Solar Electric Assist--- NOT working

[ls99]

At least in Somerset PA. ------ BTW Find the solar panels in the photo of the development with all houses having solar panels. And this has been a very low snow amount winter around here.

High electric bills shocking Somerset development residents | News | tribdem.com
"Flyers advertising the development blare in bold capital letters: “ALL UNITS HAVE SOLAR PANELS FOR BETTER ENERGY EFFICIENCY!”
In January 2015, during the permitting phase of the project, developers told The Tribune-Democrat that a resident of a three-bedroom, 1,400-square-foot home in Highland Hills would likely pay around $16 a month for electric service."

"Little, who moved into the development last November, was charged $250.06 in December for consuming 1,765 kilowatt-hours of energy, her bill indicates. (Most of this total comes from Penelec’s distribution charge and price to compare default service, since, according to the list of charges on Little’s bill, Penelec isn’t providing her electricity itself.)
With a $177.39 account balance left over from the previous month’s bill and $1.73 in late payment charges, she was instructed to pay $429.18 by Jan. 3.
In January, Little consumed 2,544 kilowatt-hours and was charged $340.81; in February, she was billed $275.90 for 1,902 kilowatt-hours.
According to U.S. Energy Information Administration data from 2015, residential electric customers in Pennsylvania consume an average of 855 kilowatt-hours per month – less than half the amount of energy Little’s house has ever consumed in any single month – and pay average monthly bills of $116.62."


OTOH at my camp, totally off grid, solar works pretty good. All my panels are mounted vertically

 

[Amethyst]

The houses look like a row of gray tombstones. And not a tree to be seen. Never mind the disappearing solar panels - I would die of depression if I had to drive down that street every day.

 

[jonat]

My solar panels work great - I average 40% of my usage provided by solar each month, in line with estimates.

 

[ERD50]

I had been following a large local solar installation, their data is available online. Last winter, I noticed the panels had produced almost no power for over a week. I thought there was a problem with the system. I contacted the site admin, they didn't know, but mentioned that weather reports showed we had snow recently. Yep, those panels are at ~20 degree angle (to capture more summer sun during the longer days), and the snow falls and stays on them for a week or longer, with near zero output.

-ERD50

 

[travelover]

It seems like the apartments have heat pumps and they are kicking into resistance heating mode because the heat pumps are inadequate for the ambient temperatures.

 

[ERD50]

The houses look like a row of gray tombstones. And not a tree to be seen. ....

The trees would block the solar panels. -ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

...large local solar installation... the snow falls and stays on them for a week or longer, with near zero output.

Is it feasible to go out and scrape the snow off? I can see it's hard with those homes in the photo.

It seems like the apartments have heat pumps and they are kicking into resistance heating mode because the heat pumps are inadequate for the ambient temperatures.

+1

No reason having the ineffective panels makes it worse. Unless they are using electricity trying to heat and melt the snow as some guy proposed doing for solar-panels embedded in the road.

 

[brucethebroker]

I had been following a large local solar installation, their data is available online. Last winter, I noticed the panels had produced almost no power for over a week. I thought there was a problem with the system. I contacted the site admin, they didn't know, but mentioned that weather reports showed we had snow recently. Yep, those panels are at ~20 degree angle (to capture more summer sun during the longer days), and the snow falls and stays on them for a week or longer, with near zero output.

-ERD50

So, too much work for admin. to leave their toasty offices and coffee and grab a couple of brooms

Never saw it coming....huh??

 

[NW-Bound]

The trees would block the solar panels. -ERD50

You want trees too?

Well, these homes are new. Else, would have some trees or brushes, I am sure.

Walking around my neighborhood, I envy some of them with a big backyard. I would be able to erect my own solar array, have the optimal orientation and no shading. In fact, I can use the panels for shade from the broiling southwest sun. I could lay in a hammock in the shade of the panels, swinging and sipping pina colada.

 

[ERD50]

Is it feasible to go out and scrape the snow off? ...

I'm tempted to ask, I'd bet the people in charge don't even know that the snow was blocking the panels. When I asked about the drop originally, I only got an answer from the monitoring site, nothing from the people actually involved with the physical installation. This is a government run operation (school district), and if I get started, I'll probably get too political for the mods comfort, so I'll leave it there, but I guess I'll just say that I think they'd be more on top of it if it was their own money invested in those panels. I think they were more interested in the PR, and using "other people's money" (federal grants - as if that money doesn't come from the taxpayers) to pay for the panels.

This is a large installation on flat roofs. I think the snow could be shoveled/scraped off. But it would take time and there'd be risk of damaging the panels. And in winter, you don't get much power anyhow, so probably not worth it for a week of somewhat increased power, even if it could be done with reasonable care and effort.

But it makes me think that having a simple, manual adjustment of the angle a couple times a year would be worthwhile. Setting to a much steeper angle in winter not only improves the amount of sunlight captured, but the snow wouldn't build up as easily, and any that did would melt/slide/blow off much faster.


