Student Loan Crisis

[Nick12]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelB How would you find that level of detail about the financial habits and behavior of others? Is there any data to support that or is it just a stereotype?

No stereotype. Living in my neighborhood for the last 20 plus years, families in our subdivision know each other throughout the years when we socialize with each other at the community tennis courts, golf course, pool and playground areas. Does this answer your questions?

[aja8888]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick12 No stereotype. Living in my neighborhood for the last 20 plus years, families in our subdivision know each other throughout the years when we socialize with each other at the community tennis courts, golf course, pool and playground areas. Does this answer your questions?

Just curious, but where are you?

[ExFlyBoy5]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelB How would you find that level of detail about the financial habits and behavior of others? Is there any data to support that or is it just a stereotype?

Not so much a sterotype nor statistical, but when I was in law school, there were quite a few students who couldn't spend their "refund" (the living stipend but they insisted on calling it a refund) fast enough. It was amazing to see these ADULTS (most who were at least 22 years old) not have ANY understanding (or ignored) how these loans would cost a LOT of money in just a few short years. I went to a study group a couple of times where a handful of students rented condos that were within walking distance of the school...they lived ALONE and the rents averaged about $1700 a month. And of course, a year out of school...I know a few that just have no idea how they are going to pay back the loans.

[Bestwifeever]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick12 No stereotype. Living in my neighborhood for the last 20 plus years, families in our subdivision know each other throughout the years when we socialize with each other at the community tennis courts, golf course, pool and playground areas. Does this answer your questions?

Nobody complained about paying for their kids' college?

[Chuckanut]

If I was going to borrow a lot of money to get educated it would be become a doctor, electrician or plumber.

[MichaelB]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick12 No stereotype. Living in my neighborhood for the last 20 plus years, families in our subdivision know each other throughout the years when we socialize with each other at the community tennis courts, golf course, pool and playground areas. Does this answer your questions?

Just wondering, thanks for answering.

[Nick12]

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Originally Posted by Bestwifeever Nobody complained about paying for their kids' college?

Yes, especially the families that had their kids enrolled in private colleges. The families that had their kids enrolled in state colege, not so much.

[Independent]

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Originally Posted by Hopeful Once thing I think does not get discussed often is the correlation between these easy to get loans and the sky rocketing college costs. As students are able to easily acquire high student loans, colleges seem far too eager to raise prices to take advantage of the "easy" money. It would seem that if the student loans were reduced or limited colleges would be forced to bring tuitions more in line. It reminds me of the housing bubble in the late 2000's. Banks were practically giving money away to people they knew couldn't afford it. As a result the housing prices sky rocketed in correlation to this easy money.

+1

[GravitySucks]

Is it really a crisis, or are some outliers making things look worse? While it is much more expensive now the value is actually higher as lower educated workers make so much less on average. The spread between college grads and high school grads is greater than when I was starting out.

"Bachelor's degree holders owed a median of $25,000, while those with a postgraduate degree owed a median of $45,000. Relatively few with student loan debt have six-figure balances. Only 7% of current borrowers have at least $100,000 in outstanding debt, which corresponds to 1% of the adult population."

$25k median isn't chicken feed to a young person,but far from insurmountable. The $37k average would be a harder but to crack.
The new private student housing that recently opened at my alma mater would sell for more than my house is worth. If the worries are real I guess the resorts in Cancun were vacant this spring.

[ncbill]

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Originally Posted by Nick12 I find it very ironic that younger generation in my neighborhood that are saddled with student loan debt live by themselves in very nice apartments, lease new cars, do not take on a second job to supplement their income to pay down debt but have the time and effort to take several get away vacations a year.

They may well already be on an income-based repayment plan, which caps their own payment at a easier-to-service level, with forgiveness of the majority of the loan balance a couple of decades down the line.

[Nick12]

Gotta love those forgiveness loans when the federal agencies that issue the loan to the family then closes the particular loan case and thereby forgiving the family from paying back the loan in full.

[mystang52]

Did I miss something? Did these kids and their parents have a gun pointed at them that forced them to take out loans? Didn't they agree to pay back money LENT to them? If I - as a taxpayer - am now being asked to help fund their defaulting on loans, what recourse do I have? How many of these non-payers actually tried to pay down their loans? How many stayed in class and partied at least a little less knowing that they would need to get a job and pay back those loans eventually? How many partied, never graduated but still have loans and are now looking to me to bail them out?
I genuinely have zero compassion on this issue, at the very least until I hear some comments about personal responsibility and what the people who owe these loans plan to do to pay their........fair share.

[Walt34]

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Originally Posted by mystang52 Did I miss something? Did these kids and their parents have a gun pointed at them that forced them to take out loans? <snip> I genuinely have zero compassion on this issues, at the very least until I hear some comments about personal responsibility and what the people who owe these loans plan to do to pay their........fair share.

Okay, call me a curmudgeon but I'm with him.

[MichaelB]

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Originally Posted by mystang52 How many of these non-payers actually tried to pay down their loans? .

