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Shove it Indicator Rising...
Old 12-08-2010, 05:45 PM   #1
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Shove it Indicator Rising...

Glad to see this...

Shove It Indicator Turns Positive: More People Quitting - Yahoo! Finance
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Old 12-08-2010, 05:54 PM   #2
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I wonder how much of this is people getting fed up with the increasing tendency of employers to use the lousy job market as an excuse to expect much more work for less pay, and to eliminate niceties that promote retention because they figure the fear of being unemployed in a terrible job market is motivation enough.
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Old 12-08-2010, 06:04 PM   #3
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It's an interesting game of "dare." Employers will ask to get more for less until what they are asking for at the rate of pay they're offering no longer results in having an adequate qualified labor force. Until then, hey, why not ask for more? So....... who's going to be first to quit so that others can benefit by having the employer see they're reached the limit and back off?

I already left. Boy, I bet that showed those employer-devils! You next Zig?
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Old 12-08-2010, 08:48 PM   #4
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I shoved it this week. Basically I was sick of being taken for granted.
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Old 12-08-2010, 08:57 PM   #5
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I shoved it this week. Basically I was sick of being taken for granted.
We need more info...
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Old 12-08-2010, 09:00 PM   #6
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I shoved it this week. Basically I was sick of being taken for granted.
Good for you to have done something about it. You should NOT be taken for granted, and it sounds like it was past time to move on.
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Old 12-08-2010, 09:46 PM   #7
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We [up here in Iceworld] are experiencing difficulties with suppliers. They got rid of the people who knew the products and knew enough about the business to deliver what we want to buy.

It is now as bad here as it is in the Middle East, where you can't expect a supplier to deliver a package that works. You must verify every part. If you can.

I swear, the world doesn't have quality suppliers anymore; all that is left are rug merchants.

BUT, do the customers want to deal with quality companies? NO! Lowest price only. And with a good D&B (no new start-ups, no sir). No matter they get crap today, no matter that it costs them 2 or 3 times more in the end.

When can I leave this circus?
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Old 12-08-2010, 10:08 PM   #8
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I wonder how much of this is people getting fed up with the increasing tendency of employers to use the lousy job market as an excuse to expect much more work for less pay, and to eliminate niceties that promote retention because they figure the fear of being unemployed in a terrible job market is motivation enough.
I'm not going to quit but I'm not going to do any extra work. I will work at a reasonable pace and whatever I get done is what gets done. If that's not good enough for them then they can fire me. I'll take the UI and take a 6 month vacation, or longer, then find a more reasonable job.
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Old 12-08-2010, 10:26 PM   #9
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Old 12-08-2010, 11:29 PM   #10
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I wonder how much of this is people getting fed up with the increasing tendency of employers to use the lousy job market as an excuse to expect much more work for less pay, and to eliminate niceties that promote retention because they figure the fear of being unemployed in a terrible job market is motivation enough.
Megacorp recently announced the restoration of the 5% pay cut plus higher funding for the bonus pool. That announcement was followed a week later by the SVP of HR resigning to be "nearer her family." You think she disagreed with the new CEO's decision? We continue to lose A-level architects and programmers because even in this economy good engineers are mobile.
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Old 12-08-2010, 11:36 PM   #11
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I swear, the world doesn't have quality suppliers anymore; all that is left are rug merchants.

BUT, do the customers want to deal with quality companies? NO! Lowest price only. And with a good D&B (no new start-ups, no sir). No matter they get crap today, no matter that it costs them 2 or 3 times more in the end.
Sadly true as to the deterioration in quality - the decline in post-sales suport and service is my personal pet peeve.

That said, I may be a minority but quality does matter to me for many of the things I buy. Longevity, functionality, post-sales service (among other things) are often more important to me than the sticker price.
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Old 12-09-2010, 07:46 PM   #12
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I'm not going to do any extra work. I will work at a reasonable pace and whatever I get done is what gets done. If that's not good enough for them then they can fire me. I'll take the UI and take a 6 month vacation, or longer, then find a more reasonable job.
This pretty much sums up my current thinking; but, it is widely known (from my boss all the way to our CEO) that I am happy to end any conversation with the words I quit if they find that last straw.
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Old 12-10-2010, 01:30 AM   #13
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About 3 years before I took voluntary "restructuring package" at megacorp, I had been working for many years extremely hard. One year I worked more hours and under more stress than I had ever worked before. I was white collar professional role, coordinating factions for IT architecture across multiple parts of the corporation. A really political situation. Well when review time came, I got a "Meets Expectations" rating, which is sort of the "C". There was a defined percentage breakdown; certain proportions of people had to fall into outstanding, above average, meets expectations, and improvement needed categories.

