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Old 05-16-2012, 01:11 AM   #21
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As you can tell everybody...I am seriously aggravated. THIS TIME THEY HAVE GONE TOO FAR.
Deep breath. You don't want those guys with the black helicopters paying you a visit.

Might I suggest if you're living in the "deep south", that a water conditioner will help remove enough minerals from your water supply to make it easy to do your wash in a couple of gallons of water. The money you save on laundry detergent (and dish detergent, and soap, and shampoo, and on plumbing atherosclerosis) will pay back the cost of the water conditioner.

I've seen front loaders "supported" with plywood boxes or bricks. I think the advantage of their high-speed spin cycle (which practically dries the clothes) saves a lot of dryer time. Brownouts? Buy a $40 voltage conditioner off Amazon or an electronics store. We use that in place of an UPS on our computer. Works great.

But we use a traditional top-loader washer in our rental property because there's not enough space in the laundry room. We buy Kenmores off Craigslist for a few hundred bucks, and I suspect you'll find many acceptable used top-loaders off Craigslist for years to come... without those pesky governmental regulations.

Cheaper than buying a government-approved machine, too. Although it still might not protect from black helicopters.
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Old 05-16-2012, 07:16 AM   #22
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I'm wishing I had brought the 1979 Maytags with us when we moved to WV. They were still chugging along when we left.

This is not good news and we'll baby the ones we bought in 2002.
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Old 05-16-2012, 07:39 AM   #23
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We glanced briefly at front loaders - the height seemed to be largely a function of the expensive pedestal that must be bought for the washer to sit on. That set-up wouldn't fit in our laundry room, unless we removed the laundry cabinets above the washer and dryer. That said, we didn't see any practical advantage to a front-loading washing machine over a top-loader.

Amethyst
The pedestals aren't a "must". Unless some brands are different from when I bought my front loader in 2008, it's just to raise the opening to a more comfortable height. It doesn't bother me to bend down so I didn't get them, especially since the price was ridiculous.

I like my front loader. It uses less water and is more gentle on my clothes than the agitator kind. It takes more time but I don't do that many loads.

A lot of the front loaders had bad track records when I was buying (and still may), but my Samsung has been good. Luckily I have plenty of room for the larger washer. My brother had to take off the folding closet doors in his house. You have to keep the door open to avoid mold build up.

I agree that it sucks that the government mandated out the old washers.
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Old 05-16-2012, 08:02 AM   #24
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The only complaint I have with the cabrio model is the length of time it takes to complete a wash.
Same with the Maytag, but it does clean well in hardly any water.
Also remember, you'll need to get that line of credit to afford the HE soap.

No really, not long ago Tide HE soap has become a favored shoplifting item.
Tide on the black market? Well you can't say it's a dirty business.

(LA Times)

Thieves seem to be embarking on an anti-grime spree, some media outlets are reporting, saying thousands of dollars in Tide detergent is being swiped from shelves across the country.
One Minnesota man stole about $25,000 worth of the liquid laundry detergent from a West St. Paul Wal-Mart over 15 months, authorities there say. Some stores, including a CVS in Prince George's County, Md., have taken to wrapping anti-theft devices around the handles of the orange bottles
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Old 05-16-2012, 08:05 AM   #25
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Deep breath. You don't want those guys with the black helicopters paying you a visit.

Might I suggest if you're living in the "deep south", that a water conditioner will help remove enough minerals from your water supply to make it easy to do your wash in a couple of gallons of water. The money you save on laundry detergent (and dish detergent, and soap, and shampoo, and on plumbing atherosclerosis) will pay back the cost of the water conditioner.

.
What device are you referring to when you say "water conditioner?"
Water softener??
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Old 05-16-2012, 08:11 AM   #26
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We bought the Whirlpool Cabrio WTW5700X at Lowes. Our daughter liked ours and purchased the same model and we are both satisfied customers.
We also got a Cabrio (7600X) and have had no problems with it. I was not aware that the water use changes were government mandated but despite the start up problems I think it is a sensible. We initially had some problems with early low flow toilet designs too but it settles out. Potable water is a critical resource and subject to the tragedy of the commons. We can probably deal with this directly by cranking up the price per gallon at the water meter but driving the manufacturers to throttle the worst offenders may have a useful role as well.
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Old 05-16-2012, 08:18 AM   #27
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My frontloaders sit on the floor - i.e. no pedestal. We have a counter on top of them. IMO the only reason for the pedestals is to raise the machines to a height where you don't have to bend down as much to load/unload them. But they can sit right on the floor, no problem.
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Old 05-16-2012, 08:29 AM   #28
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We also bought a set of Cabrios. REW is right, there is a learning curve, but it isn't that hard. It's more a matter of dropping old habits.