Actually, all of them. Most of the “forgiveness” programs are for people that work in certain professions, such as nursing, and in areas that are under serviced. Student loans cannot be discharged in bankruptcy, and inability to pay does not qualify for simple forgiveness.

The Social Security Pension can also be garnished to repay federal student loans.

[haha]

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Originally Posted by GrayHare If you revisit your alma mater I suspect you will find it with more creature comforts and tech. Places that were not air conditioned in your day now are. Computer labs and workstations will abound. The sports stadium will be new and improved. Buildings will have been renovated while entire new ones have sprung up. Security will be tighter. The grounds will be better maintained. The list can go on.

But the students are mostly interested 1)in the sex available and 2) how hard it is to get an acceptable grade.

Ha

[Nick12]

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Originally Posted by ncbill They may well already be on an income-based repayment plan, which caps their own payment at a easier-to-service level, with forgiveness of the majority of the loan balance a couple of decades down the line.

There is a program called PSLFP. Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program. One must make 120 qualifying monthly payments before applying. The person must be employed full time by a government organization, not for profit organization that is tax exempt, or serving in the Peace Corps.

[CardsFan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mystang52 Did I miss something? Did these kids and their parents have a gun pointed at them that forced them to take out loans? Didn't they agree to pay back money LENT to them? If I - as a taxpayer - am now being asked to help fund their defaulting on loans, what recourse do I have? How many of these non-payers actually tried to pay down their loans? How many stayed in class and partied at least a little less knowing that they would need to get a job and pay back those loans eventually? How many partied, never graduated but still have loans and are now looking to me to bail them out? I genuinely have zero compassion on this issues, at the very least until I hear some comments about personal responsibility and what the people who owe these loans plan to do to pay their........fair share.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walt34 Okay, call me a curmudgeon but I'm with him.

In most respects, I agree with you. If you take a loan, you pay the loan. If you took a loan for a degree that has no chance of getting the money to pay the loan, you STILL pay the loan. Its no different than buying a car and wrecking it 2 days later. You still owe the money.

But I think MichaelB and others have pointed out that if the Universities had skin in the game, then maybe they would a be little more careful about the cost of a semester, who gets a loan, and whether the degree can justify the cost.

In no way do I advocate forgiving past loans, but maybe we can fix the future by making a change now.

[mh]

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Originally Posted by wmc1000 How is it cars "only" inflated 2.1% in price? How is that 2019 Honda Accord only 2.1% higher than the price of a new 1996 Honda Accord?

I suspect a lot of it has to do with automation ( pun intended ) of parts fabrication and final construction.

[exnavynuke]

I love how people like to compare the "base price" over the years and ignore everything else about it. The average "net price" (after taking into account public grants and scholarships, but not private scholarships) for a year of public college in the US was $13,400 in 2017 (data from the National Center for Education Studies). Now, don't get me wrong, that's quite a bit of money, and a 4-year degree going to an average public university would thus cost over $60k, but you can pay for that working part time at McDonald's people...

The average graduating student loan balance is a whopping $3x,xxx, not 6-figures. That also doesn't include those who graduate with no loans at all, so really it's quite a bit lower than that. Getting a degree that likely increases earning power by a significant percentage, with no student loan debt or, if you choose a more expensive school/don't get any assistance/don't choose to work to pay for it, end up with an average debt about the price of a nicely optioned mid-sized sedan doesn't seem that outrageous to me.

Of course, if the kid wants to go private or to an out of state school and thus voluntarily chooses to triple (or more) the costs of their education, I'm also not going to feel sorry for them since they made that choice and "tuition alone is 3-4 times as much" is a concept I think anyone intelligent enough to get into college should be smart enough to grasp.

[Nick12]

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Originally Posted by exnavynuke I love how people like to compare the "base price" over the years and ignore everything else about it. The average "net price" (after taking into account public grants and scholarships, but not private scholarships) for a year of public college in the US was $13,400 in 2017 (data from the National Center for Education Studies). Now, don't get me wrong, that's quite a bit of money, and a 4-year degree going to an average public university would thus cost over $60k, but you can pay for that working part time at McDonald's people... The average graduating student loan balance is a whopping $3x,xxx, not 6-figures. That also doesn't include those who graduate with no loans at all, so really it's quite a bit lower than that. Getting a degree that likely increases earning power by a significant percentage, with no student loan debt or, if you choose a more expensive school/don't get any assistance/don't choose to work to pay for it, end up with an average debt about the price of a nicely optioned mid-sized sedan doesn't seem that outrageous to me. Of course, if the kid wants to go private or to an out of state school and thus voluntarily chooses to triple (or more) the costs of their education, I'm also not going to feel sorry for them since they made that choice and "tuition alone is 3-4 times as much" is a concept I think anyone intelligent enough to get into college should be smart enough to grasp.

+1/ going in state to college is the way to go. Even if the family doesn't qualify for financial aid, if the student has the grit and determination the student can hustle and work part time during the school year, full time during the summer time as an example. It can be be done, I did it / instead of complaining about being in debt and hanging out with the lazy crowd. Another option is going ROTC, free ride but the Armed Forces own you for the next several years after graduation.