The price you pay for your success-observations

[Chuckanut]

Marko's neighbor made me think of a woman we met on vacation last year. She was going on at great length about all the things government should do for people, and DW asked her how those new services would get paid for.



Her response just floored us: "Don't you understand? The government has unlimited money!"



This was from a woman who has a well-paid job at a college.

I used to work with a fellow who was constantly criticizing the government for spending to much. He had six kids in the public school system. Who did he think was causing all that government spending?

 

[prudent_one]

I have since recruited my gardening buddy to be my "Elf" to give out small amounts to that mature person struggling to pay for all of their groceries or the waitress at Denny's who is going back to school. He goes to the Salvation Army to visit a friend who w*rks there and has already paid for a few small purchases.
He does the good deeds for me and tells me afterwards. He's having a blast doing this.

I have become my own "elf" in a way. Had a couple awkward situations where people told others that we did something nice for them (and I know they meant no harm).

Now when we want to help someone directly I either get a prepaid Visa or cash, and when delivering it I just say "I was asked to get this to you and not disclose who it was."

It's truthful - my wife and I discuss if we're going to help, if we agree then she tells me to give them the money and not tell them the source.

 

[ERD50]

I used to work with a fellow who was constantly criticizing the government for spending to much. He had six kids in the public school system. Who did he think was causing all that government spending?

Good example of how messed up our tax system is. Each of those children are a tax deduction, yet, they create extra government expenses. I don't understand why children are tax deductible (and I have kids, so I'm not coming from that angle). If we are going to use 'income' as the measure of taxes paid, then pay based on your income. Having kids or not is your business.

-ERD50

 

[freebird5825]

I have become my own "elf" in a way. Had a couple awkward situations where people told others that we did something nice for them (and I know they meant no harm).

Now when we want to help someone directly I either get a prepaid Visa or cash, and when delivering it I just say "I was asked to get this to you and not disclose who it was."

It's truthful - my wife and I discuss if we're going to help, if we agree then she tells me to give them the money and not tell them the source.

"Elf"-ing is a good thing to do. Instead of writing a blanket check to god-knows-where or god-knows-who, it's fun to have a trusted buddy who "Elfs" for you.

Generosity is a blessed thing. Carry on, friend.

I got "Elf"-ed many times in my younger years, struggling for bucks but w*rking my butt off for a higher goal. It's all good.

 

[427Vette]

Wait a minute... You can get contractors to "ARRIVE"?
I rarely get anything but an answering machine when I call a contractor. And even then, rare is the return call. And it seems less than half that I actually talk to come out for an estimate.
I've often wondered if I've been blackballed. I've never outright told them I have an opinion of them somewhere in the range of used car salesmen and members of congress, but maybe they sense I'm thinking it.
My apologies to FIRE'd contractors out there, leave me a message and I'll get back to you to discuss.

Being a contractor in a skilled trade I may be able to offer an explanation as to why some contractors do the things they do. You never want to tell a contractor that you are getting several bids or estimates. This is huge turn off, simply say that you are thinking of doing a project and are looking for a professional to do the job. Why would I want to come out and educate you on how your project needs to be done, share my ideas, spend all of the time to properly estimate the job, put it in a form that you can understand, then present it to you when you have already done this wasting the time of numerous other people? If I feel like I have a legitimate chance at getting the job and the customer doesn't talk down to me like I am a used car salesman or a member of congress I will do whatever I can to get the job.

My business has been thriving since I started 17 years ago. I still find it amazing how busy I am every day. One day recently I had 87 phone calls on my cell phone. We are a small company and I still where my tool belt every day. If my phone rings that many times of course I don't have time to answer it and still be productive. If you combine the amount of calls with all of the other hats I have to where (accountant, bill collector, estimator, project manager, engineer, equipment mechanic, parts delivery etc.) its difficult to cater to everyone's needs; so I find myself taking care of the low maintenance customers first. If you call a contractor and he doesn't get back to you right away he may be just that busy or you fall into the high maintenance category.

Another way to increase your chances of getting a contractor to come out is to ask him when it works for him. This might require you to have a little flexibility. He might not bother to call you back if you want to meet up after supper when it's convenient for you. Keep in mind that he probably started at 5:00 am worked his tail off all day in the outdoor elements and might just want to go home, shower and eat rather than be all smiles for you until 8:00 that night.

I know from a consumer standpoint (especially ER forum members) it makes sense to price shop. However, from a contractors standpoint there is nothing more annoying than someone getting numerous bids on $200.00 job. I have had this happen to me several times. This is the type of project that you need to find someone you can trust by asking your friends, neighbors, coworkers, the guy at the hardware store, or whoever who they can recommend and just have them do the job.

In an earlier post someone mentioned how much money they have saved in their semi-ER by obtaining several contractor bids for each of their projects. This got me to thinking on how much I could lower my prices if I didn't have to waste countless hours, pay office staff, pay for fuel, have an estimating program. etc. etc. etc. just to do estimates. So, I basically have to charge more to cover the elevated expenses therefore everyone pays a higher price because a few need extra services. Kind of has a governmental type ring to it!

