenty of female curmudgeons. Why this stereotype? From my own limited experience, I'd say curmudgeonness strikes evenly across both sexes, personalities, and political inclinations. Equal opportunity, that's what curmudgeonness is.

PS. And if you challenge my assertion above, you'd better come up with some data! Stay off my gravel yard too!

PPS. Curmudgeonness increases with age. That's an undeniable fact, and explains why there are more curmudgeons here on this forum. A bunch of geezers, so what do you expect? Introversion is only a factor for self-admittance.

 

[imoldernu]

Briggs-Meyers was after my time... I as I recall, we studied some early follow ups on Jung... that made personality analyses based on intelligence test scores. I recall a visiting lecturer (Gettinger?) who opined that intelligence was a predisposing factor for a lack of tolerance.
Maybe, losing patience in old age is a function of fear of losing sharpness and control.

 

[Nemo2]

Perhaps it's because 'they' (we?) have "Seen it all before", and have limited patience for recycled failed ideas presented as 'new'?

 

[NW-Bound]

But, but, but, as I described one of my earlier bosses, the man often didn't listen long enough to realize that the "old idea" could be really new, or that what was done before failed because of a poor implementation, or because a crucial component was not available earlier in his time.

 

[unclemick]

I don't care what ya'll say - I gots the Certificate downloaded from this very forum!

heh heh heh -

Now I have to remember where the heck I put it.

 

[Nemo2]

But, but, but, as I described one of my earlier bosses, the man often didn't listen long enough to realize that the "old idea" could be really new, or that what was done before failed because of a poor implementation, or because a crucial component was not available earlier in his time.

"Sometime, not all the time" Bob Dylan.

 

[NW-Bound]

I never said that curmudgeons don't often prove themselves right. But I would hate it when I would stay stubborn, and was proven wrong in the end.

In fact, that almost happened to me recently in a consulting job. I made some comments on a very technical aspect of a project, based on my past experience. A couple of young engineers, the age of my kids and fresh out of school, found out differently and very politely asked to demonstrate to me. Damn! They were right and I was wrong.

I was able to save face by further explaining my thinking to them, and the reason I was wrong was because this new gizmo was different than my assumption. Basically, the gizmo that I worked on had a very tough constraint that was no longer imposed on this new device. So, the new problem was a lot easier to solve than the old one that I had to work. I then explained how I solved that old problem, which the young engineers did not know about.

We all walked away happy, all learning something new. In fact, they came back to me for further advice, and I did manage to help them this time.

 

[foxfirev5]

I fear that once I retire I may become a full blown curmudgeon. - Excuse #43 Maybe work is keeping my behavior slighty disciplined and socially acceptable,

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

From the poll we seem to be pretty evenly split. Many self-proclaimed curmudgeons here. We are also Briggs-Meyers “I”s. Could there be a relationship between the two? Are introverts more likely to become curmudgeons?

One of the early er boards came to the conclusion that many ER's are INTJ's.

When we did this in my old work department, the guy took the graded tests and started charting our results on a chart on a white board, and we were to guess who was who. When he came to mine, he drew a dot about 3' outside the upper right corner of the chart (where the driver/drivers were) and said "this guy must be a real flaming *******!", and everyone looked at me.

 

[Nords]

It is not so easy to define what a curmudgeon is. An older person but not an angry person, more like difficult and cantankerous, impatient and grumpy. A self-proclaimed realist in a world of idiots and morons. So, also somewhat self-centered and pretentious. The links, along with some of the comments, highlight one aspect – a curmudgeon looks to the past for inspiration and seems less able to understand and deal with the present.

And by the way, Merriam-Webster says "Curmudgeon: crusty, ill-tempered, and usually old man."

Whatever definition we agree on, I bet it has Andy Rooney's photo alongside.

 

[NW-Bound]

To be PC nowadays, need this photo to accompany Andy's picture.

 

[obgyn65]

This made me laugh. Thanks for sharing.

I tend to be introvert, not many words said. But quite an optimist overall and cheery. I think witnessing so much poverty in third world countries where I lead missionay clinics makes me realize how lucky and grateful I am to live here.

When we did this in my old work department, the guy took the graded tests and started charting our results on a chart on a white board, and we were to guess who was who. When he came to mine, he drew a dot about 3' outside the upper right corner of the chart (where the driver/drivers were) and said "this guy must be a real flaming *******!", and everyone looked at me.

 

[Amethyst]

Is that supposed to be a picture of a woman? Hard to tell. Quite sexless, actually. Could be a man in drag. Is that the view of a Curmudgeonly man - sexless?

Amethyst

To be PC nowadays, need this photo to accompany Andy's picture.

 

[NW-Bound]

Hmmm... I see your point, but still think the person looks more like a woman than a man. Perhaps we need a poll. But then, we already know how the votes would be split.

What if, when a woman gets curmudgeony (I love to make up words), she turns into a man? Before long, she would grow facial hair. As I said elsewhere, I like to be able to reconcile different theories. There's often an explanation for everything.

Wait a minute. I have heard of old women growing mustache. Could it be? Could it be?

 

[clifp]

I consider myself skeptical rather than curmudgeonly. Or are the really the same thing and I am just rationalizing it.

My Brother-In-Law and one of my best friends could give Eastwood in Grand Turino stiff competition in the curmudgeon dept.

 

[MichaelB]

My mother is an extrovert, yet I find it more and more difficult to converse with her. Yes, I believe she has turned into a curmudgeon.

How can you be sure it is her and not you?

 

[NW-Bound]

Oh, I have thought about this very same thing.

My siblings have agreed with me that my mom has changed. So, that's one thing in my favor.

But then, we have often been cranky with each other too, among the siblings.

What did I tell you about people getting old? I will soon be, if not already, surrounded by curmudgeons.

ARGHHHH.... I knew that I should have kept working, so I could be around young kids.

 

[MichaelB]

Oh, I have thought about this very same thing.

My siblings have agreed with me that my mom has changed. So, that's one thing in my favor.

But then, we have often been cranky with each other too, among the siblings.

What did I tell you about people getting old? I will soon be, if not already, surrounded by curmudgeons.

A question on my mind is if one is aware he / she is becomming a curmudgeon. I suspect not, which would reinforce your thought that it is not you.

ARGHHHH.... I knew that I should have kept working, so I could be around young kids.

Not always and it cuts both ways. Young people also have a way of making you feel older that you really are. I try to spend my time where there are always people of all ages.