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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 08-31-2005, 09:32 PM   #21
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Below is what the Red Cross says* you ought to have in your evac plan. . . .
The American Red Cross recommends that evacuees bring the following items:

Prescription medications
Bottled water
Basic medical supplies or a first aid kit
A change of clothes
Bedding, including sleeping bags and pillows
Nonperishable food and a hand-operated can opener
Battery-operated radio and extra batteries
Flashlight
Car keys and maps
Prepare a file or box of important personal and financial information to take with you. Gather copies of:

Social Security cards
Copies of your identification cards such driver's license, green card or passport
Birth certificates
Bank-account records
Marriage certificates and divorce decrees
Titles, deeds or registrations for property and vehicles
Mortgage and other loan information
Insurance policies
Investment records
Credit-card statements
Income-tax information (copies of past returns, proof of estimated tax payments)
Wills
Get a list of phone numbers, mail and e-mail addresses for important contacts, including:

Banks and other financial institutions
Employers
Insurance agents
Power, light, gas and other utility companies
Relatives, close friends and other emergency contacts
Also include instructions on how to turn off your home's utilities. Doing so before you evacuate can help prevent further damage to your home

Have fun
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-01-2005, 11:12 PM   #22
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

We too have been fortunate enough to never face such a choice ... but our official, somewhat tongue-in-cheek family motto is "panic early, and panic often".*

Now we don't really mean panic ... we just mean to take potentially serious situations seriously.* Fire alarm goes off?* Get out of the building ... don't wait for someone to tell you to leave.

If you read about natural and man-made disasters, there are often stories of how some survived easily, by paying attention, and evacuating early ... while others waited, and died.

In the Titanic sinking in 1912, the first passengers on the lifeboats were told it was just a precaution, and they'd soon come back to the ship ... and the early lifeboats left half full.* Those passengers survived.* In 9/11, some people ignored the reported announcement to stay in their offices in one of the towers, and evacuated anyway ... they survived.

So what we've taught our kids is to not panic, but consider the downside of staying versus the downside of leaving if there is a potential life-threatening situation ... if you leave, someone may make light of your caution ... and if you stay, you may die.


Regarding other lessons, we are stunned at the reports ... feels as though we're watching a third world country react to a disaster.* We feel not only great sadness at the losses, but also shame at the failure in management, at many levels ... see http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050901/D8CBNMA88.html
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-02-2005, 01:29 AM   #23
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caroline
. . . What did you do?* What WOULD you do if the unthinkable happened?

Caroline
I don't think that's really a fair question. If a day before the hurricane hit, you told these people, "Either leave now or you will certainly die or suffer tremendous personal pain." Well . . . I think they would all have left. If a month ago you had been able to tell them with certainty, "Your house will be flooded and all your belongings destroyed if you don't move." I think most of them would have tried to move.

The problem is the uncertainty and the history of close calls that were not devastating. If I run from the storm now, I will certainly incur a lot of cost and lost time -- possibly for nothing. If I stay, I may be uncomfortable for awhile or something worse may happen. But something worse has never happened before.

This is a lot like the choice people make regarding smoking. It's hard to stop and I haven't died yet. But continuing is much easier and I haven't died yet.

======
Regarding your question about personal experience . . . I lived in the mid-west tornado belt for many years. Growing up, I lived less than a block from the town's tornado warning siren. We probably got a handfull or more tornado warnings every year. I recall only two tornados that did serious damage. I have ignored tornado sirens on several occasions. I would be surprised if a majority of people from those areas wouldn't admit to the same.
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-02-2005, 05:05 AM   #24
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caroline
Anyone else faced that choice? What did you do? What WOULD you do if the unthinkable happened?
Caroline
We are long time Outer Banks vacationers and will likely RE there on the sound side in Kill Devil Hills (far less vunerable than places like Hatteras but vunerable nontheless). We would evacuate early even on a tropical depression. Only two main ways on-off the island. Just think of the FL Keys with only one "long" way in-out.

This disaster will forever change how people-governments look at these risky hurricane locations. Maybe we won't be RE'ing there?
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-02-2005, 07:03 AM   #25
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina



I'm with you (and near you) Dave at Carolina Beach. We are always ready to bug out on a moments notice. We store no valuables here and almost always have a full gas tank. Lotsa neighbors have fun stories about their hurricane parties... no thanks, see ya later, maybe.


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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-02-2005, 12:17 PM   #26
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Quote:
Originally Posted by BUM

I'm with you (and near you) Dave at Carolina Beach. We are always ready to bug out on a moments notice. We store no valuables here and almost always have a full gas tank. Lotsa neighbors have fun stories about their hurricane parties... no thanks, see ya later, maybe.


