Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-25-2010, 12:06 PM   #81
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: France
Posts: 1,195
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
Of course, if marriage has a special meaning to you, or you belong to a religious group or social group that would frown on a man and a woman being close without the appropriate paperwork, then go for it.
My BIL is a devout Christian. He got married, three years ago, at the age of 52, to a woman aged 38. Both of them were virgins, because they live their lives the way the Bible says. Apparently, most Christians - given that 75% of Americans identify themselves as such - live according to a somewhat condensed version of the Bible, at least on that score...
__________________

__________________
Age 56, retired July 1, 2012; DW is 60 and working for 2 more years. Current portfolio is 2000K split 50 stocks/20 bonds/30 cash. Renting house, no debts.
BigNick is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 11-25-2010, 06:53 PM   #82
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigNick View Post
My BIL is a devout Christian. He got married, three years ago, at the age of 52, to a woman aged 38. Both of them were virgins, because they live their lives the way the Bible says. Apparently, most Christians - given that 75% of Americans identify themselves as such - live according to a somewhat condensed version of the Bible, at least on that score...
I didn't have Christians in mind when I wrote that post BigNick. And discussing religious dogma, teachings, beliefs, etc., is more hazardous than discussing politics, so .......... NOT going there!
__________________

__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2010, 07:19 PM   #83
Moderator Emeritus
Nords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigNick View Post
Apparently, most Christians - given that 75% of Americans identify themselves as such - live according to a somewhat condensed version of the Bible, at least on that score...
Hey, batting .300 in major league baseball is considered pretty good... I'm sure the same logic could apply to the Ten Guiding Mission and Vision Principles Commandments.
__________________
*
*

The book written on E-R.org, "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement", on sale now! For more info see "About Me" in my profile.
I don't spend much time here anymore, so please send me a PM. Thanks.
Nords is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2010, 09:22 PM   #84
Moderator
Sarah in SC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 13,456
I know several significant alimony payers among our male divorced friends. Life sucks for them! Even in this "modern" time, I guarantee there are women out there hustling for alimony. I've seen it!
__________________
“One day your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it's worth watching.”
Gerard Arthur Way

Sarah in SC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2010, 10:58 PM   #85
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmar View Post
I am paying $250k per year. Alimony certainly exists in Canada. If I die before her my estate continues to pay!
Don't you know anyone named Vinnie?
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2010, 11:47 PM   #86
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,401
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
"Many divorce agreements provide for alimony or spouse-support payments, which is separate from child-support payments. Americans gave $9.4 billion to former spouses in 2007, up from $5.6 billion a decade earlier, according to the Internal Revenue Service. Men accounted for 97% of alimony-payers last year, according to the U.S. Census Bureau, although the share of women supporting ex-husbands is on the rise."
The New Art of Alimony - WSJ.com
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
Wow. Men, read this and you will be cured forever of romantic love.

Ha
I just read the WSJ article posted by Tigger. Cases like the following are truly appalling.

"In 1982, when they got divorced, the split was amicable. She got the family home; he got the second home. Both agreed "to waive any right to past, present or future alimony."

But recently, more than two decades after the divorce, Ms. Taylor, 64, told a Massachusetts judge she had no job, retirement savings or health insurance. Earlier this year, the judge ordered Mr. Taylor, now 68 and remarried, to pay $400 per week to support his ex-wife."


Though I have no intention of ever ending my marriage of 30 years, I am glad I do not live in the state of Massachusetts. The article cited more cases like that. If it were not published by the WSJ, I would have said someone made up these stories.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 12:04 AM   #87
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,384
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R View Post
But the way I see it (through my cynical divorcee eyes), marriage is a financial arrangement that is not necessarily required for romantic love. So love all you want - - just don't pull out that diamond ring.
I think you are correct. However, as a separate issue, I think that "romantic love" is perhaps unbecoming and potentially hazardous for mature people, especially men. In my state, so few people were getting married that the spousal support thing wasn't working very well as an income stream for the ladies, so several women's organizations and the family lawyers got together and lobbied for and succeeded in getting legislation passed creating a kind of synthetic marriage, where someone can get whacked without knowing that he was vulnerable, unless he reads Washington Woman. Live with a woman in a romantic relationship (is that a misnomer or what??) for one year plus one day, and just try to lose her. Not so easy.