Two problems so far: 1) a nickle got stuck in the water pump - a perfect fit - and took 4 visits by the repair guy to fix. That is , three visits just to identify the problem, which went away every time he walked in the front door. Who carries a nickel anymore? (not DW). 2) Some idiot (again, not DW) was installing a new cabinet doorknob right above the week old brand new washing machine and dropped it, making a beautiful dent and inch long scratch. The offwhite porcelain finish he (the idiot) used to touch it up contrasts nicely with the lilly white original finish.
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Old 05-16-2012, 08:41 AM   #29
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I bought a front loader a couple of years ago when my 6-year old top loader conked out for about the third time. No pedestal, sits on the floor. I like it just fine. I am just one person and my clothes don't get really dirty as I have a desk job and no grimy hobbies. I think the only complaint I have about the front loader is the inability to throw an errant sock in after the cycle has started.
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Old 05-16-2012, 10:05 AM   #30
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We have a front loader washer and a matching dryer...

I do not like it since almost everything that used to come out without wrinkles are now wrinkled... so when my wife complains about all the ironing.... I remind her that SHE was the one who insisted we buy it...


And the fight begins.....
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Old 05-16-2012, 11:08 PM   #31
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We went to front loading Washer and dryer about 6 years ago and will never go back. We did buy pedestals for them. When we moved to our current house though the utility room was a little small, just room for washer, dryer, sink and freezer.

So the original on one side had the sink and the freezer:



The other side had the washer and dryer with a cabinet above the washer (can't see it in the picture):



We replaced the cultured marble sink and put in a granite countertop going across the left side. We kept the base and upper cabinet and left the counter open under it so we would have a place for our cat litter box. Then we moved the cabinet that had been above the washer (on the other side of the room) so that it is now above the counter:



Then on the other side, we put our freezer and our front load washer and dryer. We got rid of the pedestals and stacked the washer dryer so that we had room for both of them. I had worried a bit about height as I'm only 5'4" and my daughter is only 5' but none of us have any problems with the height. This was all a very inexpensive remodeling job and made the room much more functional. One big advantage of front loaders is being able to stack them:

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Old 05-17-2012, 08:50 AM   #32
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We love our front-loading LG washer and dryer, purchased in 2010. The washer does work differently than the old top loader, so there is an adjustment. To compensate for lower water usage, the wash cycles are considerably longer, sometimes an hour or more. But the spin cycle removes more water, so drying time is much shorter.

Since front-loading washers are sealed, watertight systems, it's recommended to leave the door ajar between loads, to allow moisture to evaporate. This prevents mold. Top-loaders aren't air/watertight, so this isn't a concern with them.
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Old 05-17-2012, 12:21 PM   #33
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Molly,

Feel your pain here. Just spent endless hours on the net plus trips out the suburbs to big box stores and lots of phone calls trying to find a new washer that will fit into a small condo closet. The one line of top-loaders that would work has just been (temporarily ?) discontinued with the distributor thinking it due to the manufacturer needing to meet the new Federal standards. Guess most of the other lines have already been redesigned - for better or for worse, which makes trying to parse through reviews difficult since it's not clear whether they are of "pre" or "post" machines.

Finally spent lots more money than I should have on a compact front loader that I'm told will need to be fed expensive HE soap, carefully toweled out after each use, diligently maintained by draining the pump. Think there may be vinegar wash-cycles periodically needed. (Some of this I'm trying to blank out.) And, of course, wet clothes will have to be removed asap when the cycle is finished. My slovenly days of "forgetting" and even rewashing later before drying alas have come to an end. The final indignity is that it is highly recommended to keep the washer door (and thus the closet door open) to prevent the dreaded mold build-up. The wash area is off the bedroom and so the last thing I see at night and the first in the morning will be my (please, please) otherwise trouble-free washing machine.

Do so hope the pretty chime it makes when the wash cycle is finished is worth it. And the high spin cycle (about 1300 rpm) will be nice ...

I *will* add a surge protector for the electronics. Have had the mother board fried in my incredibly expensive fischer paykel dish drawers (along with $$$ of other needed repairs). Just now finished disassembling to clean out all the crud that builds up in them. Another (dishwasher) first ...

But I still love the dish drawers and am hoping to make peace with the new washing machine. It comes tomorrow.
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Old 05-17-2012, 12:27 PM   #34
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FWIW, we don't towel out our front loader. Don't use vinegar. We do sometimes leave the door open (not all the time) and 6 years later have had no mold problems....
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Old 05-17-2012, 12:35 PM   #35
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Ah excellent. Just saw CitizenK purchased and likes his LG. Here too, I finally went with LG. Any dutiful online research is bound to turn up clunkers that the writer immediately associates with a manufacturer as a whole. What synched it here was a call into our great local appliance repair shop who recommended LG.