BUM
Yep, I guess Carolina Beach is a one-way out proposition. Must be a beautiful area though. Many OBX hardcores rode out Isabel, Dennis and others. Were you around for those? [I'll save my bravado for kitesurfing on sunny "sea breeze" days in the sound].
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-02-2005, 08:37 PM   #27
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

SG, I think it is a fair question. Your points are well taken, and many of us could agree we've sometimes taken the risk ... but, it does start with personal responsibility.

For those who truly could have left, but didn't ... they bear primary responsibility for their losses. For those who could not leave due to poverty, age, etc. ... it's a reasonable question to ask why school buses were left in the flood, and not used to move those folks ... while we had days to watch Katrina grow and bear down on the city considered most vulnerable in the states. There have been stupendous errors of judgment.
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-03-2005, 09:03 AM   #28
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

I wish we could be methodical about planning for disaster needs in the United States instead of having money distribution based on politics and power ala bridge to unihabited island in Alaska.

One problem is the ease we have developed in minimizing science. Don't like a report government scientists have come up with? Edit the report or delay its release for "more study". Don't like having the morning after pill available without prescription? Delay approval for more study despite all studies finding no medical issues.

So, what do we need to do for disaster planning? Have evacuation plans for the poor and ill who don't have transportation for one. Think about whether NOLA should in fact be rebuilt and how. Are other areas, like Tampa, vulnerable? If so, get a plan in place.

How about San Francisco? It is vulnerable to fires in the event of an earthquake. Are buildings in SF required to be sprinkered? I don't have a clue if this is correct, but I have heard that the bay bridge was weakened in prior earthquakes? Is it? If so, what are we doing about it?



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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-03-2005, 12:22 PM   #29
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

New Orleans Quotes:

"I'm satisfied with the response." --George W. Bush at NO Airport...

"The results are not acceptable." --G.W. Bush earlier in the day...

"We're going to help these communities rebuild....Out of the rubbles of Trent Lott's house -- he's lost his entire house -- there's going to be a fantastic house. And I'm looking forward to sitting on the porch." (Laughter.) --Bush During Disaster Tour...

{"...................................."} --Dick Cheney...

"No one has thought enough of us to even bring us a cup of water....Several bodies lie scattered around. Edwards pointed to an elderly lady dead in a wheelchair and said, "I don't treat my dog like that." He says he buried his dog." --Man Outside NO Convention Center...

"They don't have a clue what's going on down here....They flew down here one time two days after the doggone event was over with TV cameras, AP reporters, all kind of goddamn - excuse my French everybody in America, but I am pissed," New Orleans Mayor Nagin...

I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees." --George W. Bush 9/1/05...

"The storm surge most likely will topple our levee system" New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin 8/28/05...

"No one can say they didn't see it [the breach of the levees] coming." --Newhouse New Service...

"Bush slashed levee reinforcement funding "down to a trickle," and New Oreans is in a Democratic Party state." --Jerry Politex...

"A better leader would have flown straight to the disaster zone and announced the immediate mobilization of every available resource." --Conservative NH Union Leader...

"It looks like a lot of that place could be bulldozed." --GOP House Speaker Dennis Hastert...

"An Act of God destroyed a wicked city." --Christianist Repent America director Michael Marcavage...

"Take a close look at the people you see wandering, devastated, around New Orleans: they are predominantly black and poor." --NYT Columnist David Brooks...

The people remaining in New Orleans "who chose not to evacuate, who chose not to leave the city....the federal government did not even know about the Convention Center people until today." --Bush FEMA director Michael Brown...

To help in rescue efforts, "donate cash [to Pat Robertson's] Operation Blessing." --FEMA website...

"Since this administration won't acknowledge that global warming exists, the chances of leadership seem minimal." --NYT Editorial

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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-05-2005, 12:26 AM   #30
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Quote:
Originally Posted by REWahoo!
NO is somewhat unique as a city, so why not rebuild it as a really unique city.* Drain it long enough to redo the infrastructure, require all construction to be above the flood line, and let the water back in.* Call it "Venice on the Mississippi".
Let's do it right-- call in Donald Trump & Michael Eisner...
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-05-2005, 09:18 PM   #31
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Quote:
I don't have a clue if this is correct, but I have heard that the bay bridge was weakened in prior earthquakes?* Is it?* If so, what are we doing about it?

After 16 years and $3.6 Billion in cost overruns (yes, that's Billion with a B), replacement of the east span of San Francisco's Bay Bridge is scheduled to be completed in 2012 at a cost of $6.3 billion.

If you have a high tolerance for political stupidity and want to read the entire article, it's here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern...and_Bay_Bridge
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina
Old 09-05-2005, 10:45 PM   #32
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Re: struggling with lessons from Hurricane Katrina

Well, this guy was ready!

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...toryId=4831399
(you can listen to the whole segment of go forward to the Randy Adams interview at 2:45)

I'd like to think I would be as prepared.* Even though we live in the desert this event has certainly caused me to think about what to have on hand, what to take, the value of actual currency. If my kids are with me all the rest is just stuff.

Judy
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