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 12:08 AM   #88
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DangerMouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Silicon Valley
Posts: 1,812
The greed of some ex-partners never ceases to amaze me. There was a case recently in the UK where a lottery winner was sued by his ex-wife for a share of his lottery winnings. Never mind that she left him 10 years ago after committing adultery. Some people have no shame.

Lottery winner Nigel Page to pay ex-wife £2m who left him 10 years ago | Mail Online
__________________

I be a girl, he's a boy. Think I maybe FIRED since July 08. Mid 40s, no kidlets. Actually am totally clueless as to what is going on with DH.
DangerMouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 12:15 AM   #89
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,401
Greed, I understand. It's quite common. What is appalling are court orders upholding these outrageous claims. Do these judges have any brain?
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 12:31 AM   #90
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,851
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
I think you are correct. However, as a separate issue, I think that "romantic love" is perhaps unbecoming and potentially hazardous for mature people, especially men. In my state, so few people were getting married that the spousal support thing wasn't working very well as an income stream for the ladies, so several women's organizations and the family lawyers got together and lobbied for and succeeded in getting legislation passed creating a kind of synthetic marriage, where someone can get whacked without knowing that he was vulnerable, unless he reads Washington Woman. Live with a woman in a romantic relationship (is that a misnomer or what??) for one year plus one day, and just try to lose her. Not so easy.

Ha
Wow! That is shocking.

Sounds like the only safe way for a man to love a woman without getting in a situation like that, is to refrain from marrying and also to keep up separate residences. Then, you can love all you want, and enjoy your retirement alongside your sweetheart.

I may yet persuade some that there are advantages to living apart and not marrying. Not that that solution is for everyone.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 01:00 AM   #91
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,384
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R View Post
I may yet persuade some that there are advantages to living apart and not marrying.
You got me persuaded!

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 01:32 AM   #92
Dryer sheet wannabe
want2xplore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R View Post
Sounds like the only safe way for a man to love a woman without getting in a situation like that, is to refrain from marrying and also to keep up separate residences. Then, you can love all you want, and enjoy your retirement alongside your sweetheart.
On a scale of 1 to 10 I give that one a +25
__________________
Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. - Ricky Gervais
want2xplore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 03:17 AM   #93
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
vicente solano's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan View Post
+1

We've been an "item" since we were 18 (married at 20) and can't imagine re-marrying should anything bad happen. But, one never knows, and if I should connect with someone else like I do with DW I would not rule out marriage.
Same thinking.
__________________
I get by with a little help from my friends....ta ta ta ta ta...
vicente solano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 07:04 AM   #94
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
It is a personal choice. There are some legal benefits to being married also.

Short of there being some sort of special circumstances... the determining factor is confidence in the decision/relationship and making a commitment.

IMO - In more cases than not.... the male would be fine just shacking up. The female wants is going to press for a gesture of commitment and the security (or feeling of security) it signifies.
__________________
chinaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 07:15 AM   #95
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DangerMouse View Post
The greed of some ex-partners never ceases to amaze me. There was a case recently in the UK where a lottery winner was sued by his ex-wife for a share of his lottery winnings. Never mind that she left him 10 years ago after committing adultery. Some people have no shame.

Lottery winner Nigel Page to pay ex-wife £2m who left him 10 years ago | Mail Online

The settlement looks like it was for the daughter... the ex-wife being the guardian was able to go after the money because of her legal role.

He could have tied it up in court for years with the goal of having the money put in a trust for his daughter... Even if the ex-wife was a trustee, the husband could probably get another trustee assigned to look out for the interest of the daughter.

