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View Poll Results: What's the deal with Santa?
You screwed up. 13 86.67%
Nah, nobody has ever really believed. 2 13.33%
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Old 12-03-2007, 12:52 PM   #21
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You've got to admit that this global conspiracy that involves lying to kids is a little weird. I'm not saying it's bad. We do it because of tradition.

I don't know how it started, but I wouldn't be surprised if LSD were involved somehow.

"Hey, man, let's tell the kids there's a fat man in a red suit that brings toys."
"Yeah, and he comes down the chimney."
"Hey, I got it, he lives at the north pole, with midgets."
"Yeah, and he's got a reindeer with a light-up nose."
"Far OUT, man! Get those kids over here."
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Old 12-03-2007, 02:08 PM   #22
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My kids figured it out at Tooth Fairy time. They shared a room and pretended to be asleep. When I went in to put the $1 under the pillow, they both jumped up, pointed at me and said " We knew it was you!".
Well, it was a dead give away! Everybody knows the Tooth Fairy only pays a quarter......NOT a dollar!
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Old 12-03-2007, 04:23 PM   #23
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"Hey, man, let's tell the kids there's a fat man in a red suit that brings toys."
"Yeah, and he comes down the chimney."
"Hey, I got it, he lives at the north pole, with midgets."
"Yeah, and he's got a reindeer with a light-up nose."
"Far OUT, man! Get those kids over here."
I think those were the same guys who came up with the idea of a bunny hiding colored eggs to celebrate the resurrection of a dead guy.

I teach our kid not to be afraid of monsters. I teach her to explore the world around her and make observations and inferences. And I'm also supposed to tell her about a fat guy who breaks into our house at midnight to leave us commercially produced goods?

OK, I can do that!
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Old 12-08-2007, 05:47 PM   #24
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I was talking to my son today and we had one of those clarity moments.

He said my grandaughter wondered how Santa "knows everything".

She is 6 and he wasn't sure what to say, so he said, "Well maybe he's like god."

And of course the brilliant Zipper grandaughter that she is, came back with

..."well god isn't real." We both had a huge laugh over that.

I am seriously thinking there might be hope for the human race yet.

I recall in the very early 50's when I was about 8, that all the religious brainwashing sh*t I was being subjected to was a total crock.

Mrs. Zipper and I proudly raised a couple of Atheistic sons in the '70's.

And now it's 6 year olds that aren't sure about Santa, but are damn sure there is no god.
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Old 12-08-2007, 08:57 PM   #25
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My great nephew is 11 now and a year ago when he sat on Santa's lap Santa told him his sons played soccer too. Then when he was back with his mom he told her that Santa didn't even ask him what he wanted. This summer his mom told him Santa wasn't real and he cried. Then a few minutes later he asked about the tooth fairy and easter bunny and told her she could tell him he wouldn't cry. She said he looked like he wanted to cry.
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Old 12-08-2007, 09:07 PM   #26
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My great nephew is 11 now and a year ago when he sat on Santa's lap Santa told him his sons played soccer too. Then when he was back with his mom he told her that Santa didn't even ask him what he wanted. This summer his mom told him Santa wasn't real and he cried. Then a few minutes later he asked about the tooth fairy and easter bunny and told her she could tell him he wouldn't cry. She said he looked like he wanted to cry.
11 and still believes all that stuff? Scary.
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Old 12-08-2007, 10:14 PM   #27
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We had great fun with Santa when the kids were little. When the eldest started school he came home saying that the kids at school said Santa wasn't real. His 3 year old sister didn't know what to think of that. So...we settled it by telling both of them that Santa only brought presents to the kids who believed in him. Son changed his tune real quick! Santa continued to visit our house until DD came home from school and said, you don't have to do the Santa thing anymore...the kids at school told me that he isn't real. It was fun while it lasted.

DD and DS continued the Santa fun with their kids. Oldest granddaugter has always been a smart cookie! When she was about 3 she got a magic wand for Christmas that was supposed to light up...didn't. We have traveled extensively all of her life. When we were leaving she brought me her defective wand and asked me to drop it off at Santa's while we were traveling and ask him to fix it. She began reading at 4 and when she read Santa's note thanking her for the cookies she had left out for him, she recognized her dad's handwriting. She was really bummed.
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Old 12-08-2007, 11:01 PM   #28
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we settled it by telling both of them that Santa only brought presents to the kids who believed in him.
That's what I did too, but I cringed when I said it because it reinforces a faith-based belief system rather than an experience-based belief system. That's what spawned this thread.

She seems to get joy out of the rituals. She's playing seasonal music on the piano, singing rounds, decorating, counting down, etc. I'm not sure the belief in Santa is really necessary to feel the magic.
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Old 12-08-2007, 11:02 PM   #29
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Just heard a different take from a German woman who grew up in Germany. She still has a delightful German accent. Her parents would go out to the village on Christmas Eve morning to get their Christmas tree. The parents would take it into a special room where the kids weren't allowed, decorate it, then close the room.

On Christmas morning the whole family would go into that room and under the tree were all the presents. The German lady's parents always told them all the presents were from the Christ Child.

This lady is now in her 70's and has fond memories of her childhood and Christmas time especially. I was touched by her reminicences.
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Old 12-08-2007, 11:04 PM   #30
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That's what I did too, but I cringed when I said it because it reinforces a faith-based belief system rather than an experience-based belief system.
Some would say their faith comes to them because of their experience.