Still, another sign that the washer Gods are going to be kind to me with this expensive THING that is one more item that needs fussing over when I'd rather it ignored abuse.
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Old 05-17-2012, 03:46 PM   #36
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Finally spent lots more money than I should have on a compact front loader that I'm told will need to be fed expensive HE soap, carefully toweled out after each use, diligently maintained by draining the pump. Think there may be vinegar wash-cycles periodically needed. (Some of this I'm trying to blank out.) And, of course, wet clothes will have to be removed asap when the cycle is finished. My slovenly days of "forgetting" and even rewashing later before drying alas have come to an end. The final indignity is that it is highly recommended to keep the washer door (and thus the closet door open) to prevent the dreaded mold build-up. The wash area is off the bedroom and so the last thing I see at night and the first in the morning will be my (please, please) otherwise trouble-free washing machine.
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Ah excellent. Just saw CitizenK purchased and likes his LG. Here too, I finally went with LG. Any dutiful online research is bound to turn up clunkers that the writer immediately associates with a manufacturer as a whole. What synched it here was a call into our great local appliance repair shop who recommended LG.

Still, another sign that the washer Gods are going to be kind to me with this expensive THING that is one more item that needs fussing over when I'd rather it ignored abuse.
EveryLady, good luck with your new laundry machines. For what it's worth, my experience is that I was also concerned about the maintenance and different operation when my LG was new. Like you, I had read many forums and reviews, and in my case I think that fed into a little bit of paranoia.

In practice, it's been fine. Here's a few things I've discovered over two years of use.

1) When it's delivered, make sure the washer is precisely leveled and that all feet are firmly on the floor. Otherwise the high spin cycle can vibrate excessively. Ours took a couple tries, but since then it's been rock solid.

2) The HE detergent may be more expensive, but you can use less. The LG manual says to use 1/2 of what is recommended on the detergent bottle. You can use very little and still get very clean clothes.

3) Forgetting a load on occasion won't cause any issues. I've certainly done it, even overnight. Sometimes I rewash it, or not.

4) My washer has a cleaning cycle (the "vinegar" rinse). I've run it once in two years, after a blanket disintegrated in the washer. If you regularly run hot loads and use bleach, I don't think it's that important.

5) I would recommend leaving the door open to let the washer dry out after use. Mine is in a closet too, but in our case the washer door can be left ajar and the closet door shut. After the tub dries out (overnight?) you can shut it until the next use. I sometimes wipe the door seal, which only takes about 15 seconds, but what is really important is letting it air dry.

6) I've read that excessive use of liquid fabric softener in a front load washer can contribute to mold. We don't use it, so it hasn't been an issue. Another argument for dryer sheets?
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Old 05-17-2012, 05:33 PM   #37
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I'm on my second owned front loader, had one in my house, and have one in my condo. I also spent 5 years with front loaders in my old apartment. I love them, because they do not wreck clothes. I even put cashmere sweaters in it on the gentle cyle cold water, and they come out beautiful and soft. My current one is a Kenmore.

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Old 05-18-2012, 12:18 AM   #38
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What device are you referring to when you say "water conditioner?"
Water softener??
Synonyms. An ion-exchange resin in a fiberglas tank, which removes calcium & magnesium from the water via adsorption exchange with sodium ions. (It can also mechanically filter some particulates, and it'll help ferrous chelating agents like Iron Out.) The resin is regenerated (reloaded with sodium) by backflushing with brine. About once a month we reload our outer tank with a 40-pound $5 bag of rock salt.

https://www.google.com/#q=Water+cond...w=1400&bih=792

We have a Kenmore model that's been trouble-free for nearly a decade. We also have an older Ametek model in our rental home that's been chugging away since late 1997. The resin is supposed to "wear out" after 10 years but this one is still going strong.

So anyway, water that's nearly mineral-free doesn't leave mineral deposits around your faucets, toilets, tubs, & showers. It doesn't leave spotting on the walls or the glass doors. You use less surfactants (shampoo, soaps, dishwasher detergents, laundry detergent). Drinking glasses are free of streaks. Your clothes come out cleaner too.
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Old 05-18-2012, 07:09 AM   #39
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...We glanced briefly at front loaders - the height seemed to be largely a function of the expensive pedestal that must be bought for the washer to sit on. That set-up wouldn't fit in our laundry room, unless we removed the laundry cabinets above the washer and dryer. That said, we didn't see any practical advantage to a front-loading washing machine over a top-loader.

Amethyst
You don't have to buy the pedestal. We decided to have ours sit on the floor because the top is a more convenient height to fold clothes on and we saved the cost of the pedestal.
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Old 05-18-2012, 07:14 AM   #40
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...Since front-loading washers are sealed, watertight systems, it's recommended to leave the door ajar between loads, to allow moisture to evaporate. This prevents mold. Top-loaders aren't air/watertight, so this isn't a concern with them.
That is the one thing I hate about our LG front loader because I have to walk by the washer in the utility room to get to my tools. I am afraid that it is just a matter of time before I'm not paying attention to what i am doing and run into the open door and tear it off the hinges and have an expensive repair.
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