The daughter has to be about 13. Not sure of the laws in Britain... but he might even be able to challenge her in court and go after custody. At a minimum, he could probably move the settlement date out to a time when the daughter was considered an adult and control her own money.
__________________
chinaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 07:48 AM   #96
Recycles dryer sheets
keegs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: In a van down by the river
Posts: 407
__________________
keegs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 09:34 AM   #97
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
growing_older's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,608
Quote:
the determining factor is confidence in the decision/relationship and making a commitment.
This, for me, is the aspect where my personal experience interferes. I was in a committed relationship that I could not have been more confident of. We both appeared as deeply committed as I can ever imagine. Until she decided that she wasn't. I suspect I will always be concerned that no matter how well I know someone and how committed we appear to be, I will remain vulnerable to such a change in the future. Makes defensive attitudes seem wise and difficult to imagine dropping that guard.
__________________
growing_older is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 10:16 AM   #98
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,133
I could write a book on the subject of divorce. I went through 15 years of bitter litigation. When I left #1 she kept all the assets except my future earning potential. Over the years she got a big piece of this too(maybe 15%). She has not worked since well before the divorce-why would she. The law and court precedent are terribly stacked against men in Canada. Still in the end I realized that however much money I gave her she would never be happy and I could not be happier. Furthermore against all odds my new wife and I have a wonderful relationship with my daughter who has turned out to be an impressive young woman. So am I anti marriage? So far batting 500. No prenup on #2. She supported me in our early days together and is a wealthy woman in her own right but still one must be very careful. There are certainly alimony/child support trolls out there.
__________________
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 10:19 AM   #99
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,526
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R View Post
That's probably why I haven't heard of any divorced women that I know, getting alimony. Most are women with advanced degrees and careers, and earning decent salaries.
I imagine the divorcing woman with advanced degrees and who is career oriented wouldn't receive much in the way of alimony or spousal support since her earnings would be in the ball park of her husband's.

However a lot of divorcing women don't fit those criteria. Taking time off from work to have children and raise children will hurt earning potential and make the husband's salary much higher in comparison (in general). For whatever reason, women also tend to earn less than men for the same work, all other things being equal (per the feminist research at least). Then there is the societal pressure for men to be the breadwinners and have the dominant income earning role in a relationship. Disparities in income make spousal support awards much more likely.

And another big factor is child support. I can't say that I have ever known of a woman having to pay her ex husband (or baby daddy as the case may be) child support. Like spousal support/alimony, child support awards and structures vary by state. In my state, however, child support awards are essentially set by statute based on earnings of each ex-spouse and can be very high for high income earners regardless of how much you previously spent on raising children. For LBYM couples, the child support payments could easily exceed what you were spending for an entire family's expenses in some situations.

The smartest move a devious woman could make would be to have a whole bunch of children with a high income man. Then leave his a$$ and collect a ton of child support (and maybe alimony). In our state, child support obligations cannot be affected by premarital agreements. The only defense to punitive child support payments is to have both ex-spouses working and earning roughly the same amount, and seek joint custody of the kids. Otherwise a non-working spouse has a financial "put" that can be exercised against the working spouse should the non-working spouse tire of the relationship (or just want to pursue other interests).
__________________
Retired in 2013 at age 33. Keeping busy reading, blogging, relaxing, gaming, and enjoying the outdoors with my wife and 3 kids (5, 11, and 12).
FUEGO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2010, 10:28 AM   #100
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,878
Quote:
Originally Posted by growing_older View Post
This, for me, is the aspect where my personal experience interferes. I was in a committed relationship that I could not have been more confident of. We both appeared as deeply committed as I can ever imagine. Until she decided that she wasn't. I suspect I will always be concerned that no matter how well I know someone and how committed we appear to be, I will remain vulnerable to such a change in the future. Makes defensive attitudes seem wise and difficult to imagine dropping that guard.
+1. It is difficult to read the smug posts of those that have a long term relationship and attribute it to their own skill. As they say, it takes two to make a marriage, but only one to end it.
__________________

__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Heart Case Purron Other topics 18 09-08-2010 04:05 PM
The Case against Retirement MasterBlaster FIRE and Money 147 01-07-2010 07:46 PM
what's in your vitamin case? cube_rat Health and Early Retirement 31 12-06-2006 03:48 PM
in case you're interested Khan Other topics 0 08-30-2006 09:38 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:07 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.