The Recession & our Adult children

[MichaelB]

This is the 2nd time in 2 days I heard this stated, assuming home ownership is a USA thing only. Even back in 1977 in England when we graduated, the first thing we did along with all of our fellow graduates was to buy a house (at age 22, 90% mortgage).

My intention was to point out the debt incurred before graduation, combined with the additional obligation from a mortgage. No desire to exclude other worthy candidates. Maybe it’s a anglo-saxon thing. Of course, UK students don’t pay nearly the price for college.

Prediction: A huge spike in the number of masters degrees awarded in 2011.

If only you could predict the stock markets with the same likelihood.

 

[Alan]

My intention was to point out the debt incurred before graduation, combined with the additional obligation from a mortgage. No desire to exclude other worthy candidates. Maybe it’s a anglo-saxon thing. Of course, UK students don’t pay nearly the price for college.

It has changed a lot since our days but I'm sure the US is still a lot more expensive to go to college than the UK.

Having said that, our son's college was very inexpensive because Louisiana has (had?) a similar program in place to what we had when we went to college in England. His ACT scores were high enough and he went to an in-state university so all his fees were paid plus he received a book allowance. His university then doubled that so that we never paid more than $100 per semester to cover all his lodging, food bills etc.

 

[Moemg]

Great replies everyone ,thank you !

 

[kumquat]

Since this thread seems to have died, I don't think I'm hijacking to ask another question.

If you expect to leave something to your kids, would you consider leaving it now rather than later? My kids are struggling now and I expect (according to FireCalc) that they will have quite a bit in [-]a few[/-] several years. By then, they won't need it.

Is anyone considering giving the kids an 'early inheritance'?

 

[TooFrugal]

These are extraordinary times right now.

Our kids are still at home but if they were adults, lost their jobs and needed help in times like this we would certainly let them move back home or help them out financially. If they were spendthrifts or couldn't hold jobs it would be one thing. Then a little tough love might be in order. But with the economy the way it is right now lots of otherwise hard working people simply can't find employment through no fault of their own.

 

[youbet]

Is anyone considering giving the kids an 'early inheritance'?

To the extent I can afford it and enjoy doing it, you bet. Having hardwood floors installed in their home, buying them a minivan when grandchild #3 came along and those sort of things seem to help them out and I get a kick out of doing it. So, why not?

 

[Texas Proud]

I will say what my sister has done... after graduation, both of her kids came back to live with her for 6 months... and one step child...

After that... no help...


Me.... I would say 'no help' unless there was something else that was in the equation... if they do not plan ahead for a layoff, then why should I fork over money to support them... but if they were laid off because of some kind of medical problem or accident... then I would probably help...

If there were grand kids... then I would make sure they had food...

 

[Orchidflower]

I vote for let them move back in and help them just enough so they have food and shelter. To help too much is to give them license to feel entitled, and not good for them at all. Also, I would expect them to act like members of the family and pitch in with working, cooking and so forth, AND to continue to look for work and dig themself out of their hole.
But I would help, because I know how hard it can be when you have absolutely no help at all myself. Isn't one of the purposes of family to help each other out or am I way off base here?
It seems to me that if you vote "Nothing they're adults" then the same should pertain to you. So, if you get Alzheimers or Cancer and need assistance, I guess your children should feel justified in shipping you off to a nursing home? After all, you're an adult. I don't get this thinking I guess. No wonder there are so many old and forgotten people in these homes.

 

[Moemg]

.
But I would help, because I know how hard it can be when you have absolutely no help at all myself. Isn't one of the purposes of family to help each other out or am I way off base here?

No, you are not off base . That is how it should work . Lately in Florida all I see are women in their 60's taking women in their 80's & 90 's places so I guess that concept it alive and well here .

 

[ziggy29]

Isn't one of the purposes of family to help each other out or am I way off base here?
It seems to me that if you vote "Nothing they're adults" then the same should pertain to you. So, if you get Alzheimers or Cancer and need assistance, I guess your children should feel justified in shipping you off to a nursing home? After all, you're an adult. I don't get this thinking I guess. No wonder there are so many old and forgotten people in these homes.

I think the temporary "times of plenty" in our economy and society created this change. But those times were an anomaly, a post-WW2 economic bubble that we kept trying to keep inflated with more and more debt until the house of cards collapsed.

In those times the "nuclear family" was pursued as the norm (which is a VERY financially inefficient way to live), and in the age of SS and pensions it was easier to assume your elderly parents were having their needs met without familial assistance.

I dare say the pendulum is swinging back in the other direction, though, as the house of cards keeps tumbling down. It may not hit in time for the 2010 Census, but I'll bet in 5-10 years you see a fairly significant increase in extended family household arrangements, a lot like many I saw in genealogical research I've seen by looking at Census data per-1930. I doubt it would reach those levels again, but looking at pure economics it's hard to bet against it making a partial comeback.

It's one of the several ways that many people, like it or not, will likely have to accept that the "new normalcy" is one of shedding a lot of the unsustainable excesses of the bubble decades.