-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

...This is a large installation on flat roofs. I think the snow could be shoveled/scraped off. But it would take time and there'd be risk of damaging the panels. And in winter, you don't get much power anyhow, so probably not worth it for a week of somewhat increased power, even if it could be done with reasonable care and effort

That may very well be the case. People may not think panels require a bit of maintenance, but they do. And any labor would need its cost paid for, and there's no budget for it.

But it makes me think that having a simple, manual adjustment of the angle a couple times a year would be worthwhile. Setting to a much steeper angle in winter not only improves the amount of sunlight captured, but the snow wouldn't build up as easily, and any that did would melt/slide/blow off much faster...

I wonder if any large installation has the panel angle adjustable.

If I had my own dream solar installation in my backyard, I would of course make the installation tiltable, as it would give me something to play with. A retiree needs something to do, to tinker with.

 

[ls99]

My guess is that the houses are [-]crappily[/-] ]poorly insulated, have lots of air leaks, cheaply built, residents trying to keep warm run electric backup heating (as previously mentioned) without understanding how heat pump and their backup systems work...

BTW, by the lamp post shadow, hope the photo was not taken at noon time

And I don't feel like taking a 60 mile round trip to have a closer look. Agree with the dreary look comments, I would never live there. Rather live in a tepee.

 

[RobbieB]

My system works great!

This will be my first month of negative (banking energy) electric bill. Lotta sun and no AC. True up coming in August, my first annual solar true up and I'm looking forward to it.

One of the best financial moves I've made in my life.

 

[ERD50]

...

One of the best financial moves I've made in my life.

You're welcome!

-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

The houses look like a row of gray tombstones. And not a tree to be seen. Never mind the disappearing solar panels - I would die of depression if I had to drive down that street every day.

... Agree with the dreary look comments, I would never live there. Rather live in a tepee.

Aww, you guys are just too mean. The homes are new, and it's in the winter. They moved in in November 2016, not time to plant anything.

Comes spring, there will be pretty flowers, green leaves and all that good stuff.

 

[travelover]

My system works great!............

I think the solar panels in the OP are just a distraction. The real issue is why the electrical consumption is over twice what is anticipated. Gotta be electrical heating to suck up that much juice.

 

[Texas Proud]

When some of the panels first came out it seems Ed Begley had some installed...

Then Bill Nye moved in and a rivalry started....

I saw one segment where Ed was on his roof with a mop cleaning his off to get more power...


Ed Begley, Bill Nye wage friendly eco war - ABC News

 

[jimbee]

I think the solar panels in the OP are just a distraction. The real issue is why the electrical consumption is over twice what is anticipated. Gotta be electrical heating to suck up that much juice.

Yep.

 

[ls99]

Aww, you guys are just too mean. The homes are new, and it's in the winter. They moved in in November 2016, not time to plant anything.

Comes spring, there will be pretty flowers, green leaves and all that good stuff.

Agree there will be.... Just not in that neighborhood.

 

[NW-Bound]

Why not? Please elucidate.

 

[jonat]

I have a roof rake with a plastic blade that I use to clear snow off my panels. Once I get some of them clear, the rest tend to clear themselves in short order. I do have the advantage that the panels are on the roof of my garage, thus only one floor up, whereas the photo shows panels two floors up, making it more difficult. But I go around my neighborhood where several homes have solar panels, and I never see snow remain on them for long.

 

[ls99]

Nothing but grass planted in these new developments. The grass is treated with weedkiller/insecticide/bugicide stuff so nasty birds won't stay but a moment after landing, no insects, nothing for the butterlies to hang around for... Meantime it is the silent spring coming up. I hae seen several of these in the Johnstown Somerset outskirts.

Maybe when it is abandoned for lack of usefullness, and no further "beautification" treatments, then nature can take over.

 

[NW-Bound]

OK. So, I guess just having solar panels do not qualify the neighborhood as being "green".

But it is still real green grass. In Mesa, a retirement town east of Phoenix, many homes do not have much vegetation, and just rock gardens all around. They look awful when I was younger, but now can see why these geezers want a low, well, actually zero maintenance yard.

The subdivision in the photo will look OK with real grass, kids playing on it, or riding their bikes on the sidewalk, adults with adult beverages tending their BBQ. I would not be so harsh.

 

[ERD50]

Nothing but grass planted in these new developments. The grass is treated with weedkiller/insecticide/bugicide stuff so nasty birds won't stay but a moment after landing, no insects, nothing for the butterlies to hang around for... Meantime it is the silent spring coming up. I hae seen several of these in the Johnstown Somerset outskirts.

Maybe when it is abandoned for lack of usefullness, and no further "beautification" treatments, then nature can take over.

Really? Have any evidence of that?

I tend to use a minimal amount of pesticides and fertilizer on my lawn (part cheapskate, part environmentalist), but most of the neighbors go full tilt with a lawn service. We all have lots of wildlife.

-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

Out of curiosity, I looked on Google Earth trying to find this neighborhood. Gave up, and went to Zillow and could not find it either. Boy, looks like Johnstown has some really depressed areas.