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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 11:43 AM   #101
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Late to the commentary, but here goes:
I was a very skinny kid, and DH wrestled at 114 in High School. We have gained 5 lbs a year for the 13 years we've been married. We now weigh around 200 at 5'9" each. We started seeing a personal trainer 2x a week within the last 6 months. My strength and endurance have improved, and my eating habits have improved. It is extremely expensive, though, and I wouldn't do it if my boss didn't pay for it (he's a fitness freak & runner). We just pay for DH's portion, which is still a lot (to us).

I am disciplined and organized in every other aspect of my life: finance, household, relationships, whatever. But the diet/exercise problem is the first thing I've not been able to fight by myself. I have 60 lbs to lose, and I just hope it won't take 13 years to take it off. There is nothing easy about this; and it takes intelligence and determination to make the good choices everyday that healthy living requires.

I'm sure that most of the obese people in this country do not have access this kind of information/training. So if I have struggles even with expensive training and a sharp eye for labels, I don't know how we plan to just say "You can do it" to the obese in this country and hope for personal responsibility. Even having cut my philosophical teeth on Ayn Rand, I have seen just how tough it can be to make the changes necessary to lose the weight.

And, yeah, I quit a pack a day smoking habit a few years ago--it sucked, but nothing like the ongoing struggle that is weight loss, like Martha and Astro pointed out so aptly. You can't just put down food.
Sarah
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 12:03 PM   #102
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
And, yeah, I quit a pack a day smoking habit a few years ago--it sucked, but nothing like the ongoing struggle that is weight loss, like Martha and Astro pointed out so aptly. You can't just put down food.
Sarah
You GO Girl!!!!!!! Thanks for sharing your personal story and the VERY best of luck to you.
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 12:40 PM   #103
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Rush Limbaugh..'s always been a great advocate of personal responsibility
.. good one, jeff!

let's retire: I didn't "find" my setpoint; it found me!

You admit that you have to keep working to maintain the equilibrium where you want it to be. Good for you! I personally feel like I'm in a foam boat with a hole in it; 3" out of the water and poking along. To stay 4" out of the water, I'd have to keep bailing constantly, as you do, for the rest of my life.

donheff is right when he points out that usually the people who criticize those who are overweight are by and large those who don't have much trouble staying within the "norm". (No one has yet mentioned that the "ideal" body form has changed significantly over time.) Thanks, don *, for admitting that your skinniness is not due to your superior self-control and overall splendidness and resolve as a human being as opposed to us slobs!! *I dated a skinny guy (120 lbs.) who desperately wanted to bulk up and ate exclusively cheeseburgers and chocolate milkshakes with no result. 25 years later, he's still 120 lbs.

Eagle43, you crack me up... While you're right that certain idiots people want to play victim, that's true for a lot of other things besides weight and isn't really indicative of this problem in particular. From my side of the aisle, I see a lot of heavy people really trying hard and really suffering despite their best efforts. It's not something you can will away. You have you play with the hand that's dealt you, and we are not all dealt the same hand. Fat-bashing is just one of the last refuges of the self-satisfied, red-blooded, un-PC crowd now that making fun of nappy hair is outré.

I don't expect others to "give me self-esteem" on a silver platter; I DO expect them to be tolerant/neutral and not to be subjected to "Look at the bowling ball! Watch her roll down the street!" as I was for much of my adolescence. Just say to yourself, "there but for the Grace of God go I."

I don't "pig out", by choice or otherwise, and as I demonstrated above, I eat (naturally, without paying attention one way or the other) curiously EXACTly the number of calories to maintain myself day in, day out, year in, year out, at this exact weight. The times when, through stress or extreme periods of activity, my weight has gone down, it imperceptibly and inexorably creeps back up to this point, but not beyond.

Until they come up with a drug or gene therapy I don't think this issue is entirely resolvable.

But, that said.. all props to mclesters for her hard work (and admitting that it's not going to be an easy road, nor accessible to just anyone)! Take it slow and steady, though.. from everything I've read, the more moderately you take off the weight the more likely it is to stay off.

Now can we talk about tall/short folks and why women's clothes are so wack?? Department stores are phasing out "petite"sections (clothes tailored for women 5'4" and under). Notice to Corporate America: the AVERAGE height of American women is.. 5'4"!! Just dump 1/2 your market in the toilet, why don't you?? No one ghettoizes men who have a 33" sleeve, and they can choose from a variety of inseams.. why not us?