 

[Texas Proud]

It seems to me that if you vote "Nothing they're adults" then the same should pertain to you. So, if you get Alzheimers or Cancer and need assistance, I guess your children should feel justified in shipping you off to a nursing home? After all, you're an adult. I don't get this thinking I guess. No wonder there are so many old and forgotten people in these homes.

NOOO... not the same.... the question was if they lost their job, what would you do... not if they had a medical problem... if my child had cancer or such, I would help them out all that I could...

Let's change it around.... if you are still working and you lose YOUR job, do you think that it is OK to move in with your children? After all, you are family.....

 

[Orchidflower]

Heck, yes, I would expect my child to assist me or allow me to move into his home if I needed the help. I would hope he would care for my welfare so much as I care for his.
Isn't one of the purposes of having a family and close friends is to have that soft cushion to fall back on when times are tough? Otherwise, what's the purpose of family or close friends? To have someone to brag to about your latest "triumph" in the business world? Big whoops.

 

[Bestwifeever]

I would have them move back home and provide food and shelter for them, without a doubt, should they lose their jobs and ask for help. They would do the same for us. I wouldn't give them money unless it went toward helping them find another job (airfare to an interview, or a class that would lead to certification, for example).

 

[Moemg]

Let's change it around.... if you are still working and you lose YOUR job, do you think that it is OK to move in with your children? After all, you are family.....

Absolutely and I am sure if you asked my daughter she would agree .

 

[Bestwifeever]

Heck, my daughter would love for me to move in right now and take care of her house

 

[WhoDaresWins]

recession and adult children

I have never discussed this with my son, but I am certain he would help me if I fell on hard times for some reason. And vice versa. And I feel this way about certain close friends and my aunt, too.

 

[Khan]

I would kill myself before I would move in with relatives.

 

[Moemg]

I would kill myself before I would move in with relatives.

You could move into my upstairs as long as you took care of the unwanted critters .

 

[Texas Proud]

I guess one of the omitted facts was 'when'....


If 'we' lost our jobs... we could probably last a pretty long time before we 'needed help'... our children less time...


Of course if my child lost their job... and looked for work... and could not find anything... after 6 months or so.. (remember, we taught them to have a 6 month pot of money).... then yes, I would probably let them come back while they 'got back on their feet'.... but then again, I would expect them to be looking much harder than they probably are... like the guy who was an energy trader who is working at a restaurant... they should go out and find some kind of job... there are jobs out there... just not great jobs...

 

[Orchidflower]

Listen, I probably understand the "tough it out, cause you're on your own" thing better than most having been a stepchild (in the worst sense of the word). You reap what you sow, and guess who didn't care at all when stepfather was sick and then died? What can I say? You reap what you sow.
So, when all the "tough love" types get old and need sonny or daughter's help, just remember your "tough love" philosophy.

...and we wonder why nursing homes are filled with old folks that are forgotten?

 

[dm]

I'm currently helping my son who is employed, but just isn't making much money in this economy. He is in sales and sales are down. I currently am paying his car insurance, liability only, phone, so he can call his mother, and I have paid for some maintenance on his car so he can make it to work and hopefully be safe. He is married and has a 2 year old at home. I have also made a few of his car payments, its a 96 Camry thats just about wore out.

So as long as I feel that he is trying his best, he works 6 days a week, and is not just blowing his money, I will be there to help them.

 

[WhoDaresWins]

I would kill myself before I would move in with relatives.

Oh, I agree with this sentiment entirely! In the vague land of "what if's" of worst case scenario, about to have to be homeless and have live in my car, etc., I know my aunt would be devasted if I didn't come to her for help. She would sincerely want me to live with her and be happy about the prospect even as she would sympathize with my misfortune. My son would help me, but his first preference would be to send me a check rather than reside with him. And he would do this without complaint. He would let me live with him if it HAD to be, but it would be with a long face, I can tell you that! I have grown to like living alone and I value my little domain, but I would gladly offer a spare room and my dining table to a handful of those nearest and dearest to me if they needed it. I would consider it a privilege to do so. I would be devasted if my son felt he couldn't ask me for help as I would wonder what kind of relationship we had. He never has, is very independent, but I am his mother after all and I would put my head on a chopping block for him!

 

[Orchidflower]

Ditto to statements by both of you.

 

[ziggy29]

Reading through this thread again, I'm starting to wonder how the species survived before the "nuclear family" became the default household arrangement. Seems we would have all killed ourselves and/or each other in an extended family arrangement which, for most of history, was either the norm or at least a very common arrangement.

 

[Orchidflower]

Some cultures still do the extended family arrangement AND arranged marriages. I know, because this has gone on in my own paternal (I'm a first generation) side being Greek...and, I hate to report this as I would never have done it, those darn marriages LAST forever thru thick, thin, cheating husbands and all. The women are just so naive they don't pick up on alot of their husband's...er...wandering. All's happy then...although I know more than one wife who gripes about the gambling those husband's do.