I cant say whether a contractor would change his pricing in an upscale neighborhood. It would be hard to compare cost of a similar projects in a lower class area because of the different challenges of each project. I think this is more of an emotional feeling. I wanted to charge one woman a little extra a while back when I was doing a project for her. I was working in her house in an upscale neighborhood, when she got home from work she walked in and asked if it was normal for "you people" to park in the driveway! Apparently she had to park on the street because I was parked in her way. I didn't bother to answer her and didn't charge her any extra.

I feel better now!

 

[freebird5825]

Being a contractor in a skilled trade I may be able to offer an explanation as to why some contractors do the things they do. You never want to tell a contractor that you are getting several bids or estimates. This is huge turn off, simply say that you are thinking of doing a project and are looking for a professional to do the job. Why would I want to come out and educate you on how your project needs to be done, share my ideas, spend all of the time to properly estimate the job, put it in a form that you can understand, then present it to you when you have already done this wasting the time of numerous other people? If I feel like I have a legitimate chance at getting the job and the customer doesn't talk down to me like I am a used car salesman or a member of congress I will do whatever I can to get the job.

My business has been thriving since I started 17 years ago. I still find it amazing how busy I am every day. One day recently I had 87 phone calls on my cell phone. We are a small company and I still where my tool belt every day. If my phone rings that many times of course I don't have time to answer it and still be productive. If you combine the amount of calls with all of the other hats I have to where (accountant, bill collector, estimator, project manager, engineer, equipment mechanic, parts delivery etc.) its difficult to cater to everyone's needs; so I find myself taking care of the low maintenance customers first. If you call a contractor and he doesn't get back to you right away he may be just that busy or you fall into the high maintenance category.

Another way to increase your chances of getting a contractor to come out is to ask him when it works for him. This might require you to have a little flexibility. He might not bother to call you back if you want to meet up after supper when it's convenient for you. Keep in mind that he probably started at 5:00 am worked his tail off all day in the outdoor elements and might just want to go home, shower and eat rather than be all smiles for you until 8:00 that night.

I know from a consumer standpoint (especially ER forum members) it makes sense to price shop. However, from a contractors standpoint there is nothing more annoying than someone getting numerous bids on $200.00 job. I have had this happen to me several times. This is the type of project that you need to find someone you can trust by asking your friends, neighbors, coworkers, the guy at the hardware store, or whoever who they can recommend and just have them do the job.

In an earlier post someone mentioned how much money they have saved in their semi-ER by obtaining several contractor bids for each of their projects. This got me to thinking on how much I could lower my prices if I didn't have to waste countless hours, pay office staff, pay for fuel, have an estimating program. etc. etc. etc. just to do estimates. So, I basically have to charge more to cover the elevated expenses therefore everyone pays a higher price because a few need extra services. Kind of has a governmental type ring to it!

I cant say whether a contractor would change his pricing in an upscale neighborhood. It would be hard to compare cost of a similar projects in a lower class area because of the different challenges of each project. I think this is more of an emotional feeling. I wanted to charge one woman a little extra a while back when I was doing a project for her. I was working in her house in an upscale neighborhood, when she got home from work she walked in and asked if it was normal for "you people" to park in the driveway! Apparently she had to park on the street because I was parked in her way. I didn't bother to answer her and didn't charge her any extra.

I feel better now!

+ 1,000,000 and then some...


I have 2 trusted contractors who give me a fair price.

I do not jerk them around, ever. Time is money, after all.

 

[davemartin88]

I know from a consumer standpoint (especially ER forum members) it makes sense to price shop. However, from a contractors standpoint there is nothing more annoying than someone getting numerous bids on $200.00 job. I have had this happen to me several times. This is the type of project that you need to find someone you can trust by asking your friends, neighbors, coworkers, the guy at the hardware store, or whoever who they can recommend and just have them do the job.

I feel better now!

Thanks, some good points. I think price shopping for small jobs is a real turn off for a lot of small contractors- we live in a rural area and travel time alone between jobs can make a big difference on a small job.

We're building a house for in-laws and I'm planning to use a couple of the contractors who did work on the guest cabin we built last year. Yesterday at lunch time, I left voice mails for the drywall, HVAC, and insulation guys that we were to the point where the house had walls framed so anytime they wanted to stop by to give me an estimate, it would be appreciated. 2 of the 3 were there yesterday afternoon and gave me what I consider reasonable estimates so they got the jobs. I kidded them about how slow they must be since they got here so fast and I must have over payed last time! One started explaining their business and costs to me and I had to tell him I was kidding after I listened to enough to feel his prices were in fact reasonable.

I think flexibility in scheduling can be a key for getting a contractor out to give you an estimate, since I'm retired, it's pretty easy for me to be the one to give a little on timing. As for raising the price for the neighborhood, I guess it might happen but I never did that when I had my part time business.

To the OP- I've really never run in to situations where I received comments about how lucky I was to be retired or how rich I might be- maybe they think it but the most common response was "good for you" or "I wish I was in that position".