I happened to notice on a recent plane flight a preponderance of tall people in first class. Guess being taller should be also on my list of personal things to achieve à la Ayn Rand.* Mind over matter, as my mom always says!!
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 01:04 PM   #104
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaHa
Since you addressed this personally to me I will answer it personally. Ha
I would never pick on someone who is older (?) than me.* And possibly wiser?* 8)
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 01:13 PM   #105
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Originally Posted by donheff
People to whom success comes easily (in any endeavor) should not be self righteous about how they compare to others who struggle and fail.* They haven't earned that right.* *
Well said.

I have a five year old grandson who is afflicted with cerebral palsey due to asphyxiation during childbirth. *Now that I am fortunate enough to have reached FIRE while I'm still young enough to walk and talk, I spend two one-half days a week with him. *It's been a real education.

For the first time in my life I understand that people have differences that are not always due to personal traits they can just "will away" or overcome with "determination" or "will power" or "discipline." *Little youbet IV is cognitively up to snuff but lacks muscle control and development that hampers physical activity and speech. *And he learns more slowly because some brain input channels aren't working.

After spending many hours with him at Easter Seals and practicing life skills at home, you begin to become aware that the playing field at birth is not level. *And yes, sometimes a little tough love is appropriate as a motivator. *But to those of you who think you are something special because you got lucky with genes and with the birth process, think again. *You had nothing to do with it and are just a fortunate benefactor. *

Listening to folks on the "lucky list" gloat as though they personally designed themselves pre-birth is a hoot! *

*
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 01:34 PM   #106
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Re: The obesity epidemic

When I was 18 I weighed 159 and tried without success to gain six pounds (was trying to bulk up but still "make weight" on a crew team). I am 37 now. I weighed myself yesterday and came in at 197 without my shoes on. It was certainly easier to put on the last six pounds. I notice a few differences between now and then:

1. I will eat now when I am not hungry.
2. I will order a meal at a restaurant based on what I usually order, and not on how hungry I am. (I will then eat said usual order by virtue of difference #1).
3. What Wendy's used to call a "Biggie" is now their "Large", their old "Large" is now their "Medium", their old "Medium" is now their "Small", and their old "Small" is now...oh, I don't remember, I ordered a #2 combo meal large with a Sierra Mist. (Refer back to difference #2).

The right weight for me is probably about 170-175.

2Cor521
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 01:59 PM   #107
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martha
I am too personally wound up about this.* Azanon says this isn't real life.* I treat it like it is.* So I am taking a break for a while.*
Like probably most of us, i am very fond of Martha just so there aren't any doubts.* I know she knows this since i've told her exactly that in a pm a week or so ago.* No reciprocation on her part required either, because i'd like her anyway.
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 03:51 PM   #108
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Re: The obesity epidemic

The biggest explosion in obesity is among CHILDREN. Obviously, our obesity today is a cultural and environmental disease. To me this clearly takes a big chunk of "personal responsibility" off the table as the thing people just "need more of".

Don't help adults who "should" help themselves - fine! But the kids are in even worse shape, and you can't just blame the kids IMO!

(And we know the list of environmental problems is long:
unbelievable amount of marketing of nutritionally poor foods directly to kids
sugar in EVERYTHING
bad food in schools (including vending machines)
drastically reduced PE in schools
kids on computers, TV, video games all day
not safe to play outside
and on, and on, and on...)

Personally I think Americans try to do too much, and work too much - busy earning money to pay for "stuff". Really high work hours plus longer and longer commutes. And they keep their kids super busy too. This leaves little personal time to prepare healthy meals and exercise. So forget the exercise (no time), drive by the fast food place (no time), don't get enough sleep, etc., etc.

Many haggard (and unhealthy) folks I know are very proud to be so busy - like living your life in a crazy whirlwind where you have no time to actually take care of yourself is somehow superior. That being crazy busy somehow makes you more important. That people should burn the candle at both ends. This is another cultural sickness IMO.

Audrey
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 04:09 PM   #109
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
bad food in schools (including vending machines)
drastically reduced PE in schools
kids on computers, TV, video games all day
not safe to play outside
and on, and on, and on...)