I was so PO'd about getting that "average" rating after how hard I had been working. My boss never stuck his neck out to support me in contentious situations, and his boss once let another department head "beat me up" in a meeting when that person didn't want any standards put on his little kingdom. I said to myself - "of what value is all this hard work and stress when my management won't strongly support me, and all it gets me is an average rating?". So in the few years I remained after that, I worked hard but never busted my butt in the same way. It was just a job. And I was a lot happier and healthier once I adopted my new attitude.
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Old 12-10-2010, 08:07 AM   #14
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.......... A really political situation. Well when review time came, I got a "Meets Expectations" rating, which is sort of the "C". There was a defined percentage breakdown; certain proportions of people had to fall into outstanding, above average, meets expectations, and improvement needed categories............
I saw a lot of this a MegaMotors, as well. If your boss was a wimp or just intimidated by a peer on the rise, you would get a crappy rating so the bully's boy could get the good rating. In some cases, the person in question had worked for me in the past and I knew exactly what caliber of a worker they were. Sure don't miss it...
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Old 12-10-2010, 09:21 AM   #15
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I'm not going to quit but I'm not going to do any extra work. I will work at a reasonable pace and whatever I get done is what gets done. If that's not good enough for them then they can fire me. I'll take the UI and take a 6 month vacation, or longer, then find a more reasonable job.
This is kind of my attitude as well. I can always find another job. Or go into business for myself. Or join a friend/colleague and start something up. And in the meantime, take a 6 month to 2 year paid vacation.

I am currently in the middle of telling the current employer to "take this job and shove it". Going from private employer to public, and getting over 3 extra weeks paid time off, a decent raise, flexible working hours and options, a pension (if I planned on sticking it out), and better benefits.

The current employer has had the following attitude for the last three years: "You employees have no better option than this company. I can point to two or three competitors (out of dozens) who have had pay cuts more severe than yours and have no benefits just like you. So don't expect a raise or a bonus any time soon. Even though we are profitable, we don't foresee changing your compensation soon. But eventually we will, someday. Just feel lucky you still have a job." This is not hyperbole, but rather paraphrasing from quarterly updates and private conversations I have had with management. In the meantime, our company has shrunk in half, with roughly equal numbers of layoffs and people quitting. Every single person who has quit has gone on to much better jobs with higher salaries, raises, bonuses, benefits, etc.

If you have skills, abilities, and confidence, there is no reason to wake up every morning and be force-fed BS all day.
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Old 12-10-2010, 09:57 AM   #16
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Two of the weekly Chinese buffet lunch crowd were "offered"...get a lod of this one...
Option A - a much lower salary on a recent contract renewal, OR
Option B - accept a layoff.
Both are highly skilled and trained professionals. I used to w*rk for the same company before I entered fed service. So I am acquainted with the "warm body" theory of the firm.

I heartily congratulated them on their choice.
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Old 12-10-2010, 09:58 AM   #17
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I shoved it this week. Basically I was sick of being taken for granted.
You go girl!
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Old 12-10-2010, 12:37 PM   #18
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I swear, the world doesn't have quality suppliers anymore; all that is left are rug merchants.

BUT, do the customers want to deal with quality companies? NO! Lowest price only. And with a good D&B (no new start-ups, no sir). No matter they get crap today, no matter that it costs them 2 or 3 times more in the end.
Wow, exactly what we're seeing in our 60+ year old industry. Our business is made-to-order though high volume and always has been. We worked our butts off to provide 6-sigma quality (and exceeded it) over the past decade or more. Now customers tell us quality means nothing to them.

We used to have customers with contracts, single-sourced to us, some for decades. Today there are few contracts, customers tell us we're a "commodity product" even though they each demand something different, and they bid their business quarterly if not monthly. Lead time is 'we want it tomorrow and if you don't deliver we'll call your competitor (even before we respond).'

No use in complaining, but our industry has changed radically over the past two years...
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Old 12-10-2010, 05:24 PM   #19
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There is a lot of "The workers should be grateful they have any job" going around in upper management at big companies. The attitude is that we can always get cheaper labor in Southern U.S. or Asia.

After dealing with the layoffs and other cutbacks in 08 and the uncertainty in 09, it was the last straw in 2010 when my mega-employer announced that they were going to move the division I was in. About 1/3 were told they had to move from Illinois to a brand new facility in the middle of nowhere in Texas, 1/3 were told they had to move 120 miles to corporate headquarters and the rest were told that they probably could find a job in another division that wasn't moving. I'd started running the numbers on retiring and had already decided that I could afford to. I turned in my notice when the announcement went out & have been happily retired since November.

Since I left there has been more turmoil at the office and my younger friends are rapidly getting even more stressed. I'm so glad I'm away from all of that.

Lorne
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Old 12-10-2010, 05:34 PM   #20
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