Not something I would cringe about.
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Old 12-09-2007, 12:02 AM   #31
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Just heard a different take from a German woman who grew up in Germany. She still has a delightful German accent. Her parents would go out to the village on Christmas Eve morning to get their Christmas tree. The parents would take it into a special room where the kids weren't allowed, decorate it, then close the room.

On Christmas morning the whole family would go into that room and under the tree were all the presents. The German lady's parents always told them all the presents were from the Christ Child.

This lady is now in her 70's and has fond memories of her childhood and Christmas time especially. I was touched by her reminicences.
That's how it's described in Maurice Sendak's version of The Nutcracker:

Morning Edition: Maurice Sendak's 'Nutcracker'

Apparently, the whole Santa Claus bit originated in the last century, and the reindeer got added as part of a commercial campaign:

Santa Claus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, it seems to morph quite a bit. I feel better now about making up my own story for the season.
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Old 12-09-2007, 12:55 AM   #32
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That's what I did too, but I cringed when I said it because it reinforces a faith-based belief system rather than an experience-based belief system. That's what spawned this thread.

She seems to get joy out of the rituals. She's playing seasonal music on the piano, singing rounds, decorating, counting down, etc. I'm not sure the belief in Santa is really necessary to feel the magic.
Relax and enjoy the season! We have had a ball with the g-kids. Many, many moons ago when they were learning the 12 Days of Christmas song, I thought it would be fun to give them an early present on each of the 12 days before Christmas. I didn't realize there was religious significance to that...not in my background. Anyway, the g-kids had a ball with their "early" presents. Now they (12 & 13) want money and a shopping trip for Christmas. Last year I offered to double the amount of their Christmas shopping spree if they would give up the 12 days of presents. Agreed immediately! So we are shopping now...yet another tradition...and still fun.
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Old 12-09-2007, 07:08 AM   #33
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I was talking to my son today and we had one of those clarity moments.

He said my grandaughter wondered how Santa "knows everything".

She is 6 and he wasn't sure what to say, so he said, "Well maybe he's like god."

And of course the brilliant Zipper grandaughter that she is, came back with

..."well god isn't real." We both had a huge laugh over that.

I am seriously thinking there might be hope for the human race yet.

I recall in the very early 50's when I was about 8, that all the religious brainwashing sh*t I was being subjected to was a total crock.

Mrs. Zipper and I proudly raised a couple of Atheistic sons in the '70's.

And now it's 6 year olds that aren't sure about Santa, but are damn sure there is no god.
That's a great story Mr Zipper.
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Old 12-09-2007, 11:39 PM   #34
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Those two poll choices up top are not sufficient. Neither choice is what I would vote.
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Old 12-09-2007, 11:44 PM   #35
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I recall in the very early 50's when I was about 8, that all the religious brainwashing sh*t I was being subjected to was a total crock.

Mrs. Zipper and I proudly raised a couple of Atheistic sons in the '70's.

And now it's 6 year olds that aren't sure about Santa, but are damn sure there is no god.
Have you and family ever thought of belief in God in gambling terms?

That is, what do you gain if you are right and there is no God. And what do you stand to lose if you are wrong?
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Old 12-10-2007, 12:25 AM   #36
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We took the niece and nephews out for cupcakes and to see the lights downtown on Friday night, and I overheard a conversation about that my niece saw Santa's shadow last year, and then nephew said he heard him on the roof. What good fun! They are 8 and 6 this year. I think it is cool that they believe.
Yeh. Nothing like observing real innocence to refresh one's soul.
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Old 12-10-2007, 12:56 AM   #37
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Have you and family ever thought of belief in God in gambling terms?

That is, what do you gain if you are right and there is no God. And what do you stand to lose if you are wrong?
Pascal's wager? That's basically the same thing we're trying to sell to the kids: don't believe in the fat guy in the red suit, and no soup presents for you!
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Old 12-10-2007, 08:13 AM   #38
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I still believe in the spirit of the Claus. The good will that the Christmas Holidays bring is like no other. Sometimes I wish that it was Christmas everyday and then just maybe there would be a little peace and goodwill in the world.

God Bless
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Old 12-10-2007, 09:23 AM   #39
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I still belive in the magic/spirit of Christmas (and other holidays as well - Great Pumpkin anyone?) My fond memories of these (before, during, and after my father vehemently stated he shot the EB, Santa, tooth fairy, etc...) are treasured! His shooting spree is something we amusedly "discuss" at holidays!
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Old 12-10-2007, 09:54 AM   #40
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Have you and family ever thought of belief in God in gambling terms?

That is, what do you gain if you are right and there is no God. And what do you stand to lose if you are wrong?
Made up my mind a long time ago that even if there were no God, I like the ethics of the Christian religion (you could substitute any religion...I'm just most familiar with Christian). I think the 10 commandments are basically a good reference for living your life...I like the fact that I feel bad when I'm snippy with someone and that I feel the need to forgive someone who's been snippy with me. What ever floats your boat is OK for you, but this makes mine sail just fine.

And I don't see a dang thing wrong with the joy of Santa. Yes, I know it won't last and the kids will find out eventually. They'll also find out that life is full of ugly things like war, inhuamanity, poverty, starvation, etc., but we try to protect them from all of this uglyness while they are young. As they grow up, explaining the Santa deception will be a lot easier than explaining the reality they have to face.
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