Yes, the school lunches are more government subsidized garbage…..There was a program on ABC with Peter Jennings awhile back with him haranguing the US Secretary of Health on the corn subsidy (as Nords pointed out earlier in the thread)....they pointed out all of the calories in pop from corn syrup and the butter flavor on pop corn with more corn syrup and why the government didnt subsidize more stuff that was good on the food pyramid...but it is how our political system works....politicians from alaska (or wherever) scratching the back of Iowa politicians and other corn growing states to get something they want.....
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 04:33 PM   #110
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Originally Posted by audreyh1
The biggest explosion in obesity is among CHILDREN. Obviously, our obesity today is a cultural and environmental disease. To me this clearly takes a big chunk of "personal responsibility" off the table as the thing people just "need more of".

Audrey
True, you can't blame the child for being obese, but the parents bear some responsibility to make sure they eat right and get some exercise. I know my wife and I take our responsibility pretty seriously. I feel sorry for the kids who have parents that feed them junk.
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 06:12 PM   #111
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Re: The obesity epidemic

What do you all think of an obese person who get an operation to reduce the size of their stomach to lose weight?
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 06:45 PM   #112
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Re: The obesity epidemic

i went from being under weight my entire life to being over weight at age 35. A healthy eating plan and working out every day for the last 6 years has left me in whats probley the best shape of my life.

Heres what i found ,1st off there are very few people who actually are heavy because of a glandular or chemical imbalance. The fact is not only does our metabolisium slow down as we age but most heavy people doom themselves by dieting,burning muscle as well as fat and with the muscle loss they slow their metabolisium even more.

To be successful muscle must be replaced and built up,no short cuts here. IT TAKES ALOT OF EFFORT AND HARD WORK TO KEEP THE WEIGHT OFF.
I dont see that effort really put in at the gym. People come and go in literally weeks.

They go back looking for that magic pill or diet and the truth is it dosnt exist.
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 07:01 PM   #113
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Way late to this, but I'd like to share:

DW has always struggled with her weight, she's about 40 lbs over, and once we got married, I shot up quickly. *At our worst I was about 60 lbs overweight and she was almost 100! *I didn't even realize I had a problem, I was still looking in the mirror saying, "You da MAN! *How do the ladies resist you". Finally an old friend confronted me and told me the direction we were heading in a bad direction quickly.

I'm now at my ideal weight, working out, doing pretty well, and while it wasn't fun, I didn't find it hard. *DW has struggled big time, she got back to the 40 number, but just can't break through. *She is amazing, got her Masters in Science, has her own consulting business from home, raising our daughter, is a facilitator at the University where she got her Graduate Degree, manages our finances...on and on. *I am a lazy slob, yet somehow I have the "discipline" to lose weight. *My only insight is I also drank a lot in college, did some other things, smoked cigarretes when I drank (especially in bars), yet somehow never got hooked on anything. *I've got to think there is something genetic involved. *Maybe something to do with self esteem (for example, anything that was supposed to put you in a good mood seemed redundant to me, so that "feel good" effect of food may not hold sway). *

As far as rugged individualism vs. great society....well, I may have leaned a bit towards the former until my daughter was born. *As many of you know, she has Down Syndrome and a heart defect. *We were lost and devestated when this hit us. *But we've come so far and so much of what has helped us was public programs and support groups that are paid for by "your tax dollars". *And these programs have helped so many people like her eventually move out, get jobs, pay the rent, and make society stronger. *So if a program that helps people lose weight, get off of drugs, get a kid out of poverty and off to college instead of jail etc. uses "your tax dollars", aren't they just saving more of "your tax dollars" in the future? *Moreover, don't we want to be better than an organized version of "law of the jungle"? *
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 07:21 PM   #114
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Re: The obesity epidemic

After so many years i have to admit my wife and i hate the gym, we hate devoting an hour a day of our roughly 2 spare hours of time after work . In fact ill bet we already put in more time exercising than the exercise extended our lives.

But the point is we had to make it part of our lives if we were not going to continue on our path to obsesity. We dont have the time to do this but we make the time and its at the expense of more pleasurable things that we would rather do.