 

[JoeWras]

I feel better now!

And I feel better too!

You would have liked me as a customer. A $425 job and I took his offer on the spot, and he started work on the spot. All around we were happy.

I may have "overpaid", but so far I'm happy. He's happy. Etc.

However, on projects north of $2k, you can be sure I will get more estimates.

 

[HFWR]

Being a contractor... <snip>

I feel better now!

Just be thankful you're not a FA...

 

[MooreBonds]

We went with a company that had honest prices upfront and tipped the workers several hundred dollars extra as they did such a nice job, even on all sorts of extras that weren't in the contract.

So were the workers also the owners? Sounds like you tipped employees to do extra work for you that they didn't charge you for - but if that was the case, you ended up shortchanging the owners! Not fair at all to the business owners....unless the workers stayed late on their own time and didn't charge the business owner for time and used their own personal materials (which I doubt).

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Being a contractor in a skilled trade I may be able to offer an explanation as to why some contractors do the things they do. You never want to tell a contractor that you are getting several bids or estimates. This is huge turn off, simply say that you are thinking of doing a project and are looking for a professional to do the job. Why would I want to come out and educate you on how your project needs to be done, share my ideas, spend all of the time to properly estimate the job, put it in a form that you can understand, then present it to you when you have already done this wasting the time of numerous other people? If I feel like I have a legitimate chance at getting the job and the customer doesn't talk down to me like I am a used car salesman or a member of congress I will do whatever I can to get the job.

The dry rot repairs per my previous post were in various places throughout our house, some on the second story, so the bids ranged from $3.5K to over $8K. There is no way I would get one bid. It might have been the $8K bid. Plus a couple of contractors were not just expensive, they were outright shysters - telling us we needed extensive work done when we had already had a structural pest report completed by a licensed pest company and were just getting bids on the work. One contractor told us we had termites based on some peeling paint on a part of the house that was stucco. That was interesting because I had never heard of stucco termites before.

I agree on not getting bids for $200 worth of work. That is not what I was referring to. We usually do around one big project a year, like replacing the fence, remodeling a bathroom or a new roof, and that is where we get the competing bids, not on handyman type work. The difference from high to low bids is often several thousand dollars or more. We also check Yelp reviews, Consumer's Checkbook, the BBB, a local ratings company and factor in ratings, complaints, years in business, BBB grade, BBB membership, etc.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

So were the workers also the owners? Sounds like you tipped employees to do extra work for you that they didn't charge you for - but if that was the case, you ended up shortchanging the owners! Not fair at all to the business owners....unless the workers stayed late on their own time and didn't charge the business owner for time and used their own personal materials (which I doubt).

We didn't ask them to do the extra work. They weren't expecting any extra pay or any tip. They were just a company that had great reviews online for providing quality service. The workers were very conscientious. We gave them a nice tip and called the owner and told him what a nice job they did and how they took care of all the little odds and ends. If you think that is a bad thing I guess that is your choice.

 

[Meadbh]

I bought my first house shortly after I started my medical practice. One piece of advice that my professional partnership gave me was not to identify myself as a physician when buying a vehicle or seeking estimates from contractors, as seeing "MD" could jack up the price. Fortunately, the partnership kept a list of good contractors based on referrals.

 

[Dash man]

This past year we spent about $60K on a major landscaping makeover and repair. It included demolition of a raised paver patio put in 12 years ago by a low bid contractor. These guys weren't cheap, but I feel much more confident they did it right. I also appreciated how they did try to keep the cost down where they could.

 

[marko]

I bought my first house shortly after I started my medical practice. One piece of advice that my professional partnership gave me was not to identify myself as a physician when buying a vehicle or seeking estimates from contractors, as seeing "MD" could jack up the price. Fortunately, the partnership kept a list of good contractors based on referrals.

We have a lot of that happen on house sales in these parts. If the seller knew that the real person interested was some notable celebrity/athlete/wealthy person the price would've gone up considerably.

So usually a dummy corporation, or straw-person (usually the lawyer) will buy the place and either re-sell it to the person or it is held by the corporation for a while.

Also one of the reasons that 'quiet money' likes to stay that way.

 

[aja8888]

We have used the same roofing contractor for four replacement roofs on family homes over the last 5 years. He specializes in just doing replacements and don't mess with new construction. The reasons we chose him (not the lowest bidder) the first time were:

1. He is very professional and provided a quote and material spec that was exactly what we asked for.

2. His crew is timely, does good work, cleans up after each day.

3. He is a member of the BBB (the only roofing contractor I found that was around these parts).

4. He informed me that as a veteran, I can get a $300 check from GAF if I use their shingles (which I was going to anyway). He also provided the GAF submission form and filled out his parts.

5. When I call or e-mail him, he is prompt in returning the request.

6. He personally inspects the job after the crew is done.

I don't use contractors often as I do a lot of my own work, but when you find one that does a good, quality job and you are thrilled, stick with him.

 

[robnplunder]

Back to the OP ... I'd rather be financially successful and have the problems you mentioned than still trying to be FI .