The good news is the cardio part lets us eat anything and everything. We eat all kinds of goodies on the weekend. On the days i run 5 miles i can easily eat 4,000 calories now and its barely a blip,i dont even get full i just get tired eating
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 07:58 PM   #115
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Re: The obesity epidemic

My DW & I are runners. We run 25-30 miles/week plus we also walk an extra 10 miles/week. We also run one Marathon per year. To do all this we exercise about 45 mins/day. We enjoy our running & walking, so we have been doing this for over 15 years. It's our "quality time".
We try to eat healthy by cutting down on fats. We don't do portion control, so we pretty much eat all we want. They have low-fat version of many foods that taste almost the same as the fat-laden version.
My suggestion to people trying to lose weight is try to find an activity that you enjoy and try to make that a key part of your life. Also watch the diet. I know it’s out of vogue, but I’m a fan of the “classic low fat diet”.
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 08:01 PM   #116
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Re: The obesity epidemic

OK, I just flipped from page 2 or 3 to the last page of this thread, and all of a sudden it went from people verbally abusing each other to death, needing to take a break form the boards, and heated criticism of philosophical and political attitudes, to heart-warming stories of personal and family triumphs.

I didn't think that could happen?
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 08:38 PM   #117
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool Dood
OK, I just flipped from page 2 or 3 to the last page of this thread, and all of a sudden it went from people verbally abusing each other to death, needing to take a break form the boards, and heated criticism of philosophical and political attitudes, to heart-warming stories of personal and family triumphs.

I didn't think that could happen?
Kind of like reversing entropy, isn't it? Goes against the laws of physics!
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 08:44 PM   #118
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Yes, good old-fashioned American willpower works! * Well, it works 5% of the time. *Something like 95% of people who try to lose weight via diet and exercise gain all the weight back after a few years.

So, given that we know willpower doesn't work, and we know Americans have a growing obesity problem, what are we going to do about it?

How do you make an entire country move more and eat less?

Nobody seems to like the idea of a fat tax for some reason. * What, specifically, is wrong with the idea of making high-calorie low-nutrient foods more expensive, and using the tax to subsidize healthier foods like fruits and veggies?
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 09:04 PM   #119
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Re: The obesity epidemic

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Originally Posted by TromboneAl
I had dinner with a bunch of friends and acquaintances at a higher class all you can eat Chinese restaurant. One of the men there was *extremely* obese. When he returns from his first trip to the food, he has two plates instead of one, and each is piled high with deep-fried items. He also got a big bowl of some kind of sauce that he dipped the egg rolls in.

He has a nice wife (moderately overweight), and a cute and intelligent 12-year-old daughter that looks up to him. At one point he said something like "I'll be 50 in a few months, if I make it."

What the heck is this guy thinking? Is he ignorant? Committing suicide??

I am sure that some people are obese because of some medical condition, but I will never forget the image of that guy's two plates of heart attack.
I think that the number of obese people in the world equal or exceed the starving people for the first time in history.

http://health.iafrica.com/healthnews/924288.htm

Maybe this is natures way of saying there are too many people in the world. Nature does not like excess in any form.

The world population is about 6.6 Billion now and estimated to be 10 billion in 2050.

In my travels I am amazed at the over weight people. At this point I'm not sure if the reasons mean anything or will help to find a solution.

Again, as I was traveling, in Las Vegas specifically a thought came to mind. I imagined, Hitler, HiroHito, Mosiline, Stalin, and Castro walking through the streets and casionos of Las Vega. The people are as they are now, shabbily dressed, overweight, and looking poor. The great dictators of past can only wonder. "How did we lose to these peope?"

This is not just a problem in the USA - it is happening in INDIA!
http://tinyurl.com/mhvlk

Please excuse the poor spelling.
Thanks
Dex


EDIT: Shortened URL
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Re: The obesity epidemic
Old 09-29-2006, 09:32 PM   #120
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Re: The obesity epidemic

Quote:
Originally Posted by wab
Yes, good old-fashioned American willpower works! Well, it works 5% of the time. Something like 95% of people who try to lose weight via diet and exercise gain all the weight back after a few years.

So, given that we know willpower doesn't work,
Whoa........it's lack of willpower that doesn't work. I think that was the point of dmpi and mathjak's posts. Losing weight is not easy; that's why many people fail. Many people accept being 20 or 30 lbs overweight. I have. I'm OK with it. When I feel like running 10Ks and half marathons again, I will have to lose some weight to enjoy that type of activity. Everyone has their level of fatness that they are willing to accept. For me it's 20 to 30 lbs, right now. For my brothers it's 50 to 80 lbs. For my stepfather it is 150 lbs. I have talked to them about weight before and they say they can lose it but they would rather eat, drink and be merry. I'm OK with that.
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